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Old 06-26-2012, 08:41 AM   #1
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$1turbo,hit set on flop ,i slowplay for more profit

    IPoker, $1 Buy-in (10/20 blinds) No Limit Hold'em Tournament, 2 Players
    Poker Tools Powered By Holdem Manager - The Ultimate Poker Software Suite. View Hand #13340222

    Hero (BB): 1,180 (59 bb)
    SB: 1,820 (91 bb)

    Preflop: Hero is BB with 7 2
    SB completes, Hero checks

    Flop: (40) 2 A 2 (2 players)
    Hero checks, SB checks

    Turn: (40) 8 (2 players)
    Hero bets 30, SB calls 30

    River: (100) T (2 players)
    Hero bets 75, SB calls 75

    Spoiler:



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    flop:is my slow play on flop right?

    if i bet on flop,when villain have no made hands ,he will directly fold,so i dont have profit at all

    so i decided to slowplay on flop.i want to his hand improve,so that i can make more profit on turn and river

    turn and river:is my betsize ok??
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    Old 06-26-2012, 08:52 AM   #2
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    Re: $1turbo,hit set on flop ,i slowplay for more profit

    First of all this is not a set. Trips on a flop. I would not slowplay it cause pot is so small - youre not gonna build big pot against any hand youre beating, unless opponent has a flush draw, but in this case you have to start betting as soon as possible. I'm just betting 40 on a flop and hope for some draw or some stupid action from my opponent.
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    Old 06-26-2012, 10:25 AM   #3
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    Re: $1turbo,hit set on flop ,i slowplay for more profit

    you played it fine, and you are not slow playing your hand because you give him the opportunity to stab the flop ip imo.

    i would bet the turn slightly less like t25 to keep more floats in and pot the river because once he spiked a 8, T or has some strangely played Ax he isn't folding, and maybe you get hero called by some random hands like low pockets or Kx.

    @ pretorian_st: what do you accomplish by potting the flop?
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    Old 06-26-2012, 11:14 AM   #4
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    Re: $1turbo,hit set on flop ,i slowplay for more profit

    I think ur flop check is fine, he's not going to have much here so we'd rather let him stab.
    I'd either go 20 or 40. 20 induces floats, 40 is max value for hands he's calling either way.. I'd probably bet 20. 30 isn't bad though. I like river size as played
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    Old 06-26-2012, 12:34 PM   #5
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    Re: $1turbo,hit set on flop ,i slowplay for more profit

    Grunch. Did not look at results.

    I'd advise against showing results as it'll skew the replies you get toward the results-oriented.

    Also, not a set, it's trips. It might seem semantical but with a set, it's completely disguised. With trips, not only is the danger completely apparent to villain but they may also hold the case card, giving them trips as well, and possibly a bigger one.

    I don't hate your check on the flop but I'd lean toward betting. While 2x is certainly in his range, the fact that there's only a 2s left in the deck makes this pretty unlikely. So if we assume that villain doesn't have 2x here, this means that what villain holds are two cards that are bigger than 2, obv, so I don't think the board looks that scary.

    Sure, there's an ace but villain limped, I don't see Ax making up almost any part of their range (tho, while rare, some villains do limp their entire range so at worst, Ax makes up a pretty small part of a very, very wide range).

    So I'd say bet here since there's a strong chance you'll be called by 100% of villain's range. The board just doesn't look very threatening to them given the preflop action.

    There's also the issue of the club draw, another reason I lean toward a bet here.

    Turn comes, putting a second flush draw on board. The sizing doesn't seem horrible but what's folding to pot that's going to call 3/4 here? Flush draws aren't with the effective stacks (and implied odds) being as deep as they are. 8x is definitely not folding to a pot-sized bet. Same probably goes for stuff like 43, 54, 53, etc.

    And if they're going to call with air looking to take it down IP OTR, same thing, that extra 10 chips is not going to turn a call into a fold.

    So pot turn, IMO.

    As for the river, your sizing is wrong IMO.

    Now the turn comes the perfect T, completing no draws. The hands that beat you 2x greater than 72, AA, 88, TT are so unlikely so as to be completely ignored. Awesome.

    But you have to consider what villain holds here to make a bet sizing decision. What does villain's range mostly consist of? Draws that didn't make it and janky Kx/Qx/Jx hands, right?

    So I would say bet ~40 OTF to get looked up by all sorts of crap that just can't fold for that small of a bet, as well as Kx/Qx/Jx hands that think they just might be good here and the price is good.

    So room for improvement IMO but in general, well played sir.
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    Old 06-26-2012, 04:31 PM   #6
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    Re: $1turbo,hit set on flop ,i slowplay for more profit

    Quote:
    Hero (BB): 1,180 (59 bb)
    SB: 1,820 (91 bb)
    Surely you have an idea of how villain plays? Does he play aggressively (bets often) or does he play passively (leans towards not bluffing much and just calling).

    I would check the flop. I disagree with quux, villain will not call 100% on the flop if we lead. Villain has nothing here, so it's best to give him a chance to bet or catch something on the turn. FWIW, yes there are 2 clubs on board, but imo a 3rd club is a great card on the turn to get value from. It widens villain's calling range.

    I'd bet any size on the turn, maybe closer to 35 than 20 because most players won't notice the difference in bet sizing and just call 35 with everything they would call 20.

    On the river if villain has Ax, 8x or Tx, it doesn't matter how much we bet, he's calling anyway. I'd bet 85/100 as played. I just want to make sure it's not clear cut we have the nuts, which is why I'd avoid betting pot.

    Last edited by Quimp; 06-26-2012 at 04:44 PM.
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    Old 06-26-2012, 04:35 PM   #7
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    Re: $1turbo,hit set on flop ,i slowplay for more profit

    def c/c the flop, villain will never, ever have a hand otf imo. agree with 3rd club being great ott.
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    Old 06-26-2012, 06:44 PM   #8
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    Re: $1turbo,hit set on flop ,i slowplay for more profit

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Quimp View Post
    Surely you have an idea of how villain plays? Does he play aggressively (bets often) or does he play passively (leans towards not bluffing much and just calling).
    Yeah but 10/20 blinds, this could easily be the second or fifth hand.

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Quimp View Post
    I would check the flop. I disagree with quux, villain will not call 100% on the flop if we lead. Villain has nothing here, so it's best to give him a chance to bet or catch something on the turn.
    I hear you, and I know this is standard wisdom, and I don't even think it's necessarily bad advice, but I play the lowest stakes that Merge offers and I find that I get looked up more and more with my cbets on paired boards.

    I don't stop doing it for an assortment of reasons but I've started to cbet made hands too because you never get put on trips there, ever.

    Now I can see how I could be accused of FPS and outleveling myself, and maybe that has merit, but I don't think that betting paired flops with hands is bad, especially when villain has proclivities to be loose.

    While OP didn't mention villain proclivities, and may not know, I would expect at the $1 stakes that the mistakes they're making are not being too tight. =)
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    Old 06-26-2012, 07:17 PM   #9
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    Re: $1turbo,hit set on flop ,i slowplay for more profit

    True but 1 hand is enough to make some guests and it doesn't need to have gotten to showdown. While it's not going to be a strong read, it's a signal.

    As far as paired boards are concerned, these vary by a good margin. A22 is different from AKK or 557, etc. Just compare the number of reasonable hands that call on these and you'll see how it differs and affects their calling range.

    Also, I would cbet here like 95% of the time, except we're OOP.
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    Old 06-26-2012, 08:06 PM   #10
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    Re: $1turbo,hit set on flop ,i slowplay for more profit

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Crap$hoot View Post
    you played it fine, and you are not slow playing your hand because you give him the opportunity to stab the flop ip imo.

    i would bet the turn slightly less like t25 to keep more floats in and pot the river because once he spiked a 8, T or has some strangely played Ax he isn't folding, and maybe you get hero called by some random hands like low pockets or Kx.

    @ pretorian_st: what do you accomplish by potting the flop?
    thanks for your reply

    but i dont understand some words

    what does stab mean??
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    Old 06-26-2012, 08:32 PM   #11
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    Re: $1turbo,hit set on flop ,i slowplay for more profit

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by quux View Post
    Grunch. Did not look at results.

    I'd advise against showing results as it'll skew the replies you get toward the results-oriented.

    Also, not a set, it's trips. It might seem semantical but with a set, it's completely disguised. With trips, not only is the danger completely apparent to villain but they may also hold the case card, giving them trips as well, and possibly a bigger one.

    I don't hate your check on the flop but I'd lean toward betting. While 2x is certainly in his range, the fact that there's only a 2s left in the deck makes this pretty unlikely. So if we assume that villain doesn't have 2x here, this means that what villain holds are two cards that are bigger than 2, obv, so I don't think the board looks that scary.

    Sure, there's an ace but villain limped, I don't see Ax making up almost any part of their range (tho, while rare, some villains do limp their entire range so at worst, Ax makes up a pretty small part of a very, very wide range).

    So I'd say bet here since there's a strong chance you'll be called by 100% of villain's range. The board just doesn't look very threatening to them given the preflop action.

    There's also the issue of the club draw, another reason I lean toward a bet here.

    Turn comes, putting a second flush draw on board. The sizing doesn't seem horrible but what's folding to pot that's going to call 3/4 here? Flush draws aren't with the effective stacks (and implied odds) being as deep as they are. 8x is definitely not folding to a pot-sized bet. Same probably goes for stuff like 43, 54, 53, etc.

    And if they're going to call with air looking to take it down IP OTR, same thing, that extra 10 chips is not going to turn a call into a fold.

    So pot turn, IMO.

    As for the river, your sizing is wrong IMO.

    Now the turn comes the perfect T, completing no draws. The hands that beat you 2x greater than 72, AA, 88, TT are so unlikely so as to be completely ignored. Awesome.

    But you have to consider what villain holds here to make a bet sizing decision. What does villain's range mostly consist of? Draws that didn't make it and janky Kx/Qx/Jx hands, right?

    So I would say bet ~40 OTF to get looked up by all sorts of crap that just can't fold for that small of a bet, as well as Kx/Qx/Jx hands that think they just might be good here and the price is good.

    So room for improvement IMO but in general, well played sir.
    Thank you for your patience to answer!!

    but i dont understand some words:

    1. the case card

    2.Ax makes up a pretty small part of a very, very wide range

    3. I would say bet ~40 OTF to get looked up by all sorts of crap that just can't fold for that small of a bet
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    Old 06-26-2012, 08:37 PM   #12
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    Re: $1turbo,hit set on flop ,i slowplay for more profit

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by yay View Post
    def c/c the flop, villain will never, ever have a hand otf imo. agree with 3rd club being great ott.
    thanks for your reply

    i dont understand some Abbreviation:

    1.def

    2.otf

    3.ott
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    Old 06-27-2012, 01:14 AM   #13
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    Re: $1turbo,hit set on flop ,i slowplay for more profit

    def = definitely
    otf / ott = on the flop / turn
    case card = the only card remaining in the deck, all others are visible - in this hand the 2 of spades
    Ax = Any Ace, e.g. A2, A3, A4 ... -> AK
    stab = make a minimum bet - a common line in position is the limp/stab, e.g. complete the small blind (limp) opponent checks his big blind, then checks to you on the flop. you make a minimum bet with any two cards (ATC), 20 into 40 for example, opponent folds.


    Just a note, please lessen the amount of hands posted at once - the front page of this forum is currently almost nothing but your threads No big deal, but in the future try and keep it to maybe 3 per day. That way they will get more discussion.
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    Old 06-27-2012, 07:43 AM   #14
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    Re: $1turbo,hit set on flop ,i slowplay for more profit

    Quote:
    @ pretorian_st: what do you accomplish by potting the flop?
    This is 1 USD turbo. I hope for some clear mistake here - float with total air, or some draw. If opponents is tight he is not gonna pay u too much even if he hits, unless he is beating u. If he has some float tendencies just start betting as soon as possible and hope he is catching some piece of the board. Still might be some Ax... If you check and third club falls you re not even able to make him pay for some flush draw. Will you overbet the pot?
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    Old 06-27-2012, 08:36 AM   #15
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    Re: $1turbo,hit set on flop ,i slowplay for more profit

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by _dave_ View Post
    def = definitely
    otf / ott = on the flop / turn
    case card = the only card remaining in the deck, all others are visible - in this hand the 2 of spades
    Ax = Any Ace, e.g. A2, A3, A4 ... -> AK
    stab = make a minimum bet - a common line in position is the limp/stab, e.g. complete the small blind (limp) opponent checks his big blind, then checks to you on the flop. you make a minimum bet with any two cards (ATC), 20 into 40 for example, opponent folds.


    Just a note, please lessen the amount of hands posted at once - the front page of this forum is currently almost nothing but your threads No big deal, but in the future try and keep it to maybe 3 per day. That way they will get more discussion.

    Thank you for your reminder
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