WSOP.com Tournament #346749 $18 + $0.90 (Knockout)
$1,500/$3,000 (300 ante)
Final Table -- 3 left

Hero: SB ($100,892 )
Villain #1 BB Spiral123( $77,247 )
Villain: #2 BTN flipflopdoc ( $77,861 )

Dealt to Hero [ As, Kh ]
flipflopdoc raises [$6,000]
Hero raises [$10,500]
spiral123 folds
flipflopdoc calls [$6,000]

** Dealing flop ** [ 2c, Qd, 3s ]

Hero bets [$12,000]
flipflopdoc raises [$65,561]
Hero: ???


Don't see a lot of threads about short-handed play. Final table here, pay levels are 180/255/410. We have been three-handed for about 30 hands. I'm still the big stack and have been the whole time, but have not been able to significantly change the chip stacks. I've had AK three times and each time other two folded to me on BB.

Here, with AK, I 3-bet pre to 10,500. On queen high flop I lead out for 12,000 and villain shoves all in.

Question 1 is whether the lead-out after the flop here is a good strategy, or should i just check and see whether villain fires? He has been prone to folding 3-bets at the final table, so his call of my 3-bet pre shows strength. Otherwise no real reads on villain and no stats.

Question 2 is whether to call the all-in. I have him covered, so it's not for my tourney life, but it certainly changes the dynamics of the table substantially - either way.

i would b/f 8500-9000 on the flop. flop is dry enough that a bet of 33-40% of pot should be sufficient.

as played, i'm folding...

I would 3b bigger, especially since we're oop, about 13ish and c-bet smaller on a flop like this being so dry, like 1/3 as played fold.

Looks fine, OP.

I folded, but i agree that the c-bet didn't need to be that large, not that it made a big difference with the stack sizes. The larger question is, as a matter of short-handed strategy, do I want to be shoving pre after the initial raise or, as I did, should I be 3-betting to limit villain's range and with some prospect of inducing a fold? There are so few cards in play 3-handed that AK is more of a monster than normal.

He didn't show his cards, but said he had a queen, which I believe. Just thinking about whether there is any better way to play this at final table. thanks for the comments.

If he is going to flat the 3bet a lot, then IMO it is fine to just push.

Pretty lazy approach to take. Make it 15000 pre though, I really really really hate a 2x 3bet.

a rip is not good pre

i do not like your sizing however bc you should be 3betting this spot so wide that it is ok for villain to flat almost his entire opening range IP to this sizing-- he really should not be folding anything except for his pure steals. i go around 14,400

flop sizing is fine as played, fold now since he has all the queens in his range and because he should not have many semi bluffs on this texture

I'd have gone bigger pre and as played, a bit smaller on the flop but the I agree with the line.

Could one of you expand on why it's bad to shove this pre?

Is flatting ever an option?

It's not bad to shove pre, but short-handed we'd like to have the option of 3Betting smaller with a wide range of hands.

If we have a 3Bet small range and a 3Bet shove range, this will be quite difficult to keep balanced well and is only likely going to get action from the top of villain's range.

You may jam pre, but you would have to balance the range you are doing that with.. especially on short handed play where the sample is bigger as we get to the same spot a lot of times, ppl will notice and exploit if you are unbalanced there...

I prefer to keep my stronger and weaker ranges w/ a 3-bet, instead of shoving.. seems a little less variance style...

+1 to above two posts

The arguments against shoving preflop are pretty convincing, though I would choose to shove regularly depending on dynamics and opponents.
In any case, I hate the3-bet sizing though! If it's the first time you do that, villain might, eventually, think you have the nuts. But in general, it just gives him awesome odds for a pot in position.
The sizing flop might be a little big.
As played, I fold to the shove. If you've been aggro before, villain might take a stand, but I would let him have that one regardless.

Appreciate the input. Question about the 3-bet sizing.

I had been keeping a pretty consistent 2x raise line throughout later stages of tourney and throughout final table. I had been doing very little 3-betting, mainly because of lack of good spots, but this is certainly one.

With the stack sizes involved here, is there really a big difference between 10K and 14K 3-bet?

Post flop, is this an automatic c-bet lead out, and just sigh and fold to the return shove b/c villain caught the queen? I can't see checking the flop, right?

it's not only about stack sizes it's about the pot size and yes, there's a significant difference. flop bet is in no way mandatory, actually, betting this flop with QQ-AA would be kinda ******ed imo

I mean with AK here -- mandatory c-bet, or is there any argument to check?

Agree to 3b bigger when OOP.

There might be but it would depend on your opponents. You'd have to give some info on them.

With the stack sizes involved here, is there really a big difference between 10K and 14K 3-bet?

It may be a little transparent, but aren't we to 3b a little larger when out of position?

Also, I think there is a difference in that when your opponent doesn't hit tptk and you CB, that amount will now be bigger due to there being a bigger pot pre - and because you have him covered (as well as other considerations Villain must assess), I think you'd either see a. a fold, or b. a raise to that CB - and both results give you your answer (a. you win - b. you're losing and can confidently fold).

This same sequence may play out the same with the smaller pf 3b, but the larger pf move may help to define what your action is after the CB.

Oh, and I'd make it like 16k pre - build the pot in case you do hit and decide to take a more passive line than you would on a wiff

Thanks, 81. There are so few opportunities to play 3-handed that it's sometimes hard to adjust, but I agree that larger bet sizing early here would have been better. I'll still lose to his queen, but I can manage the hand better.

Agreed that playing really short handed is a rare opportunity. Let's hope for as many as possible

I remember watching an event that (I'm going to butcher the spelling here) Olivia Busquiet was commenting on - and he was saying how important it is to hone your 4 handed, 3 handed and heads-up craft because the pay differences from 4th to 3rd, 3rd to 2nd, and especially 2nd to 1st can be as much as double from one spot to the other. Because I live in MN, I can't hop online and play heads-up etc, so I wonder if there are any simulation programs that anyone might suggest trying that can help build experience in closing out tournies when this deep? I'll ask around and make a post to see and will PM you, KGC if I get any replies.

If you're a fan of watching the WPT (semi-spoiler alert warning if you DVR), once down to 4 handed - Jimmy Carroll, Shaun Suller, Mukul Pahuja and Dylan Wilkerson make some really interesting plays and there are some educational spots worth checking out IMO. Just passing along.

Oh - and just cuz I hate to spell a guy's name wrong - Olivier Busquet - there, I feel better.