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set of aces facing an overshove on river set of aces facing an overshove on river

10-24-2014 , 02:43 PM
Interested in your thoughts about flop and river play. On flop I decide to 3bet when he check/raises : I am hoping to be set over set but knowing that he is going to call with a flush draw anyway that i don't want to give a free card too (probably just a flat on a rainbow flow).

I misclicked and sizing is too small as i wanted to raise bigger.

As played the turn is a scare card and i plan to cb and call most blank rivers bet or b/f if checked to me. But what to do when he jams ?

PokerStars - $15+$1.50|20/40 NL (6 max) - Holdem - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

Hero (CO): 71.13 BB
BTN: 70.88 BB (VPIP: 16.28, PFR: 11.82, 3Bet Preflop: 4.00, Hands: 304)
SB: 69.43 BB (VPIP: 17.65, PFR: 17.65, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 17)
BB: 75 BB (VPIP: 27.27, PFR: 18.18, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 11)
UTG: 87 BB (VPIP: 20.00, PFR: 16.92, 3Bet Preflop: 10.00, Hands: 69)
MP: 75 BB (VPIP: 10.00, PFR: 14.29, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 10)

SB posts SB 0.5 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 1.5 BB) Hero has A A

fold, fold, Hero raises to 3 BB, fold, fold, BB calls 2 BB

Flop: (6.5 BB, 2 players) 9 A 2
BB checks, Hero bets 3 BB, BB raises to 8 BB, Hero raises to 13 BB, BB calls 5 BB

Turn: (32.5 BB, 2 players) Q
BB checks, Hero checks

River: (32.5 BB, 2 players) K
BB bets 59 BB and is all-in, fold

Spoiler:
BB wins 32.5 BB
set of aces facing an overshove on river Quote
10-24-2014 , 02:58 PM
wp, it's not midstakes tho
set of aces facing an overshove on river Quote
10-24-2014 , 03:23 PM
You can definitely work on flop sizing. For what it's worth, yes we want value from worse hands, but we don't want to let him realise his flush draw equity. I get you want to induce, but 13bb isn't the way to do it.
set of aces facing an overshove on river Quote
10-24-2014 , 03:40 PM
Yeah.. not many bluffs or worst value hands in his range otr he shoves with... probably a good fold otr.

I would certainly raise more otf (I know you said it was a misclick).

Im not sure, but I could make a case to bet the turn... when you cb this turn your range gets too faced up, and a good player will exploit that. I think when you cb ott you are just trying to realize your equity to fill up for free (which is ok), but I dont expect V to bet worst even on blank rivers, especially when you block aces...
set of aces facing an overshove on river Quote
10-24-2014 , 06:52 PM
Flop is pretty dry, i'd flat on his c/r.
As played, bet the turn.
set of aces facing an overshove on river Quote
10-24-2014 , 07:27 PM
Think your flop 3-bet sizing is way too small.

Like turn check. River seems like easy fold. Particularly at this stakes I would not expect an overbet bluff. A flush is consistent with the flop play.
set of aces facing an overshove on river Quote
10-25-2014 , 07:29 AM
he said he missclicked flop guys
set of aces facing an overshove on river Quote
10-25-2014 , 08:33 AM
flop is bad
set of aces facing an overshove on river Quote
10-25-2014 , 08:34 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alexo
he said he missclicked flop guys
True, although we should be discussing flop sizing in truth or whether that is better than flat.
set of aces facing an overshove on river Quote
10-25-2014 , 01:24 PM
Yes we all agree flop is bad.

I think the correct sizing for a flop 3bet would be around 23-25bb.

This leaves him some perceived fold equity if he shoves, but leaves me in a weird spot if he flats and a spade hits (with a SPR of 1 I don't think we can ever fold the hand on the turn/river).

When I think about it again I think I prefer flat the c/r with the following plan:
on non-spade turns, raise/gii
on spade turns, call turn bet and decide on the river (possibly folding if he bombs and we don't fill up).

This way we still get full value vs sets most of the time and can play IP vs his FD : I think he's going to slow down when the flush card hits after I've called the c/r so I' not too worried about getting bluffed by lower sets/2p hands on turn+river.
set of aces facing an overshove on river Quote
10-25-2014 , 08:15 PM
Why 3bet flop ? FDs have like 15% turn, value hands gonna bet wathever is the turn, he has plenty of air that gonna fold vs the 3bet.
set of aces facing an overshove on river Quote
10-25-2014 , 09:45 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Voodoo974
Why 3bet flop ? FDs have like 15% turn, value hands gonna bet wathever is the turn, he has plenty of air that gonna fold vs the 3bet.
For value, most of his range is draws and big made hands that are not folding to a 3-bet. You are way ahead of anything, so you want to build the pot. He isn't c/r bluffing this flop much, and he isn't likely to put in that much more with air if you flat call. IMO, not 3-betting this flop is bad.
set of aces facing an overshove on river Quote
10-26-2014 , 04:48 PM
OP 3-bet the flop and checked the turn. What could he be 3-betting? Likely he has a set or strong draw. The turn check looks like pot control with a set or low flush. Villain overshoves hoping OP can't fold. Villain has the nut flush almost always. A bluff is unlikely.

As mentioned, flatting the flop raise is just terrible. Villain isn't likely making elaborate plays with air, BB versus ep raiser, on an ace-high suited flop.
set of aces facing an overshove on river Quote
10-27-2014 , 10:53 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by betgo
OP 3-bet the flop and checked the turn. What could he be 3-betting? Likely he has a set or strong draw. The turn check looks like pot control with a set or low flush. Villain overshoves hoping OP can't fold. Villain has the nut flush almost always. A bluff is unlikely.

As mentioned, flatting the flop raise is just terrible. Villain isn't likely making elaborate plays with air, BB versus ep raiser, on an ace-high suited flop.
It's not terrible, it provides protection to our call down range.
set of aces facing an overshove on river Quote
10-27-2014 , 11:52 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by gregz41
It's not terrible, it provides protection to our call down range.
Lol. We are playing online and everyone will be aware that we flat call sets here?
set of aces facing an overshove on river Quote
10-27-2014 , 12:21 PM
No, but if you are getting check raised frequently, and subsequently facing barrels on the turn and river, then having a hand that can always draw to the nuts is going to be beneficial to our range rather than solely having top pair.
set of aces facing an overshove on river Quote
10-27-2014 , 01:04 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by gregz41
No, but if you are getting check raised frequently, and subsequently facing barrels on the turn and river, then having a hand that can always draw to the nuts is going to be beneficial to our range rather than solely having top pair.
But how do are opponents know what our range is?
set of aces facing an overshove on river Quote

      
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