Oh
No you didn't mistype, i misread. Check jam turn has to be best against a range aware opponent given stack sizes and for balance. Agree with that. I think this v is capable of turning a wide range into a bluff ott.

But with his check out of turn imo we need to charge his club draws and newly found straight draws qx jx 7x 6x far more than 7k. That's the point user was making.

Guess you don`t have enough bluffs (although I`m aware you don`t need much) and blocking 2 aces is an issue actually bc you block his highest freq bluffcatchers (guess it depends if we like to have Ac here or not -- have they limped UTG?).
I think you can shove 99,TT and QJ+ for value.

yeah the blockers certainly play a huge part here, but see ranges he gets to the river with in my post above and we're at 26% otr vv his likely crycall range. if he crycalls that range and we can never c/f then ofc it's a jam for value.

however, one other thought. if he's capable of doing something horribad like checking back QJ because the flush hits the river then river should be a c/c. never a c/f though with his several aggressive/unsuccessful post plays previous to this hand.

I haven`t yet but wat?

Elaboration on post-oak, only a bit more evolved.

Basically, size betting so you fold out a split merged range (some hands you don't want folding need to fold, some hands you don't want calling should call) [HSNL went on fire about this for about a year, say 4-5 years deep in the past?]

If it's 26%, then 3/8-2/5 pot might be optimal. Seems weird to just invert percentages but maybe the harmonics of blockbetting rivers are actually that simple.

The trouble is it takes a lot of showdowns to equalize and your +cEV against a certain opponent might not come about for many, many hands. However, against a certain defined mean opponent with a slightly offset-GTO range, you will intuitively find natural +cEV gains.

Better a bettor than a checker is the premise here, even in -equity situations.

nvm
but I think its a bit optimistic range

we`ll have to check some portion of our range anyway.

i mean there's a bunch of combos of straight draws that will prob call a bet but might not bet themselves...seems like a lot of stuff from two players that will be harder to get value from later...think we want to control the betting with such a strong hand and use other hands to x/c vs. aggro IP opponents. would be different scenario on dryer board fwiw, AT9r I would prob check.

i put some thought into that range for said. seemed v sticky

i dont think u can range him with TT and 99 since he limped pre(overlimped??) and didnt raise any street on a wetish board

id guess he never got 99/TT here otr

hate to agree with betgo but river seems like a c/f default

Yes. Harmonics matter.