For sure, my total f-up. I was kicking myself for checking that river. Only defense was this was the same villain who I earlier c/r and jammed river and was hoping he was done with my nonsense and would try to take me off the hand with his Ax/2p.

Call y raise on turn if someone shoves u gotta fold. Just call

nah id think hed call alot more hands than hed bet with. mostly just Ax.

idk how to quote with the edit in it

3 bet preflop please , its much easier to play it post flop if you 3 bet pre and hes made a 2x at this level , you really should be 3 betting

There seems to be a split on the decision pre. I called because I have position and a hand that has great equity against most ranges. If I 3bet and get 4bet, I have to fold and release all that equity.

During my decision pre, I decided that if I flopped the NFD with 2 overs I'd raise any bettor. But when a competent player donked out into 6 villains, and a TAG raised him, it folded to me and I was like WTF?!? What turns are good for me? Ace? Queen? Club is obvious, but who is paying me off when the club falls? It's like there are no implied odds at this point, tons of RIO (KK AK QQ sets).

i mean AQs does great against a single range or two but doesnt do great against 7.

I completely understand your rationale to flat , what i'm saying is that with him making that raise for 2x , its easy to lose sense of the real strength of your hand . Just because he has been a tag does not mean he has Aces . To assume without testing the waters with a 3 bet would mean we play post flop without a real sense of the strength of our hand in this spot . I think we can still find lines to extract value post flop either way . As to your question about what cards would be good for you on the turn , without 3 betting pre flop you'd have to assume that either of those cards on the turn would be a good card for you . I think we can flat this pre sometimes but against this tag i'd much rather 3 bet and find out if hes holding something like 88 AJ or hes making it 2x to induce , I know lots of people would prefer to flat pre but i think in position you should be 3 betting the hands you play either way , widening your 3 bet range in position . My feel is that this gives us the best idea of the villain's hand strength , which having a skill edge allows us to maximize the value we would want to get , rather than flat and get stuck in a strange spot post and be really confused if a Q or A drops on the turn .


As played i like the flat call , since you've not 3 bet its probably best to maintain some pot control 3 way and make the flat call . As played I am looking to get it in on the turn and probably shoving any queen but checking/calling any Ace on the turn .

...calls the 2k.

Turn 9000, Ts 8c 7c Js

V2 bets 5000, V1 tank folds, it's back on hero who has 29k behind...

At this point I thought V1 just folded his overpair, and V2 either just got there with his 9x hand or less likely has a set (as I could have 9x in my float range, I think he leads out a set less than 100%).

I have 14 clean out to 9x.

Begrudgingly call. Do stuff on river. Jam alot if he gives up and acts disgusted if a spade comes or board pairs.

This hand is like an interactive lesson why we should 3b pre.

Texas Chuck: fold turn. Possibly fold flop to avoid having to fold turn alot.

Odds>Potodds -> calling w/o any grudge.

Are they? I can't stove it. Idk what 14 outs is. 30%? Either way its still a huge bet to call off to draw even with correct odds.

14 outs is 30%. I debated a little, thought 5k was too much to call, and that there's no way I was getting paid off if the 9 or club hit, so I got my gambol on and shoved. 30% chance at a 70k stack in level 4 felt sexy

He's betting so hard on the turn that I doubt he's ever c/f a river you miss. I like the jam because I think there has to be some fe from his sets when you're jamming 23k more, and if not you're still 30% to hit the nuts.

shoving makes no sense. very unlikely he's folding.