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Old 06-04-2012, 05:01 PM   #1
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[15€ 1R/1A] JTs, turn decision

Vilain is playing 17/10, haven't seen him do anything too out of line.

[converted_hand][hand_history]Poker Stars, $15 Buy-in (300/600 blinds, 70 ante) No Limit Hold'em Tournament, 7 Players
Poker Tools Powered By Holdem Manager - The Ultimate Poker Software Suite. View Hand #13065001

SB: 21,387 (35.6 bb)
Hero (BB): 52,303 (87.2 bb)
MP1: 20,914 (34.9 bb)
MP2: 22,371 (37.3 bb)
MP3: 5,819 (9.7 bb)
CO: 8,076 (13.5 bb)
BTN: 9,469 (15.8 bb)

Preflop: Hero is BB with T J
MP1 folds, MP2 raises to 1,332, 4 folds, Hero calls 732

Flop: (3,454) T 3 8 (2 players)
Hero checks, MP2 bets 2,659, Hero calls 2,659

Turn: (8,772) 9 (2 players)
Hero checks, MP2 bets 4,210, Hero?

I can see reasons for folding, calling or shoving here.
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Old 06-05-2012, 07:25 AM   #2
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Re: [15€ 1R/1A] JTs, turn decision

what is your plan calling on flop?
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Old 06-05-2012, 07:55 AM   #3
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Re: [15€ 1R/1A] JTs, turn decision

Blaah sucky spot..
I may like a 3b/f pre, but that's preference.
As played, I'm fine with calling flop, but you have to know there are tons of cards that are sooooo bad for your hand. The 9 is actualy pretty good for us. What do you think villains range is?
Is he c-betting always, or he actually has a hand here according to you?
Notice also sizing of villain. This big i'm inclined to just c/f..
Don't like C/raising because when we are called or reraised we have gross decisions with a hand that has decent showdownvalue (we still have toppair).

As played flop, I'm unsure what to do on turn. With his doublebarrel we are just drawing to a straight and I don't think our T is good. Again, even if we hit the straight with a club or spade, we might not even have the best hand, so I would fold here again. Villain put already 30% of his stack in it, so I don't think he is light here.

My play: 3b pre--> b/f flop on this board


I was thinking this through so much, that my argumentation and play here can be totally off and uberbad.. Apologies
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Old 06-05-2012, 09:40 AM   #4
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Re: [15€ 1R/1A] JTs, turn decision

Pre is fine.

Flop is debatable. I think c/r is a more aggro (but not necessarily better) line, but whatever, wasn't the question.

OTT, as played, I hope folding isn't part of your thought process. You've got top pair and an OESD. Your image in your opponents eyes is weak as you've at this point gone call/call/check, so we can't give him much credit in position for having a hand. It's time to drop the hammer and CRAI. We'll disallow any As from hitting a better hand, flush draws too, will perhaps get folds from TP better kicker hands, and might get called by some drawing hand or something.
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Old 06-05-2012, 09:59 AM   #5
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Re: [15€ 1R/1A] JTs, turn decision

c/f turn

Last edited by PSUStudent; 06-05-2012 at 10:05 AM.
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Old 06-05-2012, 12:42 PM   #6
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Re: [15€ 1R/1A] JTs, turn decision

c/c^3
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Old 06-06-2012, 04:26 AM   #7
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Re: [15€ 1R/1A] JTs, turn decision

pretty ugly board for him to b/c overpairs (and even if he does we do okish). jam > call on turn with these stacks imo. if he is a drooler you can call and jam river when you improve since he prolly will station off with one pair type of hands.
if i play my A-game and can soulread strength into this cbetsizing i'd just fold.
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Old 06-06-2012, 04:42 AM   #8
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Don't like flop play, but since that's how you did it I might donk the turn. If he does anything stupid, you can suspect over pair.
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Old 06-06-2012, 05:59 AM   #9
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Re: [15€ 1R/1A] JTs, turn decision

I think check-raising flop is overplaying/turning our hand into a bluff, no?

If we check/jam turn when villain puts in 4K, leaving himself 14K behind, do we ever have enough fold-equity?
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Old 06-06-2012, 06:34 AM   #10
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Re: [15€ 1R/1A] JTs, turn decision

Pretty ugly spot. I think I c/c here again. Kinda disagree with furo here that he'll b/f overpais on such a drawy board, so jam is no good here imo.u could also bluff a bunch of club rivers
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Old 06-06-2012, 07:10 AM   #11
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Re: [15€ 1R/1A] JTs, turn decision

most players will c/c a hand like JT(pair+draw) and fold worse made hands w/o equity.
a 17/10 likely knows this, and he choses a sizing that allows to b/f.
if i'm him and had QQ+ i'd b/f one pair hands vs most villains on turn, and i'd chose a sizing that allows him to c/c weaker hands than my overpairs.
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