These days it seems nearly impossible to build up the roll capable of playing 200+

People who get tons of respect around here, like BK, Trypt, no longer occupy these games (not trying to slight, just stating) mainly just to avoid the variance? You hear "its all about the BBs don't worry about the money" but at the nosebleeds it truly does affect a lot of people. why is this? how does hopp do it? the games are generally extremely tough and dunno what % someone like me is +EV in and when it is, its only becasue i have a jesus seat on the "fish". even so my edge is so slim that the variance is gonna be through the roof.

how many have been at the top for periods of more than a year or 2? schneids stick and otter?

personally i am retired from 200 because i can't beat these ****ing mad genius-bots.


Absolute Poker $100.00/$200.00 Limit Hold'em - 6 players
2+2 Hand Converter Powered By DeucesCracked

Pre Flop: (1.5 SB) Hero is SB with K 9
2 folds, Villain raises, 1 fold, Hero 3-bets, LOOKOIL calls, Villain calls

Flop: (9 SB) K J 6 (3 players)
Hero bets, LOOKOIL raises, Villain folds, Hero 3-bets, LOOKOIL calls

Turn: (7.5 BB) J (2 players)
Hero bets, LOOKOIL raises, Hero calls

River: (11.5 BB) 9 (2 players)
Hero checks, LOOKOIL checks

Final Pot: 11.5 BB
Hero shows K 9
LOOKOIL shows 2 2
(Rake: $3.00)

in b4 first.

Stick's hands are always funny because at first you're like "wtf what a fish", and then you're like, "oh, yeah, I guess I kind of see how that could work". That's 90% of the hands, anyway. The other 10% are just impossible. And that's why he crushes, people know he's capable of taking so many weird lines that he can level them into doing stuff he wants them to do.

To answer your question I don't think it's much more difficult than that some of us like to gamble higher than others. I'd planned to play 50k hands of midstakes, got about 10k in (3 whole days or something) and then said **** it and played 200 and 500.

As far as "staying power", I think it's simply just a combo of skill, gamble, discipline, and running good.

Now that I'm running on the back asswards side of variance and feel like LHE is impossible, I pretty much think that it is like 80% who runs hot in their first however many hands when they step up to the new level. If they step up and run well and essentially "build" their roll for it while beginning it, then they get to stick around. Having gotten pretty humbled the last 3-4ish months with my largest BB downswing yet in 6max games, I've gotten to see a whole new perspective in which I'll admit that happened to me my first like 40k hands of 2/4 when I ran at like 3bb/100 and thought I was god. And a guy like Otter (who plays great no doubt) gets to play 2/4+ forever now because he's ran insane in 3/6 to 10/20 games on ftp (referencing his -bb/100, +1M FTP ptr). Staying power comes down to that good luck early on, and then the ability to not tilt and minimize losses and quit games when they get bad and/or you're getting shelled in them and have an image that doesn't let you get away with things you'd otherwise be able to do if you were doing well in the game. And then a little bit of gamble and the willingness to risk a little bit when the rare super +EV situations come around, yet still maintaining discplined bankroll management so you don't entirely take yourself out of the ability to play games near the upper echelon of your bank roll (a reason why I tend to limit myself to not having more than 3/6 or 4/8 of myself even if it were to be an incredible 10/20 and a great "opportunity" to really build a huge win with some run-good)... I know if I had ran like this in my first 2/4 shots, it'd be a totally different game for me and I really don't think I'm substantially better or worse of a player now versus than (in fact I'd say I'm a slightly better player now than when I first started on stars 2/4.)

edit--oh and plus i think it's a different game now than back then. Back then I could play in literally any 2/4 game and know "well if i happen to take a big losing streak, there's great 1/2 games, and great 50 games... i can rebuild in no time." Today, you lose 50k in two 2/4 sessions, a good 2/4 game doesn't go again for 2-8 weeks, and meanwhile you're stuck grinding these mediocrish 50 games and probably a little tilted over the fact it's going to take forever to win back that 50k. It's just a different environment that will definitely make it more difficult for someone to get to 2/4, and then stay there. You have to be both a good player, and run pretty sick, to get to.

Just my jaded take at the moment

yeah I agree with Mr Schneids. Although apparently whatever st1ck does apparently puts him on some kind of higher level so maybe he's the exception.

Strongly agree with Schneids, sorry to hear you are running bad

To possibly respond more directly to thorleif's question about how do some people do it, and DrElo's reply - speaking as an old man (26) in LHE, its all about what your responsibilities are. Poker was just another video game for me too until I needed money to pay bills and buy a house and stuff, then it was a bit like working. Turns out those dollars in the PokerStars account can be cashed out and used to buy goods and services in the real world, who knew?

Wait, does this mean it's possible that I don't suck?

C'mon now, don't go jumping to such drastic conclusions based on a schnpost.

Yeah being successful at HS poker is all about being a super-nitty game selector, which St1ck is and I am not. Playing in games that you are even marginally ev in is a recipe for disaster if you want to live a balla lifestyle. The best poker players in the world will suck it up and play lower limits at higher volume where their edge is greater and only play in really good high stakes games. Unfortunately those rarely occur, so the mid-stakes grinders are the ones living a balla stress free lifestyle, imho.

GTFO

So why all the hate for us bumhunters? If this is clearly the best way to make money and live stress free?

a lot of people don't play for money. They play for ego and the thrill of running hot with a small edge.

While this may be true it doesn't answer my question.

because people want to validate their existence and see bumhunting as playing on easy mode.

Pretty much what Nina's saying.

I'd say ego + degeneracy = "hate", although I think this is the wrong term because I'm like the poster boy for this and even I don't HATE bumhunters, it just that bumhunting seems lame and kinda cowardly. It's stupid, I know, but those are the psychological underpinnings of this phenomenon.