Bodog Bots - Page 9 - High Stakes Poker Forum

TheArtOfWar · 02-14-2010, 06:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ace_frehly

Just curious what people think of two players:
1) SHIPITFISH
2) OXYMAN

I have played them only 4-6 handed and they almost exclusively play heads up. During the day they are constantly sitting at heads up tables. But what really struck me as odd was the way they played. They were generally far too aggressive preflop and took hands too far postflop (ie rarely giving up before the river). These two tendencies seemed consistent with a bot who was mainly programmed to play heads up. I really don't mind them because they were playing poorly in the games I have seen them (small samples to be fair).

But the other thing that struck me about both of these players was the amount of time it took to make their decisions. Oxyman's were instant. I mean he called so fast that I had barely pressed my bet button before his call went in. So fast that it didn't even seem like a human could press the button so fast. Also he never took anytime at all to make a decision. Which struck me as robot like.

I actually have no problem playing these two guys because there were absolutely terrible in the 6 max games, and it almost kinda seemed like they were given a trial run in both games that I saw them in the multiway games, and they were terrible and removed 60-100 hands later. But oddly these players constantly are crushing the heads up limit games.

I could be way off. I have no concrete evidence to support my suspicions other than the general feeling you have when you are playing other humans, and them lacking these characteristics. You can see humans thinking. Or hesitating. And you can see them planning in their pauses. Or hesitating because the nightmare card just came. These players had no human like pauses. Every decision came way too fast. It seemed painfully obvious.

But until the bots can be programmed to play 6 handed appropriately I have no problem with them and just won't play them 3 handed or less.

Have chatted w both of them and don't think either is a bot. The witchhunt factor of this thread is hampering the overall cause rather significantly. If we could please just keep it to closing down Apol and hothand that would be great. Thanks a lot. Oh yeah Justin please forward this to the decision makers! KTHX

TheArtOfWar · 02-14-2010, 06:35 AM

Also FWIW a lot of the HU specialists are horrific in 6max games...nothing new. Odie ftw.

___1___ · 02-14-2010, 02:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheArtOfWar

Have chatted w both of them and don't think either is a bot. The witchhunt factor of this thread is hampering the overall cause rather significantly. If we could please just keep it to closing down Apol and hothand that would be great. Thanks a lot. Oh yeah Justin please forward this to the decision makers! KTHX

A player chatting doesn't make it any more or less likely they're a bot. Sometimes the users are around and sometimes they aren't. In fact, they will probably be around much less now that the glitch is fixed. As far as those two players mentioned, I haven't looked at either.

Where is the witchhunt factor in this thread? A poster had a concern about a couple players and brought those concerns forward. I don't see a problem with that at all.

Why would you want to close down two bots and not worry about any others? How does that make sense at all?

operaman · 02-14-2010, 02:45 PM

oxyman and shipitfish were habitual trash talkers and i think it unlikely they are bots. In fact it was amazing that oxyman kept his chat rights.

How do we know the players we are talking about are not props by the way?

1) props may be required to sit and play at tables. So not allowing a player to
take advantage of the button glitch may be problematic.

2) They would not be allowed to play against each other in certain situations.

One thing i do think is puzzling is the frequency that haohao, apol , hothandjules, oxyman, and shipitfish play at the site. the amount of hours they put in is tremendous. Just random thoughts on my end.

For this thread to have any merit we have to start talking about some hard evidence. I feel it is incumbent on the op to provide what evidence he has. He is accusing players of something serious and it seems unfair to do that without providing something other than his word. Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence imho.

You don't have to provide this information via this forum, you could give your evidence to a trusted poster on this site so they could verify the validity of your claims. Say for instance one of the mods.

___1___ · 02-14-2010, 04:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by operaman

For this thread to have any merit we have to start talking about some hard evidence. I feel it is incumbent on the op to provide what evidence he has. He is accusing players of something serious and it seems unfair to do that without providing something other than his word. Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence imho.

You don't have to provide this information via this forum, you could give your evidence to a trusted poster on this site so they could verify the validity of your claims. Say for instance one of the mods.

Hard evidence? It should be understood that anyone making claims that others are bots are basing it on circumstantial evidence. Sites (or anyone directly related to botting activity) are the only ones who can provide anything more than circumstantial evidence.

The only people who can verify claims of botting are sites with specific capabilities. Unfortunately, those sites are few and far between.

The only difference (regarding identifying bots) between myself and anyone else with internet access is knowing what to look for (at least as far a Bodog goes).

Ace_frehly · 02-14-2010, 05:40 PM

I have not made any accusations at all. This is not a witch hunt. I simply stated something that struck me as fishy. I acknowledged that I had no hard evidence. Chatting doesn't really indicate much. Just means the user is there.

But I invite anyone to watch the two players play and watch how fast they make their decisions. That to me, more than anything else, was what made me suspicious. And again, so you don't think I am on a witch hunt, I invite you to watch them play sometime and tell me if you think a human could make decisions that quickly. And even if a human could, could he make quality ones in that amount of time. That is the question I am asking. Oddly I can't imagine it would be too difficult to program a bot to vary its reaction times, but these two players generally act instantly.

these players log an incredible amount of hours.

wausau · 02-16-2010, 12:22 AM

hey ___1____ can u watch Gunpowder from bloomfield hills shows all the bot tendencies. The bullin wall pointed it out and god knows how we don't care for each other but I do agree with his call on gunpowder being a bot.

___1___ · 02-18-2010, 10:26 AM

Yeah, gunpowder is defiitely a bot.

engine_block · 02-20-2010, 12:48 AM

___1___ you and I used to butt heads at Absolute. I don't use this particular 2+2 account any more but since wausau was kind enough to turn me on to this thread even while accusing me of botting I thought I would log in under a more familiar name.

I am gunpowder on Bodog and I don't appreciate the accusation. bots tend not to chat, they tend to play more than once or twice a week, and for more than an hour or two at a time. bots tend to sit at tables waiting for opponents. The only "botlike" thing I do is to time my actions to avoid tells.

As others have pointed out this smacks of a witch hunt. I'm no witch. I just play poker once in a while and have longer than most people on this forum or on 2+2. Not a brag, probably everyone here plays more in a year than I have in my life. Higher too. I've been on Bodog since September '07 (not exclusively, obv).

Bodog is more than welcome to scan my pc for botting software, assuming they don't already.

and wausau, go fu.ck yourself.

farmslicer7 · 02-20-2010, 01:42 AM

some of these guys you say are bots play NL too, like loose_goose. Isn't botting primarily a limit thing? I think gunpowder plays nl as well

___1___ · 02-20-2010, 03:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by engine_block

___1___ you and I used to butt heads at Absolute. I don't use this particular 2+2 account any more but since wausau was kind enough to turn me on to this thread even while accusing me of botting I thought I would log in under a more familiar name.

I am gunpowder on Bodog and I don't appreciate the accusation. bots tend not to chat, they tend to play more than once or twice a week, and for more than an hour or two at a time. bots tend to sit at tables waiting for opponents. The only "botlike" thing I do is to time my actions to avoid tells.

As others have pointed out this smacks of a witch hunt. I'm no witch. I just play poker once in a while and have longer than most people on this forum or on 2+2. Not a brag, probably everyone here plays more in a year than I have in my life. Higher too. I've been on Bodog since September '07 (not exclusively, obv).

Bodog is more than welcome to scan my pc for botting software, assuming they don't already.

and wausau, go fu.ck yourself.

Bots chat often. Most bots play infrequently (b/c its usually a team of bots who run their bots in cycles).

BTW, I find the notion that you time all your actions exactly the same, both preflop and postflop, in a limit holdem game pretty comical. Maybe you have OCD, I don't know.

You say you're not using a bot and I say you are. Fine.

___1___ · 02-20-2010, 03:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by farmslicer7

some of these guys you say are bots play NL too, like loose_goose. Isn't botting primarily a limit thing? I think gunpowder plays nl as well

No, FAR more bots play NL that limit.

farmslicer7 · 02-20-2010, 09:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ___1___

No, FAR more bots play NL that limit.

Really, name a suspected NL bot on bodog who is profitable.... i'm curious..... I play a lot of NL

wausau · 02-20-2010, 09:59 PM

hey engine block i'm glad you came to defend yourself. maybe you should consider changing your exact timing pattern to not seem like a bot. like click fold when you have 2 7 off in the small blind and its capped preflop. you won't give too many tells away there. i hope you also contact bodog about this unfair harassment so they can punish the guilty accusers.

wausau · 02-20-2010, 10:06 PM

if loose goose is a bot he's the new improved super bot. he can multi table hu limit and nl. his actions are all over the place time wise. he's not acting anywhere near in the same amount of time like engine block to avoid giving away tells. he may have been multi tabling multiple sites when he took a ton of big blinds and didn't realize it. this is my opinion and obviously everyone will believe what they want.