BB Defense in Online Hand - High Stakes Poker Forum

Smarty 2.0 · 05-19-2012, 08:30 PM

I highly respect ZZ and consider him one of the best LHE players in the world, but can someone explain this preflop/flop play to me? Thanks.

aakkari: folds
TPirahna: folds
B00mslang: folds
m.f.p.i.m.p: raises $100 to $200
LewisFriend: raises $100 to $300
Zzeigler: calls $200
m.f.p.i.m.p: calls $100
*** FLOP *** [6d 4h Ks]
LewisFriend: bets $100
Zzeigler: raises $100 to $200
m.f.p.i.m.p: raises $100 to $300
LewisFriend: folds
Zzeigler: calls $100
*** TURN *** [6d 4h Ks] [Ah]
Zzeigler: checks
m.f.p.i.m.p: bets $200
Zzeigler: raises $200 to $400
m.f.p.i.m.p: calls $200
*** RIVER *** [6d 4h Ks Ah] [7d]
Zzeigler: bets $200
m.f.p.i.m.p: calls $200
*** SHOW DOWN ***
Zzeigler: shows [3s Ad] (a pair of Aces)
m.f.p.i.m.p: shows [Kd Qc] (a pair of Kings)
Zzeigler collected $2797 from pot

AlanBostick · 05-19-2012, 11:40 PM

NH

Tourbound68 · 05-20-2012, 01:14 AM

Spew gone right

tw2238 · 05-20-2012, 07:08 AM

turn and river are fine.

preflop is bad. the first raiser is most likely the spot and im guessing zz just doesn't wanna fold anywhere if this guy is in pot.

on the flop zz thinks he can get lewis to fold alot on this board texture if he raises , i think the reality of this hand is he thinks he can create fold equity from both of them. No one folds anymore so i have a tough time chewing that argument. that backfired cuz mf 3bets then zz just gets lucky on turn.

I think the real spew in the hand is preflop.

___1___ · 05-20-2012, 11:29 AM

Ummmmm, you don't have to make any outragous assumptions to make preflop perfectly fine. If, say, KPR is the button and tpirhana is the sb then you can make a nice argument its spewy.

On the flop ZZeigler probably doesn't like raising either but he likes it more than calling and folding given the pot size, board texture, and opponents. He's probably planning on rasing the flop and not putting anything else in the pot without improving.

Definitely not a standard hand but I think fine considering what I imagine he thinks of his opponents.

___1___ · 05-20-2012, 11:53 AM

yes?

AlanBostick · 05-20-2012, 12:22 PM

If tpiranha were the SB, he wouldn't be folding second to act.

It isn't absolutely explicit, but it is obvious from the action that m.f.p.i.m.p. opened on the button, LewisFriend 3-bet from the SB, and Zzeigler called two more bets from the BB.

___1___ · 05-20-2012, 12:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bucky_Badger

Yes, yo do.

If KPR is button and tpirhana is SB, then we probably have the best hand preflop and should cap that ****.

He doesn't like the other two options because he completely ****ed the dog preflop, and now he is in this awful spot with this pile of **** hand that is caught between the two preflop aggressors.

If he is going to raise the flop, he HAS to blast the turn (and likely the river, depending on what falls) and give SB a chance to fold a better ace or a small pair or even a hand like QJs that has 6 outs in this pot that we have now helped swell to 6.5BB with our terrible preflop and flop plays. There are very few draws on this board, so ZZ's flop raise would likely appear to be a made hand in SB's eyes. (Unless, of course, ZZ was playing super bad and running a crazy, 4 street bluff with the A3o or 98s. But if ZZ is prone to playing super bad here with hands like A3o or 98s, the SB is never folding anything better anyway, which makes ZZ's flop raise even worse.)

No.

Smarty 2.0 · 05-20-2012, 04:03 PM

If I didn't make it clear, ZZ was the BB.

A few hands later he cold-capped 44 from the SB, so maybe I don't understand the game dynamics at all...

schiep · 05-20-2012, 09:18 PM

Raising the flop is consequent given the preflop play and his assumptions behind this decision, turn play is ok and river standard, so the postplop play is fine.

Preflop I would never coldcall, but thats just me. If he thinks that LewisFriend has his tendencies he can exploit, I dont mind it.

schiep · 05-21-2012, 08:51 AM

Could you be more specific?

henholland · 05-21-2012, 01:39 PM

Like shiep said postflop is good given the preflop call. If he doesnt raise these kind of flops a lot he should definitely fold pre i think.
Preflop call is not really that surprising either though. I would guess this is not standard for ZZ either, but for some (winning mid/high players) it probably is pretty standard to play a hand like A2o here vs BTN steal+ SB 3bet.

gaming_mouse · 05-21-2012, 05:20 PM

I think he means that the preflop call imples that ZZ thinks all or some of the following:
1. SB's range is very wide
2. Button will fold stuff like 2 overs for 2 bets on the flop
3. ZZ will be able to exploit SB in position, perhaps (specifically) often getting him to fold better aces UI

Given these assumptions, it follows (is consequent) that this particular flop should be raised.

Not sure how plausible all this is, but I think that's what shiep meant in the sentence you quote.

schiep · 05-22-2012, 09:30 AM

The contibet behavior of LewisFriend is also very important (i mean for playing specifically that hand) and how faced- or not faced-up his play might be. I mean if he expects us to call A2o+ in this spot preflop (+ the flopraise) he could adjust to this with several things postflop which make the precall -EV

Tony Mannoni · 07-13-2012, 04:11 AM

I think ZZ just wants to be invloved in the pot w/Lewis. Pre flop play seems spewy. Flop is obv iso. Turn and river standard.