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Just quit my 6 figure job to play live poker Just quit my 6 figure job to play live poker

02-06-2013 , 01:37 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aesah
I'm playing A LOT of players who I suspect are pros but they take very predictable lines (~100% cbet rate when checked to as the PFR in a 3-bet pot, ~0% river continue range on static boards after they lead two streets then check, etc.). In other words, they aren't that tough.
Aesah - Love the blog, caught up on it in one day. Quick question: What does the bolded part of the quote above mean? I assumed it to mean that if villain is OOP, bets on flop and turn but checks on river, they're folding to a bet on river 100% of the time, but wasn't sure. That's a line I've taken too many times and am trying to avoid it by check-raising a few strong hands on the river.
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02-06-2013 , 03:37 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by cap217
I dont think I explained it very well here but the turn bet was not good.
Nah this is a good explanation. Thanks!

Also I guess he played fine in this hand then but this guy easily loses over $1k on average per session he plays. How do you play if you have his hand OOP though? C/f if you don't hit any card higher than a 7... and c/c, CRAI, or lead if you do? What about low spades on the turn, c/f turn and bluff river if they check back?
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02-06-2013 , 03:58 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aesah
Nah this is a good explanation. Thanks!

Also I guess he played fine in this hand then but this guy easily loses over $1k on average per session he plays. How do you play if you have his hand OOP though? C/f if you don't hit any card higher than a 7... and c/c, CRAI, or lead if you do? What about low spades on the turn, c/f turn and bluff river if they check back?
I would think from his description position doesnt matter. His hand is actually really strong so if he 3 bets you preflop I would be a bit worried and know Im up vs the usuall small stakes 3 betting hands. At higher stakes and stack sizes, I would 3 bet this and 3 bet a wider range. If he bets, its AAxx.

I am not sure if he is capable of bluffing spades, I would say no. I think he CC CC Pots river with his hand.
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02-06-2013 , 04:03 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by GiggityGoo70
Hey dude,

I think you know this but I don't ever like your line on the last hand. Your turn bet is super exploitable.
hmm, what do you mean by exploitable? I almost feel the opposite, betting the turn here with this hand is exactly what makes my turn betting range non-exploitable.

However, I believe that playing non-exploitable vs. random unknowns is bad, and at the 10/20 Commerce game I would personally not suggest betting this turn vs. anyone without AT+. Now THAT range is exploitable (by folding) but I've already talked too much about how people don't like to fold.
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02-06-2013 , 04:04 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by cap217
I would think from his description position doesnt matter. His hand is actually really strong so if he 3 bets you preflop I would be a bit worried and know Im up vs the usuall small stakes 3 betting hands. At higher stakes and stack sizes, I would 3 bet this and 3 bet a wider range. If he bets, its AAxx.

I am not sure if he is capable of bluffing spades, I would say no. I think he CC CC Pots river with his hand.
Also, in PLO, unless I have the nuts on the river, I never feel comportable. I wonder if taking a CR or POT every river line is profitable???
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02-06-2013 , 04:07 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by cap217
I would think from his description position doesnt matter. His hand is actually really strong so if he 3 bets you preflop I would be a bit worried and know Im up vs the usuall small stakes 3 betting hands. At higher stakes and stack sizes, I would 3 bet this and 3 bet a wider range. If he bets, its AAxx.

I am not sure if he is capable of bluffing spades, I would say no. I think he CC CC Pots river with his hand.
Hm, if he 3-bets preflop I just flat with great SPR and continue whenever I hit a set I think? God I am so bad at PLO. Fortunately I'm trying to get that 2-2 game going so I can learn in that instead of 5-5-10 haha.

I noticed people don't really 3-bet preflop often here without AAxx, mainly because of the presence of one or two shortstackers at the table. I can't remember how this compares to the CLE games.

Oh, also I want to clarify that villain in this hand is very aggressive/random and will mash pot with marginal holdings and even complete air. I don't know about his check/raise range though which is the only reason I posted the hand, I think if he leads it's an easy jam over him (which almost seems backwards but yea).
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02-06-2013 , 04:30 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by MIB211
Aesah - Love the blog, caught up on it in one day. Quick question: What does the bolded part of the quote above mean? I assumed it to mean that if villain is OOP, bets on flop and turn but checks on river, they're folding to a bet on river 100% of the time, but wasn't sure. That's a line I've taken too many times and am trying to avoid it by check-raising a few strong hands on the river.
Hm I just made a post about this in RobFarha's PG&C, but basically the vast majority of opponents I face are aggressive and like to barrel but more importantly, they REALLY like to value bet thin.

So on a static board runout (let's say Jd9d2x3x6x), what kind of hands does a pro lead twice with then check the river against an unknown? Well to answer the question lets break it down first into what hands he leads twice with...

1. value hands: Jx, overpairs/sets
2. draws (flush draws, KQ, QT, type hands)
3. total air

All of the hands in category 1 are betting the river. The hands in categories 2 and 3 are sometimes betting the river and sometimes checking. In other words, every time he leads twice then checks he has nothing lol.

Note that the above analysis is reliant on the fact that I'm an unknown to them, it's probably the correct line to take. I'm just saying that playing vs. a table half full of these type of pros isn't bad for me because while they're winning players (possibly more so than I am), they aren't tough for me to play against. Like I said I've encountered a couple guys who I suspect are actually tough but the vast majority of the pros are very predictable (and tbh, correctly so vs. unknowns).

They will know me as a reg after awhile but it will probably be over a year before we get enough history that they'll adjust. Also tbh most of the grinders just won't adjust period, you guys know the type I'm sure

Briefly, the observant reader will notice that I didn't list any mid-strength hands like TT or 9x in the above hand range. That's because these guys don't lead twice with these type of hands, and if they are the type to do so, they're likely to value bet those thin on the river too.

Thanks for the comments everyone!
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02-06-2013 , 04:56 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aesah
Hm, if he 3-bets preflop I just flat with great SPR and continue whenever I hit a set I think? God I am so bad at PLO. Fortunately I'm trying to get that 2-2 game going so I can learn in that instead of 5-5-10 haha.

I noticed people don't really 3-bet preflop often here without AAxx, mainly because of the presence of one or two shortstackers at the table. I can't remember how this compares to the CLE games.

Oh, also I want to clarify that villain in this hand is very aggressive/random and will mash pot with marginal holdings and even complete air. I don't know about his check/raise range though which is the only reason I posted the hand, I think if he leads it's an easy jam over him (which almost seems backwards but yea).
If he leads I flat and not jam. Unless you think there is fold equity in his range, a jam doesnt do anything here. If he bets the turn he will bet the river. If he doesnt bet the river and the board pairs, you bet and he probably calls. You can use these lines in the future to exploit depending on what he does in these situations.

You must pay attention to stack sizes in PLO too. Certian lines work with pot sized bets but if hes a short stack, it will never work. And by short I dont mean NL short, I mean PLO short.

Nothing wrong with calling turn bets in PLO until there is a real history. Especially in position.
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02-06-2013 , 04:58 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aesah
Hm I just made a post about this in RobFarha's PG&C, but basically the vast majority of opponents I face are aggressive and like to barrel but more importantly, they REALLY like to value bet thin.

So on a static board runout (let's say Jd9d2x3x6x), what kind of hands does a pro lead twice with then check the river against an unknown? Well to answer the question lets break it down first into what hands he leads twice with...

1. value hands: Jx, overpairs/sets
2. draws (flush draws, KQ, QT, type hands)
3. total air

All of the hands in category 1 are betting the river. The hands in categories 2 and 3 are sometimes betting the river and sometimes checking. In other words, every time he leads twice then checks he has nothing lol.

Note that the above analysis is reliant on the fact that I'm an unknown to them, it's probably the correct line to take. I'm just saying that playing vs. a table half full of these type of pros isn't bad for me because while they're winning players (possibly more so than I am), they aren't tough for me to play against. Like I said I've encountered a couple guys who I suspect are actually tough but the vast majority of the pros are very predictable (and tbh, correctly so vs. unknowns).

They will know me as a reg after awhile but it will probably be over a year before we get enough history that they'll adjust. Also tbh most of the grinders just won't adjust period, you guys know the type I'm sure

Briefly, the observant reader will notice that I didn't list any mid-strength hands like TT or 9x in the above hand range. That's because these guys don't lead twice with these type of hands, and if they are the type to do so, they're likely to value bet those thin on the river too.

Thanks for the comments everyone!
I read through the first half up until being an unknown and I like how you break hands down. But a player who leads, leads, checks means nothing seems like a way to make a lot of money when villian calls, calls, bets and is faced with a CR river.
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02-06-2013 , 06:07 PM
If i don't see you before the 2-2 PLO game starts PM when you plan on launching it so i can come out and play it
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02-07-2013 , 12:24 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Turntup74
If i don't see you before the 2-2 PLO game starts PM when you plan on launching it so i can come out and play it
LATB calendar says it is on Tuesday with Gavin commentating.
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02-07-2013 , 01:41 AM
Really?!? Awesome I'm definitely gonna play on it

Hopefully I won't look too terrible when I play
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02-07-2013 , 03:26 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Turntup74
Really?!? Awesome I'm definitely gonna play on it

Hopefully I won't look too terrible when I play
hellllllllllll yea.
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02-07-2013 , 03:29 AM
I was down $300 @ Bike in PLO, then I straight tilted/gambled off $1220 at 10/20 in Commerce in a spot where I thought it'd be funny if I won with a Q-high call. It did not work. Need to remind myself that $1200 is a lot and not a good reason to do something because it'd be funny. EXPENSIVE LESSON LEARNED, hopefully it will resonate with me for awhile.

-$1520 in 4 hours.

LA total: $26642, 204 hours.

In a writing mood, lifestyle post part 2 incoming soon.
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02-07-2013 , 04:11 AM
You been making good money, despite tilting off in bad spots. Plug that and you will crush the whole town. You got heart trying to pull that one off.

Gl
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02-07-2013 , 04:20 AM
If that guy can call that flop profitably with kqj8 then op is either a huge fish at PLO or the dude is a beast.
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02-07-2013 , 04:58 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ditch Digger
If that guy can call that flop profitably with kqj8 then op is either a huge fish at PLO or the dude is a beast.
well it's definitely not the latter...

the former is very possible

Thanks for the comments!

Last edited by Aesah; 02-07-2013 at 05:10 AM.
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02-07-2013 , 06:50 AM
Routines are comfortable, a decent living, and safe. "Making the leap" to break out of a routine is REALLY tough- in fact I'm not fond of the phrase "making the leap" because it often undersells how fk'ing hard something really is. When I think about "making the leap", I imagine a situation where you've already prepared yourself, walked to the edge, and just need to build up your courage for a split second to go for it.

However, in reality when you're "making the leap"- for example, quitting that office job you're not so thrilled about, it's not even remotely close to that easy. At any given time, you have projects that you're working on for the office that you can't just abandon, you have friends and emotional attachments there, etc. But the biggest issue of all is that it has to be something you decide to commit to over a period of time, and not just a whim where you can push yourself past the point of no return.


if this wagon had brakes... some great memories would have never been made

What do I mean by that? OK so let's say you decide you're finally ready to quit that high-paying office job and you really want to be a horseback riding guide because you love riding horses and meeting new people all day (damn I don't even like horses and that job sounds fk'ing awesome). So one day you decide to "make the leap", go to the ranch, talk to the guys there, and apply for a position. They set up an interview next week with the manager, you show up, but by then you're only feeling half-hearted about leaving your comfort zone. Despite that, you manage to impress them anyway, and yet another a week later, they get back to you and say you're hired! Congratulations!

Well damn, it's been 2 weeks since you built up the courage to "make the leap", do you still have it now? For many people the answer will be no, and they'll decline the chance to spend their days enjoying nature instead of being alone in a room because they're hesitant about that 70% pay cut and the possible stability cut (will the ranch still be around in a couple years?? Microsoft will be for sure...)


contrary to "office job", every single person on the front page of Google's image search for "horseback riding" is smiling

As an additional point, anecdotal evidence is anecdotal evidence, but I've never met anyone who has told me that they regretted quitting a former job. On the other hand, I've met quite a few people who have changed careers and are thrilled about it. How about you guys? I'm genuinely curious if my experiences are typical or not.


ok well here's at least one guy who should have kept his day job

It all comes down to a combination of comfort, complacency, and fear. Like I wrote in my previous lifestyle post about discipline here, it's not that easy to just make yourself brave/ambitious for two weeks. But if you try really hard maybe you can convince yourself that the rewards are worth the risk. Now I will readily admit that I may be biased because I'm such a massive luckbox. It's true that you won't always succeed in your leap of faith (hence why I said the rewards are worth the risk). But even so... do you really want to continue down a path that will result in you being bored and putting up with- or even dreading- most of your waking hours for the rest of your life? It blows my mind that anyone would answer yes to that question. NOTE THAT SAYING "NO" BUT ACTING "YES" COUNTS AS ANSWERING YES!


actions speak louder than words (god I love being cliche)

Finally, here's a good test to see if you're truly happy with what you're doing. Would you wish the path you chose for yourself upon your closest friends and family? If the answer isn't a "hell yea this is fk'ing awesome", then I suggest spending some quality time thinking about how you can fix that problem*.

*OK fine I suppose I'll accept stuff along the lines "I enjoy it, but it's a niche lifestyle that isn't for everyone", since that's how I feel about poker. I will also accept it if you are unable to take risk for whatever reason (e.g., making a sacrifice to support your loved ones is top tier). OTHERWISE YOU DAMN WELL BETTER BELIEVE IT'S A PROBLEM.

Cheers.

Last edited by Aesah; 02-07-2013 at 07:13 AM. Reason: i spam edits for typos
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02-07-2013 , 06:59 AM
Nice haircut OP.
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02-07-2013 , 07:06 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by serio562
Nice haircut OP.
lolllllllll <3

I normally don't get it this short but the barber did not speak english... by the time I realized what was going on it was too late. Oh well!
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02-07-2013 , 10:15 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ditch Digger
If that guy can call that flop profitably with kqj8 then op is either a huge fish at PLO or the dude is a beast.
Nobody ever said he can call profitably. I said his call wasnt horrible bad and the call makes me think that the villian has some since of equity and good turn cards. Especially if he can hit the nuts and get paid.

Does the villian think like this? I have no clue but his play doesnt suggest that he has no clue about the game.
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02-07-2013 , 01:31 PM
I did not mean to imply the 10/20 games are ultra tough. They are just not super easy. you probably just were there on a soft nite. The best abc players can win in these games but playing great Abc poker is boring and requires a ton of discipline and a bankroll.

As for life advice, i played poker for a living for a year and it was very unfullfilling and stressful. So I don't know some people like stability and many office jobs are fulfilling and challenging. So I don't know I just never give anyone life advice. Everyone has a different perspective on the world.

Last edited by barneyramirez; 02-07-2013 at 01:40 PM.
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02-07-2013 , 02:27 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by barneyramirez
So I don't know I just never give anyone life advice. Everyone has a different perspective on the world.
Yes, clearly!

Thanks for the comments!

Regarding the PLO hand, I did say villain was spazzy but apparently that was an understatement. Here's a hand I played vs. him yesterday:

He raises preflop from BTN, 3 callers including me in SB. I lead for ~3/4 pot, fold, fold, and he jams for less than a full PSB on a K63 board.
I called with AQJ5, he had TT54, got in roughly $1500 in a single raised pot... does this change anyone's opinion on calling with middle set in the other hand (this hand is bad on his part for SURE right)? He ended up binking a non-spade 2 but yea haha.
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02-07-2013 , 02:42 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aesah
Yes, clearly!

Thanks for the comments!

Regarding the PLO hand, I did say villain was spazzy but apparently that was an understatement. Here's a hand I played vs. him yesterday:

He raises preflop from BTN, 3 callers including me in SB. I lead for ~3/4 pot, fold, fold, and he jams for less than a full PSB on a K63 board.
I called with AQJ5, he had TT54, got in roughly $1500 in a single raised pot... does this change anyone's opinion on calling with middle set in the other hand (this hand is bad on his part for SURE right)? He ended up binking a non-spade 2 but yea haha.
He didn't need to bink a thing, got it in with the best hand
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02-07-2013 , 02:45 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aesah
I was down $300 @ Bike in PLO, then I straight tilted/gambled bricks,220 at 10/20 in Commerce in a spot where I thought it'd be funny if I won with a Q-high call. It did not work. Need to remind myself that $1200 is a lot and not a good reason to do something because it'd be funny. EXPENSIVE LESSON LEARNED...
FWIW, $1200 river call with Q-high isn't spew in a special spot (AK979 when flop FD bricks, for example). You would have to describe the hand before we could definitely call it spew.

I have personally hero-called river with J9-high successfully for $1300 in a 5/10 NL game, but that was a special case where the Villain was stuck 8k and mega-tilting, I was stuck 5k and gambling, and Villain's line made absolutely no sense on a Q83K3 board where the flop FD bricked. Also, Villain was PFR, but he was capable of raising SCs.

Unfortunately, Villain was a big fish who became scared of playing pots against me ever again, so my J9-high call probably ended up -EV in the long run.

Forgive the tangent, but I am just saying that a Q-high hero call could be warranted every blue moon.
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