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Poker Goals & Challenges Post your threads logging your travels up the poker ladder as you achieve your poker goals and dreams. "Challenges" does NOT mean prop bets, wagers, etc.

View Poll Results: SO WHAT DO YOU THINK IS A REALISTIC ANNUAL EARNING OF AN "A" PLAYER GRINDING $1/$2NLHE?
LESS THAN $22K 253 12.67%
$22K TO $28K 320 16.02%
$28K TO $34K 344 17.23%
$34K TO $40K 330 16.52%
$40K TO $46K 185 9.26%
MORE THAN $46K 565 28.29%
Voters: 1997. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 12-30-2012, 11:57 AM   #1
ButterflySymmetry
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STARTED WITH A $1/$2nl CHALLENGE, NOW WE'RE HERE.

WARNING!! IMA 2+2 VIRGIN!! FIRST DAY AT THIS!! FIRST THREAD!!

The Goal is Simple - $40k in One Year (starting Jan.1st 2013) playing only $1-$2NLHE, and $1-$3 NLHE cash games. Most of my play will be @HSIPoker (90% of play), @HollywoodPoker (5% of play) in southern Indiana, and other (5% of play). I will make the occasional trips Vegas, Chicago, etc. My buy-ins will be least $300 and no more than $800 in all daily sessions. If I lose a $800 bullet in the first hour of play, then I leave. Therefore a losing session will never exceed $800. I am committed to play an average of 30-35 hours a week. All statistics (running total $, $/hr., #of hrs. win/loss ratio, etc.) will be tracked through my Poker Journal App. The max buy-ins on both of these games @HSIPoker is $300 up to half the big stack at the table (i.e. big stack has $1400, then new player can buy-in for $700, or other players at table can add up to $700 to their chips). Also @HSIPoker players can straddle from any position, so $1-$2 plays like a $1-$3 or even $2-$5 w/deep stacks. Side note: Just yesterday a maniac player at $1-$2 nlhe straddled for $350!! I will also play no more than $5k worth of tournaments for the year ranging from $300-$1700 buy-ins. The tournaments will be recorded separately, and will be added or deducted from cash game total profits at the end of the year (ending Dec. 31st 2013). I will stay committed to this all year and I will not stray from my rules. I can guarantee I will post at least twice a week, and would even like to link a monthly video segments throughout the year. If you stay with me on this journey, I can promise you I will stay with you throughout the whole year. You can count on total transparency in my poker grind. I will share honestly the ups and downs, the brutal swings, and sprinkle in some spice and substance. All while trying to spare you the bad beat stories. I rather do naked snow angels in freezing temps than listening to someone’s bad beat story. For future reference if you share one with me, I will act like I care, but I will really be thinking of when will this bad beat story end!! You can also follow - http://twitter.com/RayzRayl

Background – Starting playing seriously at age 25 during the Chris Moneymaker boom. Duh! It was around the same time I was teaching middle school math. I left teaching to create my own destiny. I started out playing low limits and have played as high as $25-$50 NLHE online. I am like most of you that have $ tied up on Full-Tilt. I am mostly a cash game player, and have played very few tournaments with very little success. I bricked the WSOP Main Event twice (I bought in once, and the other seat was a won through PokerStars). I seem to come up short on the big buy-in tourneys. My biggest score in tournaments are a couple of $20k cashes, and biggest score in cash games are a few $10k sessions. Sometimes poker was my full-time job, and sometimes it was supplement income. Right now it is my full-time job. I own a few rental properties, so that helps take the pressure off the grind. My girlfriend (15yr. relationship) and I have 2 girls (2yrs and 9yrs) that are joys of my life. My biggest challenge is explaining to them along with everyone else that I play poker for a living. I struggle with the fact that I am basically chasing money, and not doing anything productive. On the flip side, I do like the higher levels of thinking, the competition, and the pressure that poker offers me. Furthermore, I am not a gambler! I go straight to the poker room and straight out, nothing in between (no dice, no colors, no slots, no blackjack, etc.). Don’t get me wrong though I will bet anything I have an edge on. Most of all, I am a man devoted to my faith. Side note: I don’t see playing poker as sinful behavior, or gambling. I define gambling as anything where I’m not a favorite to win long term. More about me . . . thrive on competition, unique, introvert, outside the box thinker, gym fitness member, a bit anti-social, well mannered, authored my memoir at age 30, every other weekend drinker, love my church, entrepreneurial thinker, tennis junkie, green thumb, and I think cats are skittish.

Reason for Goal – The challenge itself is the ultimate reason for this goal. I was recently in a conversation with a friend of mine, and he was stating that $30k/yr. was a realistic earning for a $1-2, $1-3 nlhe grinder. I discussed that an “A” player putting in 40hrs/wk. can possibly make $40k/yr. He said, “no way”, and I said “I’m going to do it.” And that’s how this goal started. Reason 2) Simple – the goal will keep me staying determined to play flawlessly, and it will keep me focused at the task at hand. This goal allows me to stay “hungry” the whole year. I enjoy the pressure of striving to achieve something that is challenging. This challenge will keep me waking up each day and grinding. The satisfaction of achieving this goal will be half the fun, and the journey getting there is the other half. My subscribers, followers, and my post will keep accountable; and keeps me determined to play my “A” game. Thank you in advance for subscribing/following! Reason 3) it keeps the pressure off me playing the bigger games. I always told people the “poker lows” hurt more than the “highs” feel good. If that makes any sense to you! There were times when I was playing bigger limits where I would lose $5k in a sesh. Trust me those days sting! When I lost that amount of cheddar I would always think of what I could have done with that money; i.e. remodel the kitchen, go on shopping spree, buy a used car, get a golf membership at the country club, etc. When I win it’s like “cool”, but when I lose big it affects my whole psyche! With this goal I am managing my losses where worst case scenario is an $800 losing day. Reason 4) the $1-$2 NLHE is the most popular poker game around. There are more $1-$2 players than any other game. This will give a good idea of what’s a realistic earning from a solid $1-$2nlhe player. I want to do this for all the grinders. There is not a truer grinder than a $1-$2 grinder. Big Ups to all the 1-2ers!

Cliff Notes – Can I? Or can’t I? Make $40k in 2013 playing only $1-$2 and $1-$3 NLHE. Playing at least 30hrs/wk. and buying in for no more than $800 a session! I will also invest no more than $5k in tournaments in 2013 that will be factored into the $40k/year goal. I will post often with full transparency. I thrive on competition. My motto is look good, feel good, play good. I like puzzles. I have a degree in Mathematics. This is my very first post on 2 + 2 forum. All feedback welcome.

Thanks,
Rayz
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Old 12-30-2012, 12:05 PM   #2
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Re: MY $40k CHALLENGE in 2013, @ INDIANA HORSESHOE GRINDING $1/$2nlhe!

Quote:
Originally Posted by ButterflySymmetry View Post
and I think cats are skittish.
Subscribed.
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Old 12-30-2012, 12:26 PM   #3
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Re: MY $40k CHALLENGE in 2013, @ INDIANA HORSESHOE GRINDING $1/$2nlhe!

Quote:
Originally Posted by ButterflySymmetry View Post

I like puzzles. I have a degree in Mathematics.
Should be a good thread. How are you with psychology? And how soft or how nitty are these games you'll be playing?

GL!
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Old 12-30-2012, 02:22 PM   #4
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Re: MY $40k CHALLENGE in 2013, @ INDIANA HORSESHOE GRINDING $1/$2nlhe!

FORGIVE ME IN ADVANCE W/ THE "FORMALITIES" OF POSTING, REPLYING, OR WHATEVER. IT IS GOOD TO SEE I GOT MY FIRST SUBSCRIBER! I JUST FOUND OUT TODAY WHAT THAT MEANS!

@SILVER_MAN2 THANKS FOR BEING MY FIRST! I HOPE IT WAS JUST AS GD FOR YOU AS IT WAS FOR ME! #SMOKINGnBED

@VANDERSWAAG, IN RESPONSE TO THE PSYCHOLOGY SIDE. I FEEL I HAVE A GD READ ON PLAYERS. I USUALLY JUST SIT THERE QUIET AT THE TABLE, AND LISTEN TO PLAYERS CONVERSATIONS. IT IS VALUEABLE INFORMATION. I AM REALLY ASTONISHED THAT THE MAJORITY OF THE POKER DISCUSSIONS I HEAR AT THE TABLES IS SO HORRIBLY INACCURATE! I CANT AFFORD TO WEAR HEAD PHONES DUE TO GAINING TOO MUCH INFO LISTENING.
YOUR NEXT QUESTION ON HOW NITTY ARE THE GAMES? WELL SOME ARE NITTY, AND SOME CAN BE CRAZY INSANE. IF I'M AT A NIT TABLE, I WILL JUST TABLE CHANGE TO A MORE PROFITABLE TABLE. SOME TABLES PLAYERS WILL OPEN FOR 10X AND GET 4 CALLERS! ALSO PLAYERS WILL STRADDLE FROM THE WORSE POSITION FOR $X. ONE SOFT REG WILL STRADDLE $100 EVERY ORBIT. IT'S NUTS! PLAYERS WILL EVEN SHOW THEIR CARDS WHEN THEY LOSE, OR FOLD!! I JUST DONT GET IT!! THAT IS FREE INFORMATION!!

JUST SURVIVED MY 2ND POST, AND NOT BANNED YET!!
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Old 12-30-2012, 08:08 PM   #5
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Re: MY $40k CHALLENGE in 2013, @ INDIANA HORSESHOE GRINDING $1/$2nlhe!

Good luck man, followed you on twitter, follow me back @pitabread189

AND STOP TYPING IN ALL CAPS lol it's hard to read
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Old 12-30-2012, 09:29 PM   #6
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Re: MY $40k CHALLENGE in 2013, @ INDIANA HORSESHOE GRINDING $1/$2nlhe!

K no more CAPS! I'll type nOrMaL. I appreciate all the suggestions, and welcome more. It was also suggested that I update more often than twice a week. So i will.
I am already intrigued that the people that have voted on the poll (above thread) have vastly different opinions of this topic. This is the exact reason I wanted to do this challenge. I think it is important to know the realistic earning of a $1/$2 grinder. From the poll it seems like we all have different realistic expectations. After playing for 10yrs I never knew the answer, and now I am going to find out what's realistic. Hopefully it can be $40k !
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Old 12-30-2012, 10:33 PM   #7
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Re: MY $40k CHALLENGE in 2013, @ INDIANA HORSESHOE GRINDING $1/$2nlhe!

GL op.

I'll be watching. I'm also doing something similar which I started a thread for well.
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Old 12-31-2012, 12:35 AM   #8
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Re: MY $40k CHALLENGE in 2013, @ INDIANA HORSESHOE GRINDING $1/$2nlhe!

GL op! you sound like you have a clear understanding of how hard this will be but your determination should lead to success.

If i'm not mistaken, isn't the horseshoe indiana a 200 max buy-in? And isn't it limited to an UTG straddle to 5?

at 35hrs a week playing 12 months out of the year, your going to need about 24$/hr which is a pretty damn good win rate at 1/2. something that will crush your hourly is you play regularly is tipping from your stack. I'd advice bringing separate funds not from you BR to tip with, or stack off your br weekly or monthly if you keep track of how much you tipping.

Last edited by fogodchao; 12-31-2012 at 12:42 AM.
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Old 12-31-2012, 10:09 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fogodchao View Post
GL op! you sound like you have a clear understanding of how hard this will be but your determination should lead to success.

If i'm not mistaken, isn't the horseshoe indiana a 200 max buy-in? And isn't it limited to an UTG straddle to 5?

at 35hrs a week playing 12 months out of the year, your going to need about 24$/hr which is a pretty damn good win rate at 1/2. something that will crush your hourly is you play regularly is tipping from your stack. I'd advice bringing separate funds not from you BR to tip with, or stack off your br weekly or monthly if you keep track of how much you tipping.
You might be thinking of Hollywood Indiana. Their $1/$2 is a $200 max, and straddle only utg. I am doing 90% of my play at southern Indiana Horsehoe, in Elizabeth Indiana where the max is $300 up to half the big stack, amd straddle from anywhere for any amount. It is on hwy111, the absolute most dangerous road in the state! What might be the hardest part of this challenge is staying alive on that stretch of road leading to the casino. I just lost my friend on that road 2 months ago in a 4 fatality wreck. I put the over/under at 2 fatalities a year.

I see tipping as part of poker and i will tip directly from my stack. I realize it wd help my hourly if I didn't, but its part of the game. I don't go crazy tipping red birds and such. Just $1 up to $3, but I do realize that can add up to $50ish/day.

You are correct on that my hourly will hv to stay around $25 to accomplish goal. I ran the #s and fig if working an average of 33(Larry Bird)hrs a wk, then my average hourly will have to be $24/hr @ 33hrs wk = $792/wk @ 52wks = $41.2k. I see 33 hours a week being the norm for me, but can grind longer if my hourly isn't where it needs to be. Please note that every poker player plays differently. Some are fish and some are sharks. A solid "A" player will make $X annually, "B" player will make $Y annually, "C" player will b lucky to break even, "D" and "F" players will lose. I consider myself as a strong "A", so this challenged is based on Realistic Annual Earning of an "A" player.
Thanks again for your comments and gd luck to you as well.
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Old 12-31-2012, 08:40 PM   #10
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Re: MY $40k CHALLENGE in 2013, @ INDIANA HORSESHOE GRINDING $1/$2nlhe!

Hey Rayz. I justed wanted to say hello. It's 9 seat from earlier with the Cats hat on, Sam. You were talking about your goal for 2013 and I thought I would give you my support. It took my awhile to find it on here but i finally did. I play there often, i say hello next time I see you down there.
You are very class act, and in case noone knows check this out
http://blog.wsop.com/2012/10/playing-with-a-purpose/
I wish you the best
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Old 12-31-2012, 08:45 PM   #11
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Re: MY $40k CHALLENGE in 2013, @ INDIANA HORSESHOE GRINDING $1/$2nlhe!

so your arbitrary goal of making 40k at 1/2 outways the importance of moving up in stakes when you can. I mean do you consider it a success if you make 40k playing 1/2 and never took a shot at 2/5?
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Old 12-31-2012, 10:06 PM   #12
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Re: MY $40k CHALLENGE in 2013, @ INDIANA HORSESHOE GRINDING $1/$2nlhe!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fordham View Post
so your arbitrary goal of making 40k at 1/2 outways the importance of moving up in stakes when you can. I mean do you consider it a success if you make 40k playing 1/2 and never took a shot at 2/5?
Gd question. I use to play $2/5 at Horseshoe Ind 40hrs/wk. a couple years back, but the game broke up perhaps due to poker economy. Now it only runs on Fri and sometimes on Sat usually just 1 table. I wd have to drive 5 hrs (Hammond Horseshoe) to play in a daily $2/5 or $5/10 game. I wd love to play bigger, but my options are limited. Travel is -EV! I have always wated to move to suit my poker needs, but when you have kids and family it's hard. Plus I'm cool with playing these stakes for now. If I can make enough to pay the bills, save a little, wine and dine a little, and golf a little; then I'm gd with that. Plus the swings aren't as bad = less stress! I will consider it a success if accomplised. I am doing it for the challenge, and for informative data.
Thanks Fordham for the question

@CallyGal
Thanks for the comments! How much I owe you? lol

Last edited by ButterflySymmetry; 12-31-2012 at 10:18 PM.
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Old 12-31-2012, 10:18 PM   #13
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Re: MY $40k CHALLENGE in 2013, @ INDIANA HORSESHOE GRINDING $1/$2nlhe!

as fogodchao said, $24/hr at 1/2 NL is a crazy high win rate expectation. Not realistic when compared to folks who do this for a living. 2/5 would be better for that type of return but it you can pull it off at 1/2 then more power to you.

Good luck.
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Old 12-31-2012, 10:38 PM   #14
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Re: MY $40k CHALLENGE in 2013, @ INDIANA HORSESHOE GRINDING $1/$2nlhe!

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as fogodchao said, $24/hr at 1/2 NL is a crazy high win rate expectation. Not realistic when compared to folks who do this for a living. 2/5 would be better for that type of return but it you can pull it off at 1/2 then more power to you.

Good luck.
I understand $24/hr is high win rate for $1/2, but these $1/2 games are playing bigger than the norm. I played today and won $321 in 6 hrs (to bad it didn't qualify for this challenge). Please note that max buy in is $300 UP to half the big stack. Today I bought in for $400 because big stack was $800 at the time. Also adding the fact that people are straddling for $5 or more regularly, it is playing similiar to a $1/3 ($500 max buyin).
Thanks for comments.

Ready for this to start tomorrow! Might b playing w/headache. Damn NYE.
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Old 01-01-2013, 02:21 AM   #15
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Re: MY $40k CHALLENGE in 2013, @ INDIANA HORSESHOE GRINDING $1/$2nlhe!

every solid poker player is going to be bombed tomorrow
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Old 01-01-2013, 03:43 AM   #16
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Re: MY $40k CHALLENGE in 2013, @ INDIANA HORSESHOE GRINDING $1/$2nlhe!

Good luck OP! I really want to see you succeed but I feel like given the fact that you have two daughters, some sort of teaching career might be more +lifeEV. Seriously, math teacher at an Indiana high school has to pay at least 50k, right?
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Old 01-01-2013, 08:47 PM   #17
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Re: MY $40k CHALLENGE in 2013, @ INDIANA HORSESHOE GRINDING $1/$2nlhe!

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I feel like given the fact that you have two daughters, some sort of teaching career might be more +lifeEV. Seriously, math teacher at an Indiana high school has to pay at least 50k, right?
I made no more than $40k teaching middle school math ten years ago. I feel I can achieve more being a landlord, and playing poker. I like being in control of my own destiny, and being my own boss.

Day 1 of the $40k Challenge was bananas from the jump!!!
I get to the $1/2 table and see 2 big stacks of $2k+ (players that played all night NYeve), so I sit down w $800 (max buyin per my challenge). My very first hand I play i lose $400!!! At this point, I'm thinking nice way to start the challenge ! Just 30 mins later I'm all in w my remaining $400 ! I have A7 the hand plays...3 players see flop 723 PlayerX bets $45, PlayerY raises to $100, I shove $400. PlayerX calls, PlayerY folds. The turn 8the river 8 , and I'm good ! PlayerX has just a pair of 4s. He put me on a flush draw (he was half right). So that got me back to even plus some. Few hours later I up $400, but ended up cashing out w a $115 profit. #rollercoaster
5 hours of play +$115 = $23/hr. Back at it tomorrow
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Old 01-01-2013, 09:44 PM   #18
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Re: MY $40k CHALLENGE in 2013, @ INDIANA HORSESHOE GRINDING $1/$2nlhe!

gl man, which casino do u find the games more juicy @ hollywood or at the horseshoe?
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Old 01-01-2013, 10:40 PM   #19
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Re: MY $40k CHALLENGE in 2013, @ INDIANA HORSESHOE GRINDING $1/$2nlhe!

Quote:
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gl man, which casino do u find the games more juicy @ hollywood or at the horseshoe?
Horseshoe $1/2 plays bigger (bigger max buyin) than Hollywood. Speaking only for $1/2nhle, horseshoe is way more juicy.
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Old 01-01-2013, 11:52 PM   #20
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Re: MY $40k CHALLENGE in 2013, @ INDIANA HORSESHOE GRINDING $1/$2nlhe!

gl man. subscribing
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Old 01-02-2013, 12:41 AM   #21
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Gl man looks like a good read will def subscribe
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Old 01-02-2013, 04:55 PM   #22
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Re: MY $40k CHALLENGE in 2013, @ INDIANA HORSESHOE GRINDING $1/$2nlhe!

Thanks for the subscribes

I Couldn't Hit Water if I Fell Out of the Boat!! Day 2 Disaster!!

Just got home from the poker room, and my 12 day win streak came to a brutal stop w/ a $800 loss . Not the way I wanted to start off the year ! Want a jinx I made for myself with this $40k Challenge! In some sort of strange way though, I kind like the added pressure. I learned a long time ago that you have to look at poker results month to month, not day to day. As always, I'll keep showing up.

This is laughable!
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Old 01-05-2013, 03:02 PM   #23
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Re: MY $40k CHALLENGE in 2013, @ INDIANA HORSESHOE GRINDING $1/$2nlhe!

Up and down week. After an $800 loss, I spent the rest of the week trying to come out on top. I am trying not to let the bad work days affect my mood at home. Win or lose, I always try to leave everything at the poker office. Yes I wil dissect some hands and review my play afterwards, but I don't talk poker with my family. They just can't comprehend, and it is a waste of time trying to explain. I will usually just tell them my how much I won or lost if they ask. Well, this week I made peanuts, but I'm glad after being stuck early. I'm going to need some $1k plus wks the rest of the month to stay on course. I am embarrassed to report my hourly at this time. Lets just say poverty level for now <$10.
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Old 01-05-2013, 04:36 PM   #24
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Re: MY $40k CHALLENGE in 2013, @ INDIANA HORSESHOE GRINDING $1/$2nlhe!

Good luck will be following. I live in the area so maybe I will stop in and play some 1/2 with you at some point.
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Old 01-06-2013, 03:43 PM   #25
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Re: MY $40k CHALLENGE in 2013, @ INDIANA HORSESHOE GRINDING $1/$2nlhe!

@bmess0 thanks

Locked in on beast mode for this week. I am ready to set traps and button mash. This week's schedule consist of dropping the kiddo off at school at 7a, followed by a work out at 8a, and clocking in at 10a. Plan on playing 40hrs this week.
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