4 bet sizing a touch high ?

Thats .05 over 2.5x and isn't that "standard"?

His read was that the villain was 3 betting light so I think he would have been happy to take down the pot with that bet size holding Ax. If he had a premium hand I can see 4 betting less to make a call more likely.

I usually 4 bet to 23 big blinds.

In the Matt Janda book he states:

"The most common 4-bet sizings are usually around 22 to 24 big blinds to win a pot of around 15 to 16 big blinds."

Standard 3 bet is 9bb
9bb x 2.5 = 22.5 bb

So I thought 23 was about right

I don't think that choosing bet sizes depending on hand strength is a good idea, especially vs villains on whom you have close to 2k hand sample.

+1

I can see that. So back to your original comment what size bet WOULD you advocate and why?

It wasn't my comment. I think that 2.5x is perfectly fine, but I personally use 2.2x, without any reason. I picked up these sizings from somewhere and haven't really thought it through. I'm struggling with 3betting and that's where I focus the most atm. What 3bet sizes do you use IP/OOP and does the 4bet sizes change depending on position? If you guys don't mind asking..

Fwiw, i like his 4b size, except i woulda went 2.25
I 3b 3x ip and 4x oop if i am thinking when i 3b
4b size i keep to 2.5 tho maybe should consider 3x if oop

I dont know what is theoretically correct but I usually keep my 3bet and 4bet sizes consistent regardless of position or hand strength. 3bet to 9x and 4bet to 23 big blinds (unless I have some other info that implies I should play different)

3 Hands vs the same Fishy player 29/9

Hand 1 is bad play and I know I shouldnt call the river bet.

Hand 2 is the very next hand after Hand 1. I figure he may think I am just getting aggro after losing a stack the previous hand and I am kinda hoping he calls with a flush draw with a pair type hand, if he already has it I still have 34% equity to hit the full boat.

Hand 3 - sigh. Didnt exactly look like he had that holding and dont feel I did too much wrong here given our previous history. 3rd time in 24 hours Ive lost a stack like this.

Hand #1
Poker Stars $0.05/$0.10 No Limit Hold'em - 9 players -

UTG: $10.00
UTG+1: $9.98
UTG+2: $8.83
Hero (MP1): $10.27
MP2: $12.20
CO: $9.85
BTN: $9.04
SB: $10.05
BB: $19.83

Pre Flop: ($0.15) Hero is MP1 with J J
1 fold, UTG+1 calls $0.10, 1 fold, Hero raises to $0.40, 5 folds, UTG+1 calls $0.30

Flop: ($0.95) 9 6 K (2 players)
UTG+1 bets $0.10, Hero raises to $0.50, UTG+1 calls $0.40

Turn: ($1.95) J (2 players)
UTG+1 checks, Hero bets $1.10, UTG+1 raises to $2.20, Hero calls $1.10

River: ($6.35) T (2 players)
UTG+1 bets $6.06, Hero raises to $7.17 all in, UTG+1 calls $0.82 all in



Hand#2
Poker Stars $0.05/$0.10 No Limit Hold'em - 9 players -

BB: $10.00
UTG: $19.21
UTG+1: $8.83
Hero (UTG+2): $10.00
MP1: $12.20
MP2: $9.85
CO: $9.04
BTN: $10.00
SB: $19.73

Pre Flop: ($0.15) Hero is UTG+2 with J J
UTG calls $0.10, 1 fold, Hero raises to $0.40, 6 folds, UTG calls $0.30

Flop: ($0.95) 5 J 6 (2 players)
UTG bets $0.10, Hero raises to $0.80, UTG raises to $1.50, Hero raises to $9.60 all in,

Hand #3
Poker Stars $0.05/$0.10 No Limit Hold'em - 9 players -

MP1: $10.00
MP2: $10.53
CO: $8.73
Hero (BTN): $18.10
SB: $12.00
BB: $12.69
UTG: $9.24
UTG+1: $10.00
UTG+2: $19.98

Pre Flop: ($0.15) Hero is BTN with K K
4 folds, MP2 raises to $0.20, CO calls $0.20, Hero raises to $1, 2 folds, MP2 raises to $1.80, CO calls $1.60, Hero raises to $18.10 all in,

Why can we not 4 bet to 19bb or 20bb with a hand like A7o ?

He is going to react the same way to the 4 bet regardless of the size so why make it more expensive on our part ?

Your not 4 betting A7o for value ... you are doing it to get him to fold or call and fold to a cbet, which means your cbet will be cheaper too due to the size of the pot.

Players at $10nl FR react very honest to 4 bets regardless of size..

You make a good point. But you could argue that by 4 betting larger it gets an extra few % of folds PF and then when our cbet is larger on the flop it also makes it more expensive for the villain to continue thus more likely to fold.

To the observant player they may pick up that when our 4bet is smaller we are weaker which may induce a light 5 bet. I suppose if you mix things up and 4bet smaller with a polarized range including your top premium hands then this would be fine.

With consistent bet sizing the villain is unable to get a read if we are strong or 4betting light.

I suppose the argument would be that an unobservant fish wouldnt notice bet sizing tells.

I agree with this statement. I think the chances of a micros villain being able to pick up a sizing tell based on the size of your 4bet in a steal situation is extremely unlikely.

I don't know if its a coincidence but the 2.25bb - 2.5bb bet size is the standard opening I've heard recommended in pretty much every beginner coaching vid I've seen for tourney play, and this is normally where the topic of sizing tells comes up.

My bet sizing is very situationally dependent based on:

villian(s) - nit, tag, lag, fish, etc.

what I'm trying to accomplish - am i trying to squeeze or iso, do i have a premium hand and i'm trying to set a psr so i can get stacks in on two betting rounds, etc.

table dynamics - have i been getting too many callers on my 3bets and do i need to make them slightly larger to clean up my outs, has a villain been 4bet shoving so i should min 3bet this time to make it cheaper if i have to fold, etc

profitability - how often does a bet size of x into a pot of y have to work to be profitable if i'm 3betting light

I don't know how much of that is right/wrong but that's what I'm thinking about when I'm sizing my bets preflop.

Vs a 13/10 TAG

I dont know if this is bad play from myself or one to sit on the cooler shelf. Im expecting him to raise me on the flop as a semi-bluff, then hoping he calls with a draw. That was the plan anyway.

Poker Stars $0.05/$0.10 No Limit Hold'em - 7 players
DeucesCracked Poker Videos Hand History Converter

UTG: $20.01
UTG+1: $17.41
MP: $5.00
CO: $10.50
BTN: $10.13
Hero (SB): $10.20
BB: $3.25

Pre Flop: ($0.15) Hero is SB with K K
3 folds, CO raises to $0.30, 1 fold, Hero raises to $0.90, 1 fold, CO calls $0.60

Flop: ($1.90) T 5 6 (2 players)
Hero bets $1.10, CO raises to $2.50, Hero raises to $9.30 all in, CO calls $6.80

Turn: ($20.50) 7 (2 players - 1 is all in)

River: ($20.50) J (2 players - 1 is all in)

I moved to NL10 not too long ago and I've noticed that there's a lot more semi bluffing going on on the flop, like raising OESD and FD. This is a really though spot and I would fold to a raise OTF. I think you would most likely see a set or a AcXx,AcXc. Lately I've been giving a lot of credit to TAGs and NITs after countless coolers and imo BEplay, or maybe I'm just becoming nitty myself..
Anyway, WP.

Just had a nice +4 BI session, here is some HH.

Hand #1
This villain has 3Bet steal% of 23, so we were expecting it. I give him a gentle 4bet to let him know this isnt kool. Obv Im 4betting light but I had the K blocker and expect him to be weak and fold a lot of times. If he 5 bets I'll conisder shoving over the top. When he 5 bets so small I decide to call see a flop and then let him hang himself.

Poker Stars $0.05/$0.10 No Limit Hold'em - 8 players

MP1: $10.00
MP2: $14.23
CO: $29.67
BTN: $8.69
Hero (SB): $10.14
BB: $9.80
UTG: $2.25
UTG+1: $11.26

Pre Flop: ($0.15) Hero is SB with 8 K
6 folds, Hero raises to $0.30, BB raises to $0.90, Hero raises to $2.30, BB raises to $4, Hero calls $1.70

Flop: ($8.00) K 4 6 (2 players)
Hero checks, BB bets $5.80 all in, Hero calls $5.80

Turn: ($19.60) K (2 players - 1 is all in)

River: ($19.60) 4 (2 players - 1 is all in)



Hand #2
Poker Stars $0.05/$0.10 No Limit Hold'em - 7 players

Felt I played this well. Figured the villain would put me on a flush draw after raising the flop. Was quite surprised to see his cards.

BTN: $10.42
SB: $10.00
BB: $11.48
UTG: $8.51
UTG+1: $3.25
Hero (MP): $11.99
CO: $16.67

Pre Flop: ($0.15) Hero is MP with T T
2 folds, Hero raises to $0.30, CO calls $0.30, 3 folds

Flop: ($0.75) T 2 4 (2 players)
Hero checks, CO bets $0.50, Hero raises to $1.50, CO calls $1

Turn: ($3.75) Q (2 players)
Hero bets $3.60, CO calls $3.60

River: ($10.95) A (2 players)
Hero bets $6.59 all in, CO calls $6.59


Hand #3
Poker Stars $0.05/$0.10 No Limit Hold'em - 7 players

Villain is 64/55 over only 12 hands. When he shoves the flop I sat taking deep breaths thinking I can fold Aces there is nothing in the pot, its no big deal. Timer ticked down to 1 sec, and I thought the guy is 64/55...


UTG+1: $10.42
MP: $10.55
CO: $10.88
BTN: $8.36
SB: $3.30
Hero (BB): $23.04
UTG: $4.68

Pre Flop: ($0.15) Hero is BB with A A
3 folds, CO raises to $0.20, 2 folds, Hero raises to $0.60, CO calls $0.40

Flop: ($1.25) 8 4 4 (2 players)
Hero bets $1.20, CO raises to $10.28 all in, Hero calls $9.08

Turn: ($21.81) 8 (2 players - 1 is all in)

River: ($21.81) 6 (2 players - 1 is all in)



Hand #4
Poker Stars $0.05/$0.10 No Limit Hold'em - 9 players
Ha what up Flex, shoving with AK tut tut. Yeh think this Reg was getting sick of me bullying him at the table. He has high fold to 4bet and 5bet stats so I raise him quite a bit, must have got to him.

SB: $9.23
Hero (BB): $10.00
UTG: $10.00
UTG+1: $10.00
UTG+2: $7.15
MP1: $10.00
MP2: $13.92
CO: $10.22
BTN: $10.48

Pre Flop: ($0.15) Hero is BB with A A
2 folds, UTG+2 raises to $0.30, 2 folds, CO raises to $0.90, 2 folds, Hero raises to $2.30, 1 fold, CO raises to $10.22 all in, Hero calls $7.70 all in

Flop: ($20.35) 6 Q 5 (2 players - 2 are all in)

Turn: ($20.35) 2 (2 players - 2 are all in)

River: ($20.35) 3 (2 players - 2 are all in)

Final Pot: $20.35
Hero shows A A (a pair of Aces)
CO shows K A (high card Ace)
Hero wins $19.43
(Rake: $0.92)

Hand #5
Poker Stars $0.05/$0.10 No Limit Hold'em - 9 players

I open here with AA and then the SB calls and the BB squeezes to 1.20. So I figure they both must be strong and decide to get out of the way..

...aaaarrrrgh actually I was pressing my hotkey to fold on another table and right as I press the button it jumps to this table and folds me. The way I was running this session the dude prob had KK.

Is there anything you can do about that^ something that doesnt jump it to the next table when the current one times out. So annoying.

Hero (MP1): $10.00
MP2: $10.00
CO: $10.00
BTN: $5.85
SB: $11.15
BB: $10.78
UTG: $10.34
UTG+1: $8.95
UTG+2: $14.40

Pre Flop: ($0.15) Hero is MP1 with A A
3 folds, Hero raises to $0.30, 3 folds, SB calls $0.25, BB raises to $1.20, 2 folds

Final Pot: $0.90
BB wins $0.90
(Rake: $-0.00)

View all 5 hands

April turned into a BE month after a good start. I did run 8 BI under EV but im not sure how much attention I should pay to EV as its only 1 element of luck factor and will even itself out over time.

Was playing a higher and higher VPIP getting near 20, 3betting too much, squeezing too much and CC 3bets too much.

Im now resorting back to a 14/12 tighter style. I can play more hands when my skill level improves. Right now I feel 14/12 will be better for me and put me in less marginal spots.

I did have almost a positive win rate in SB last month by stealling a very high% (edit: just checked my SB stats for April: +5bb/100 - 29/22 - 3bet 7 - CC 5 - Steal % 71 !! 4k hands from SB) so I may be willing to increase my VPIP in SB if it is still working for me.

Anyway I did balance out my good winrate from the SB by playing like a ****** in the BB @ -57 bb/100

With regard to 4b sizing on previous page, definitely go a lot smaller. I go exactly 2x ip. Reason being if you wanna 'defend more button opens' like you said, you need to be able to balanced without committing too many bbs to the pot. Furthermore you can eaaaasily get it all in in any 4b pot by the river so why would you risk losing more bb's when you 4b bluff? Always be thinking what you would do with your entire range when you decide to go a certain size (eg, if someone folds to 5th pot when u have value, then go 5th pot as a bluff). Slightly gone off topic I'm afraid glgl

Hey dude what up. Good to hear from you. Was checking 2+2 on my phone last night and stumbled across your PG&C thread for 2014, didnt even realise you had one I have been too busy trapped inside my own little world.

Anyway Im working my way through it, was enjoying reading your HH's and hoping to learn from you. Read the first 3 pages, ill get through the rest then drop a post in your thread when Im up to speed. Just read upto the bit where the flat had been robbed during the wedding

best of luck to you

just found this thread: http://www.deucescracked.com/forums/...=2&per_page=15

and couldnt believe it works. Some script that auto clicks the time bank for you. It also auto un-clicks the "sit out next hand" button if you do time out.

Now that is clever.

My problem is when Im facing a big decision I flick the table to the other monitor to think things over - so this is the active table.

Meanwhile other tables start to timeout.

I have a hotkeys for:
"Go To First Action Table" - Home
"Activate Next Table" - Page Up
"Activate Previous Table" - Page Down

While I ponder a big decision I cant press "Go To First Action Table" as this takes me to the table in the other monitor where I am still pondering my decision.

How do I get to the tables where I have been dealt in that are requiring an action from me?

I can press my hotkey for "Activate Next Table" but this seems to just cycle through all the tables including those which dont require decisions. As a result I time out on some tables by the time I have flicked through to the ones that need an action.

What I want to do is move the table that requires thinking time to the other monitor. Look at the situation and take 5-10 seconds to think it through.

Meanwhile I want to quickly jump to the "next decision" table and quickly fold or open. Then come back to the table with the big decision and make my choice. But it seems there is only a hotkey to go to the "Most Urgent" table or a hotkey to cycle through all the tables.

Anyway with this auto time bank feature, it shouldnt auto fold my hands and make the table flicker in a milli-second, to the table where I hold AA and facing a raise, and then fold what was meant for another table.

Dont you have all this stuff already ?

Such a noob mate

I use TN1 for all this kind of stuff ... hopefully never have to buy TN2.

Dont ask me about 6 max ...

I see Flex has been donating again ... hes back at $10nl again after his marathon month it seems.

Too busy driving his new car i suppose.

I am a noob

I also learned this today:

Pokerstars Lobby > Options > Advanced Multi-Table Options > 'Sit Out Next Blind' checkbox: Close Table On Big Blind

I always wondered why I had to manually close tables after sitting out the next big blind and inevitably 2 or 3 tables stack up where you are sitting out before you can close them. Now these Reg Ridden tables will be auto closed on the BB whenever I give the order and TST will just flick me up a new one

I reckon I will be able to play an extra few tables now that I have less finger work to do.

Yeh Flex basically relegated me from 25nl by coolering me 2 hands in a row and he sent me down with KK v AA even though I was like +14 BI up on the guy.

Mate you honestly need to write to Pokerstars a little letter asking them to ban you from 6max and Zoom. You would be @ 100nl in FR by now had you stuck at it.

Obv I will be there in no time now that I have learned the basics of the Pokerstars options menus people better watch out..

And with regards Table Ninja I would get it, but you cant buy Table Ninja 1 anymore I believe and Table Ninja 2 is subscription only, so based on my win rate of about Break Even lol dont think I can afford the luxury.

Better than me, i have tnft1, and cant use it cause I'm from us