Hero - $1000 - in game for about $1400 so down a little. Got murdered on my first buy in, losing with AA to a random hand, and running into the top of every ones range.

Villain 1 - $1000 - Probably plays too many hands, but has been limp calling me. I have yet to see him 3bet, and his raises are pretty tight.

Villain 2 - $240 - Bought in for $400 and lost $160 by calling / folding flop.


Hero gets AQ in CO and Villian 1 limps / Villain 2 limps / hero goes $20 - random SB and BB call, and villain 1 and 2 call.

A68

Checks to hero and I go $60
fold
fold
Villain 1 calls
Villain 2 jams $220 total to hero

Villain 1 is deep and covers behind.

Hero?

all-in. you got the backdoor nut flush draw. im not worried about villain 1 having us beat in this spot.

Insta fold

Call, we should not be worried about villain 1 unless he ships on top of our call

sick, all 3 options have been used

Calling, but not liking it. The SPR is to small for us though to fold to the 220 allin. The ranges we face with the amount that is in the pot is likely wide enough for us to be ahead a decent amount with AQ here.

However as others have mentioned i am planning on folding if villain 1 shoves over the top with deep stacks behind in a dry sidepot.

was v2 telegraphing his jam before he did it / did v1 look at him/take time before he called? That would be the only reason I'd be worried about being behind to v1.

Absent of that, I am calling. We should have the best hand + will have position in a dry side-pot if v1 calls + BDNFD back-up if necessary.

This is obviously a troll post. I don't think we are ever folding in this spot. I'm calling and folding to a shove. I don't think a shove really accomplishes anything other than being instacalled behind us when we are beat.

I find playing deep tough.

Are we surprised we went 5ways? I'm guessing since we're on the Button versus only 2 limpers that we are. So not love with our result, although guessing it was unexpected. I probably go $25 preflop to target the smaller stack (setting up a trivial stack off situation postflop with TP if I end up HU against him).

Postflop I'm typically in bet/fold mode against the shorter stacks (although thanks to SPR stack commitment issues will arise fairly quickly), and if I end up HU against the deeper stack on later streets I more aim to getting to showdown cheaply. So I'm cool with our flop bet, and I now fold. V2 looks like he's just limp/calling and then folding when he doesn't hit a flop, so we should be concerned here when he's willing to jam (especially versus 2 opponents). Plus V1 could possibly be sitting on a monster.

GcluelessNLnoobG

With an SPR of 2.2 this is a call against the jammer. I see absolutely no reason to rejam as you're just getting called by a better hand. If we call the flop and v1 jams then I'm folding. If we just call the flop and v1 just calls then I think there's a decent chance we are ahead of him as I would expect him to raise with 2 pair or a set as he will be afraid that you are the one with the flush draw. You could also have a hand like AsKs, AsQs, or AsJs that has top pair and the nut flush draw so if v1 doesn't raise to charge those draws then I believe he caps his range at AQ. If v1 just calls then I believe there's a small chance you could get him off a hand that ties you. We have the As in our hand so that cuts down on the amount of flush draws v1 can have so I'm not as worried about just calling and giving him a free card.

If we call the jam and v1 just calls then I believe I'm betting any turns other than a T or J. If v1 then calls the turn then I'm probably checking back the river if v1 checks to me.

An SPR of 2.2 in a 5way pot simply isn't the same as an SPR of 2.2 in a HU pot, a big reason why I hate the preflop result. Because of the small SPR, I certainly don't hate the idea of calling the check/raisejam. But against passive opponents (which this guy looks to be), it's still fairly meh having given four opponents 16+ implied odds preflop. I mean, does the typical passive opponent with A7o just rip it in here versus a preflop raiser who cbets the flop 5ways and gets a call? Does a passive opponent rip it in with a flush draw / OESD enough here? And on top of that we still can't totally disregard the other player in the hand.

Gpreflopsetupusforamehpostflopdecision,imoG

I don't think it's a troll post. I think it's just a post from someone new to the game that looks to play NL 2 online.

An SPR of 2.2 definitely isn't the same as in a 5 way pot but once we bet the flop and get 2 folds and v2 jams he knows the hand is going to be 3 way at the most. Now if we bet the flop and get jammed on with 3 others to act then I most likely fold. I just think AQ is too strong to fold in this scenario, especially since we are in position against the other big stack with action still to come on the turn and river.

Yup, that's fair enough.

I mean, basically this is why I try my best to not setup these results preflop. As OP states, all 3 options were recommended in the first 3 posts. And my guess (???) is that if we conducted a poll amongst all the regs here that all 3 options would probably get fairly good representation. Which to me seems to suggest we're grasping at straws in this spot, which ain't great, imo.

Like always, as I've always suggested, if you're super confident your postflop line here is 100% best, then you'll have no difficulties with the preflop result. I'm 0% confident in my postflop line here, basically hating all the options about the same and it's not clear to me which one is best.

GimoG

I respect your posts GG tremendously and I usually agree with them but this one I disagree. I think our V-2 can have a huge range of hands that include Ax+, FD, SD and sets. We are only behind A6,A8, 66,88 here. AK/AQ ehh not likely. To me this hand screams FD looking to maximize if he hits and if everyone folds then even better. The only info we have is he bought in for $400 and folded a few times after calling some raises, doesn't give us a whole lot of info that we can totally disregard him jamming with any FD or SD.

Second villain complicates things slightly but I think we can safely fold on any jam from him, see the turn and then re-evaluate since we have position.

I'm feeling pretty good about my hand at this point as well.

True, good point.

That's fair enough, our reads definitely aren't rock solid, that's for sure.

However, what would you think a "typical" every day run-of-the-mill player would do here with a flush draw or OESD after a bet and a call? Until shown otherwise, I would default most players to simply calling here and seeing if they can hit their hand, no? To default to otherwise would suggest our opponent is at least somewhat aggressive, and yet we haven't seen any evidence of that.

Gwaitingformoreevidence,imoG

DJ or GG, can you setup a poll with the following 4 options? I'm curious to see the results.

a. fold to villain 2's jam
b. call villain 2's jam/call if villain 1 rejams
c. call villain 2's jam/fold if villain 1 rejams
d. raise/go all in facing villain 2's jam

I don't know how to do that

Sick spot, someone needs to do the maths in equilab so we can see what our equity is vs. both villains ranges.

Yeah, I don't know how to do that either. Can probably just sift thru the thread results when it has run its course and see what the consensus is (although looks like calling has early lead).

GcluelesspolltakingnoobG

You guys are thinking way too passively and scared advocating a call. Calling allows V1 to come along with us and hit his draw on the turn getting really good odds. Why should we do that? On the off-chance miniscule amount of times he's going to be slowplaying two pair or a set? When that happens we still have backdoor nutflush and backdoor full-house draws. Better yet our jam probably gets him off AK some of the time too which is almost certainly not going anywhere if we just call.

Dont be so scared you pussies.

Getting in 2% of our stack preflop just to stack off postflop with TP2K all in the name of protecting against a draw that may or may not be out there and is only going to hit 1 out of 5 times (plus we should be able to get away from in a protected pot with 0 side pot) seems terrible to me.

ETA: Although, oddly enough, in my game I'm fairly certain most players would fold 66 more often than not and probably seriously consider folding 88 (depending on what our image is).

GbutIsuckatdeepstackG

when did you get that undertitle?

Respek!

I think its good in theory but against low stakes players who play more face up im not sure it's ideal. I hate calling $220 and folding. Also jammin $1000 should have good fold equity and we are sometimes good against the shover