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Is this standard shove? Is this standard shove?

05-03-2010 , 11:51 AM
playing 2-100 spread with just under $100 4 limpers to me in cutoff with KcTc, I raise to 15 get two callers.
Flop: K 8 2 two clubs, ck to me, I bet 20, EP raises to 40 MP folds I push.

TP second nut flush, seems pretty standard, but currious as to thoughts on this.

EP has been fairly unpredictable, I didn't put him on bigger K or AA because of PF limp, but figure even he shows up with AK or AA (highly unlikely) my shove is still justifiable.

Last edited by Rapini; 05-03-2010 at 02:55 PM. Reason: Moved from B&M to LLNL.
Is this standard shove? Quote
05-03-2010 , 11:55 AM
uhhh... yes...
Is this standard shove? Quote
05-03-2010 , 12:11 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by shdBfish'n
Is this standard shove?
No, I think this qualifies as a fistpump shove.
Is this standard shove? Quote
05-03-2010 , 02:42 PM
thought so. I just seem to be running really bad in situations like these that seem obvious. thanks.
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05-03-2010 , 03:06 PM
Isn't the flop bet a little on the small size ($20 into a ~$50 pot in a multiway pot)?
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05-03-2010 , 03:28 PM
I have a question about the OP. Is it standard to raise limpers in the CO with a hand like KTs?
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05-03-2010 , 03:31 PM
The only reason not to shove to the RR is that the villain would fold.
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05-03-2010 , 03:49 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by nddst
I have a question about the OP. Is it standard to raise limpers in the CO with a hand like KTs?
There is no "standard". There is no formula for playing live sslnl.

Raising a hand like Axs or Kxs from LP in a live game will depend on the game dynamics, the limper's tendencies, your image, etc, etc. Bottom line "it depends".

If I have a image that does not infer LAG, and trends towards "tight" and my limper(s) tend to be fit or fold players, I will raise Axs/Kxs more times than not, limp some times and fold it some yet smaller amount. So something like 60/35/5. I am less likely to get too crazy with TPxK hands post flop. I expect to cbet the flop and take it down about 2/3 of the time against fit or fold players, maybe 3/4 of the time when they are also weak/tight types.

But all that goes out the window when the limpers tendencies change.
Is this standard shove? Quote
05-03-2010 , 03:58 PM
Always get it in with this.
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05-03-2010 , 04:03 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Percula
There is no "standard". There is no formula for playing live sslnl.

Raising a hand like Axs or Kxs from LP in a live game will depend on the game dynamics, the limper's tendencies, your image, etc, etc. Bottom line "it depends".

If I have a image that does not infer LAG, and trends towards "tight" and my limper(s) tend to be fit or fold players, I will raise Axs/Kxs more times than not, limp some times and fold it some yet smaller amount. So something like 60/35/5. I am less likely to get too crazy with TPxK hands post flop. I expect to cbet the flop and take it down about 2/3 of the time against fit or fold players, maybe 3/4 of the time when they are also weak/tight types.

But all that goes out the window when the limpers tendencies change.

You can make an argument that nothing in any form of poker is standard. Everything is player - game dependent - regardless of the decision. There are some solid posts in the online forums regarding this. Some decisions are "standard" in the sense that the line is generally accepted in the vast majority of cases as the optimal line.

Villain should be stacking off due to his equity in pot (and even sometimes for value (i.e. nut flush). Given pot size and stack sizes, he is committed to shoving here regardless of opponent. He never has FE (unless EP is bad), but he has a minimum of 38% - 40% equity - which is enough to make this a proper shove with size of pot.
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05-03-2010 , 07:06 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by gobbledygeek
Isn't the flop bet a little on the small size ($20 into a ~$50 pot in a multiway pot)?
He wants the villain to come along on this uncoordinated board?
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05-03-2010 , 07:10 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by flip2win
Villain should be stacking off due to his equity in pot (and even sometimes for value (i.e. nut flush).
It's just that sometimes assumptions are made in these posts that your villains even know what equity is and what it means. It's like you're putting yourself in the villain's shoes when in fact, he's no where near as good a player as you are.
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