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Old 06-14-2012, 07:09 PM   #1
centurion
 
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PAHWM - QQ may have misplayed every street

9 handed $1/3 game. Some players just left the main table and a couple of new ones sat down. Two main villains in this hand. V1 is young Asian kid with $600, seems like he knows his way around a poker table and I expected him to be a decent player. V2 is late 20s or early 30s white guy with $300, seems like he is just there for fun. Overall the table has been a little loose and fairly passive.

Hero is young Asian guy wearing a dragon hat for crazy Asian gambler image purposes. My image is probably loose aggressive to the players that have been there from the beginning, I showed a c/r bluff on a 5 way flop and got $250 all in with another guy in a straddled pot. He showed 66 to win and I mucked. The two villains just sat down so they haven't seen this.

2-3 other players at the table have 200-300. 2 others have 400-500.

Blinds are $1 and $3. V1 is UTG and raises to $12. UTG+1 folds. Hero is UTG+2 with black QQ. Hero?
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Old 06-14-2012, 07:30 PM   #2
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Re: PAHWM - QQ may have misplayed every street

Raise ldo, if I am not mistaken you are supposed to get mod's to approve PAHWM's if you didn't know already.
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Old 06-14-2012, 07:40 PM   #3
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Re: PAHWM - QQ may have misplayed every street

Oh, didn't know that.

Forgot to mention that there was virtually no 3betting at this table. I saw it twice in 6 hours.
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Old 06-14-2012, 07:41 PM   #4
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Re: PAHWM - QQ may have misplayed every street

Raise between 35-45
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Old 06-14-2012, 08:29 PM   #5
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Re: PAHWM - QQ may have misplayed every street

Please for the love of God tell us you raised. Or put another way, what is the point of having a loose image if you are worried about a 3bet folding out your villains. And if that is the case you should be 3 betting w a 25% range.

Super easy raise $35-$40
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Old 06-14-2012, 09:22 PM   #6
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Re: PAHWM - QQ may have misplayed every street

Well, V1 just sat down so we didn't know anything about each other. I expected him to have a pretty tight UTG opening range, and I didn't want to get 4bet and be forced to fold. If he 4bets it'll be to like 120, and I will have to decide whether to commit or not. I don't know if he 4bets AK, and I don't want to be forced off my hand. Maybe I'm too paranoid and won't get 4bet that often. I decided to call, expecting a couple of other players to call behind and set mine a little. If no one calls behind it's fine with me too.

Hero calls. 1 MP caller, V2 in hijack calls, another calls.
Flop($60) - 5 players: 9 3 2
V1 bets 45. Hero?

Last edited by tw1n_k0i; 06-14-2012 at 09:30 PM.
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Old 06-14-2012, 09:23 PM   #7
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Re: PAHWM - QQ may have misplayed every street

Grunching ...

How big is your stack? Standard 3-bet here.
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Old 06-14-2012, 09:33 PM   #8
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Re: PAHWM - QQ may have misplayed every street

Quote:
Originally Posted by samo View Post
Grunching ...

How big is your stack? Standard 3-bet here.
just under $600. I didn't really want to 3bet because I don't think any worse cold calls, and better definitely doesn't fold. Is this flawed thinking?
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Old 06-14-2012, 09:41 PM   #9
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Re: PAHWM - QQ may have misplayed every street

Again raise between 140-160. Do you like playing hands without knowing where you stand?
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Old 06-14-2012, 10:37 PM   #10
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Re: PAHWM - QQ may have misplayed every street

So instead of a relatively standard raise we'd rather take an "atypical" weak passive line because V is unknown?

As played, there are multiple +EV lines but you have to have the stones to raise. With every street the odds of an action killing card increases. The sooner you raise better your odds for stacking TT/JJ. Otherwise, if A, K, or hits then you will lose value. Given that there is a FD on board that is going to widen both of your ranges meaning it will be harder to read each other for strong hands vs draws... So, we have to man up and not become scared money if/when action gets heavy.
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Old 06-14-2012, 10:45 PM   #11
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Re: PAHWM - QQ may have misplayed every street

Quote:
Originally Posted by iDrownedByTheRiver View Post
Again raise between 140-160. Do you like playing hands without knowing where you stand?
The raise "could" be OK here, but the reasoning is bad
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Old 06-14-2012, 11:04 PM   #12
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Re: PAHWM - QQ may have misplayed every street

Not telling to raise for that reason.

More so continuing from the flat pre-flop
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Old 06-14-2012, 11:14 PM   #13
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Re: PAHWM - QQ may have misplayed every street

This really feels like a must-raise. A flat call on this multiway flop would be even more of a mistake than the flat call you made preflop.

Opponents in the pot easily have flush draws and hands like 9-8 etc here, you need to raise to isolate one of them. If you flat here and its 3-4 ways going into the turn then there are tons of cards you hate to see. Hands like 9-x could make twopair, wheel gutshots could connect, flush draws could hit, and any floaters with overcards can hit an A or K. You definitely don't want to be in this spot on a multiway turn given your position.

Additionally, raising here gives V1 the chance to potentially make a big mistake here by reraising you since his raise would likely be an All-in.

I happily raise at least $120-160 total, depending on the exact stack sizes of the other players behind you.

Last edited by onthefence; 06-14-2012 at 11:41 PM.
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Old 06-15-2012, 12:09 AM   #14
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Re: PAHWM - QQ may have misplayed every street

Quote:
Originally Posted by onthefence View Post
Additionally, raising here gives V1 the chance to potentially make a big mistake here by reraising you since his raise would likely be an All-in.
You raise/call this flop???? At the time I was considering raising, and I decided that if I did raise I would fold to any reraise. Hero definitely has to fold to a cold reraise, but even against a reraise from V1, the best we can hope to see is AhKh. I don't see how V1 has a chance to make a big mistake here.
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Old 06-15-2012, 12:24 AM   #15
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Re: PAHWM - QQ may have misplayed every street

Quote:
Originally Posted by tw1n_k0i View Post
You raise/call this flop???? At the time I was considering raising, and I decided that if I did raise I would fold to any reraise. Hero definitely has to fold to a cold reraise, but even against a reraise from V1, the best we can hope to see is AhKh. I don't see how V1 has a chance to make a big mistake here.
Please explain to me what you think V will do if V has JJ / TT here?

Out of the typical population of 1/2nl players, please tell me what JJ/TT would do if we raised flop?
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