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PAHWM deep stacked against a tricky V PAHWM deep stacked against a tricky V

10-30-2014 , 04:37 PM
Interesting hand. Because of the villains in play and the way the board ran out, you can make a case for folding, calling and raising at every point.

I think the river is a tight fold, but it isn't exactly clear cut. I think what happened is that the villain made an air c-bet on flop, improved to a draw on turn and got there on river. Heart flush draw or QJ seem most likely. However, he could have been probing on turn and is now trying to bluff you off with a weak hand or missed draw himself. In this situation he is putting you on a club draw that missed when you flatted turn. I think this is somewhat unlikely overall though because there are a number of straight draws you could be on also and got there on river.

Your metagame history with villain and villain's betting and bluffing patterns make a big difference here. Against a lot of villains this is a pretty trivial fold on river, and there are some very bluffy villains I would always call here. I don't think would ever be raising river. I don't see any worse that calls a raise and not much better that will fold.
PAHWM deep stacked against a tricky V Quote
10-30-2014 , 07:24 PM
What I can't understand (and I'm making posts to understand things) - what range do we put Villain on here? Backdored hearts and what else?

What are our perceived range here (as he is surely a level three thinker). What can he put us on, calling third for two streets of post flop action?

Also - do we take into consideration that he knows, as well as we do, that V2 will lay down any set or worse on this river?
PAHWM deep stacked against a tricky V Quote
10-30-2014 , 09:33 PM
I'm surprised more people didn't say to raise the turn. At best, V1 has TT or 99 and the rest of his range is most likely folding to a raise. V2 might look you up if he has a light call with an overpair in him, but even if he does, you're still in good shape.

I can't imagine not raising that turn...am I crazy?

The river...wow.

It'd be tough to fold that, but I'm not sure how you're good here.
PAHWM deep stacked against a tricky V Quote
10-31-2014 , 02:48 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by elcebro
What I can't understand (and I'm making posts to understand things) - what range do we put Villain on here? Backdored hearts and what else?
I used to have this problem where I'd play against LAGs and they'd come out betting strong on the turn or river, and they were only repping one hand. In other words, in my head I'd say, "this has to be [the one hand that it looks like]". But then I'd go back and say, "No, it can't JUST be that, that range isn't wide enough. There has to be more." But really, there wasn't more; every time I'd call down in those spots I'd get shown the nuts or a similarly strong hand.

You seem to be having that same problem in this hand. If nothing besides backdoor hearts makes sense, then he has backdoor hearts. Now maybe I'm wrong and there is something else that makes sense, but the general idea is, when only a narrow range makes sense, you're probably up against that narrow range at LLSNL.
PAHWM deep stacked against a tricky V Quote

      
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