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Not Quite Threadworthy--Low Stress Strat Questions Not Quite Threadworthy--Low Stress Strat Questions

08-11-2018 , 02:38 AM
We have closer to 31% against anyone with a piece of this board. Also with people behind us and this short I don't like calling and risking getting jammed on. Our equity further drops to ~27% if 2 people have a piece of the board, making a call unprofitable.

Some of our outs are likely to be in players hands given the calls pre.

Very mediocre spot imo, not that I'm a 5/T player.
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08-12-2018 , 12:15 PM
1/3. Couple of basic line-checks w/ overpairs facing aggression. No reads/history. No live tells. 100BB. Thanks.

H#1

Hero (MP, $300): J J

EP limps $3 , Hero r $15 , Villain (BTN) c $15 ,fold x 3

Flop ($37): 7 5 2

H b $20 , V r $60 , H c $60

Turn ($150): 6

H x , V b $150 , H r $225 all-in

H#2

Hero (MP, $300): K K

EP limps $3 , Hero r $15 , CO c $15 , Villain (BB) c $15 , EP c $15

Flop ($61): 9 8 4

V x , EP x , H b $40 , fold, V r $140 , fold , Hero $245 all-in

Spoiler:
H#1: Villain had 52s
H#2: Villain had 99
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08-12-2018 , 12:35 PM
H1 fold turn absent a read that V will blast off with 86 and the like.

H2 WP
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08-12-2018 , 01:45 PM
I don't like the turn shove on hand #1. We're folding the villain's bluffs and paying off their stronger value hands. I would rather just call and evaluate on the river. We probably should call a third barrel on a brick river, but I wouldn't like it.
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08-12-2018 , 01:45 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by SwolyswoND
H1 fold turn absent a read that V will blast off with 86 and the like.

H2 WP
H#1 I put 88-TT, a few A7s, in his range. Didn't include any semibluffs really.

Edit:

@ Alan - I'd only have $75 behind otr if i call, so not sure why i wouldn't just GII, but otherwise i agree.
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08-12-2018 , 04:04 PM
H1 i just fold otf

H2 i would check flop 4-ways with Kh but ap also folding to flop raise. Range is two pair/sets/strong draws like NFD and combo draws so we cant jam profitably
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08-12-2018 , 04:17 PM
H1 is just very game and v dependent. I'd fold the flop to some. The turn to some. I agree, if you call the turn you must get it in or else v can play some hands perfectly on riv.

Hand 2 is fine. I am checking that flop 0% so so much stuff can call you. No point giving free cards to Pps and aces either.
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08-13-2018 , 01:24 AM
don't cop out with the no reads thing. Everyone can be profiled before they even sit down.

Probably folding H1 to most villains, mostly to the flop raise. Some will go nutso with 88 here depending on our image, so it depends. JJ is meh here overall though.

H2 is a cooler. We should be folding to very very few villains here. Too much in the middle, too many semi-bluffs or weaker made hands in their range to think about folding without a sick read.
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08-13-2018 , 01:43 PM
5/5, is this a mandatory call with 2pair given pot odds despite villains super nutted line?

KQo UTG1
I open to 20, CO and BB call
Flop (65): AQ3dd
X to CO, who bet 35, both BB and I call
Turn (170): Ko
Checks around
River (170): 5o
BB bet 175, I call, CO jams 425
BB tank folds, Hero?

Calling 250 to win 925, getting over 3-1.
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08-13-2018 , 02:11 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by BreakEvenAt1-3
5/5, is this a mandatory call with 2pair given pot odds despite villains super nutted line?

KQo UTG1
I open to 20, CO and BB call
Flop (65): AQ3dd
X to CO, who bet 35, both BB and I call
Turn (170): Ko
Checks around
River (170): 5o
BB bet 175, I call, CO jams 425
BB tank folds, Hero?

Calling 250 to win 925, getting over 3-1.
If the table is full, fold KQo preflop from EP. Flop is a standard fold as well.
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08-13-2018 , 02:15 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by QuantumSurfer
If the table is full, fold KQo preflop from EP. Flop is a standard fold as well.
This, and i would fold to the river raise also despite the good odds as i think villain is never bluffing in this spot, and his valuerange have us smoked.

Overcalling the flop bet is pretty spewy and bad.
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08-13-2018 , 02:48 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Petrucci
This, and i would fold to the river raise also despite the good odds as i think villain is never bluffing in this spot, and his valuerange have us smoked.

Overcalling the flop bet is pretty spewy and bad.
Yeah, don’t know why I called flop - thought BTN could’ve betting worse Q and BB c/c’img with FD but that’s probably wishful thinking. Pre is more marginal IMO, KQ seems too strong to fold pre from any position. I’m mucking KJo and ATo from first 2 spots 9-handed.
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08-13-2018 , 03:10 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by BreakEvenAt1-3
Yeah, don’t know why I called flop - thought BTN could’ve betting worse Q and BB c/c’img with FD but that’s probably wishful thinking. Pre is more marginal IMO, KQ seems too strong to fold pre from any position. I’m mucking KJo and ATo from first 2 spots 9-handed.
You might want to take a look at your PF opening ranges. While I'll occasionally open with it facing very soft competition & rock image, I haven't seen any theory advocating its play from up-front. You can get free pf guides on the net & I haven't seen any from respected sources that open KQo early. While strong overall, you're going to have a hard time realizing your equity. You flop no made hand 67% of the time and TP+ just 28%. There's only one way to flop open ended & that happens just 3% which we still have to play OOP. We have RIO vs AQ & even AK which people do flat pre at these levels. I'd much rather open 98s UTG than KQo.
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08-13-2018 , 04:16 PM
$1/3. V is a 50 y/o Eastern European male fish ($350). HJ opens to $8, V calls, hero ($300) 3! BTN to $40 with KsKc, only V calls. Pot $85.

Flop: A-9d-3d. V donks $50. Hero?

Thanks,
DT
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08-13-2018 , 06:48 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DumbosTrunk
$1/3. V is a 50 y/o Eastern European male fish ($350). HJ opens to $8, V calls, hero ($300) 3! BTN to $40 with KsKc, only V calls. Pot $85.

Flop: A-9d-3d. V donks $50. Hero?

Thanks,
DT
Good sizing pre, vs fish especially. Would you categorize him as passive or aggressive? If A, I'm not folding now, if B, I am.
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08-13-2018 , 06:50 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phil Me Up
Good sizing pre, vs fish especially. Would you categorize him as passive or aggressive? If A, I'm not folding now, if B, I am.
Leans towards aggressive. Earlier in a limped pot he raised 10-2cc on a 6-8c-9c flop and barrelled turn when his straight hit. Because of the two diamonds on board, flush draws were in his range, but I couldn't be sure.
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08-13-2018 , 07:00 PM
He has a variety of Ax, no doubt, but if you think he'll open stuff like K9,T9,98s,97s, and donk 2nd pair / FD type hands, then I think calling & evaluating turns is good. Without reads, it's a default fold.
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08-13-2018 , 08:57 PM
It's an annoying spot. I'd peel one off and see what happens.
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08-13-2018 , 09:08 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phil Me Up
He has a variety of Ax, no doubt, but if you think he'll open stuff like K9,T9,98s,97s, and donk 2nd pair / FD type hands, then I think calling & evaluating turns is good. Without reads, it's a default fold.
He called the initial raise. He was not the intial raiser. Probably same idea though.
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08-14-2018 , 01:14 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DumbosTrunk
He called the initial raise. He was not the intial raiser. Probably same idea though.
My bad. And yes, same idea.

Based on reads you've given (very aggressive on the flop and a "fish" in terms of never folding), I probably peel and see a turn. With that said, you'll be facing & folding to turn aggression at a high %, so I don't mind just giving-up now and waiting for more actionable intelligence.
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08-14-2018 , 04:18 AM
if flop is actually a call, Hero should feel this is true in their heart of hearts in-game otherwise buttons are being clicked imo
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08-14-2018 , 04:22 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by homerdash
if flop is actually a call, Hero should feel this is true in their heart of hearts in-game otherwise buttons are being clicked imo
Yeah I wasn’t feeling it so I just folded....
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08-14-2018 , 01:09 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phil Me Up
1/3. Couple of basic line-checks w/ overpairs facing aggression. No reads/history. No live tells. 100BB. Thanks.

H#1

Hero (MP, $300): J J

EP limps $3 , Hero r $15 , Villain (BTN) c $15 ,fold x 3

Flop ($37): 7 5 2

H b $20 , V r $60 , H c $60

Turn ($150): 6

H x , V b $150 , H r $225 all-in

H#2

Hero (MP, $300): K K

EP limps $3 , Hero r $15 , CO c $15 , Villain (BB) c $15 , EP c $15

Flop ($61): 9 8 4

V x , EP x , H b $40 , fold, V r $140 , fold , Hero $245 all-in

Spoiler:
H#1: Villain had 52s
H#2: Villain had 99
If I don't feel comfortable folding to flop raises, then I don't bet.

So as played, I fold both times because I don't feel I'm committed (first hand is a lot easier due to a lot easier to manage SPR than the second one thanks to our preflop result).

GcluelessNLnoobG
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08-15-2018 , 04:58 AM
$1/3
Nit - $200
Hero - $1000
V - $1500

V is running like God, but also playing decent, very TAG for the most part especially pre. Has only really shown down premium hands. He's 3-betting premiums rather large like $15 to $60, he's playing pairs, suited broadways, etc
Nit makes it $15 UTG, I call with AQ and Villain calls in SB.
I'm just not 3-betting this guy here, as he'll shove JJ+ and AQ/AKs on me if I make it $40-$55... I'll take a flop

Q2Q ($50)

V checks, Nit checks, he's done with the hand, I bet $30, Villain calls

5 ($110)

V checks, I bet $75, calls

3 ($260)

V quickly bets $225
V has shown zero bluffs all night... at this level does he just 100% have 22, 55 and A4hh
Is he really doing this with QJ or KQ?

Last edited by Rmbxr9; 08-15-2018 at 05:05 AM.
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08-15-2018 , 12:36 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rmbxr9
$1/3
Nit - $200
Hero - $1000
V - $1500

V is running like God, but also playing decent, very TAG for the most part especially pre. Has only really shown down premium hands. He's 3-betting premiums rather large like $15 to $60, he's playing pairs, suited broadways, etc
Nit makes it $15 UTG, I call with AQ and Villain calls in SB.
I'm just not 3-betting this guy here, as he'll shove JJ+ and AQ/AKs on me if I make it $40-$55... I'll take a flop

Q2Q ($50)

V checks, Nit checks, he's done with the hand, I bet $30, Villain calls

5 ($110)

V checks, I bet $75, calls

3 ($260)

V quickly bets $225
V has shown zero bluffs all night... at this level does he just 100% have 22, 55 and A4hh
Is he really doing this with QJ or KQ?
Our IO vs RIO suck regarding a nit's UTG opening range with hands like AQo, especially against his shortstack. So the only reason to continue (imo) is if we know a deep dominated whale will get involved (where we can make money off of him once the nit drops out of the hand). So I fold preflop for this reason.

I don't think the nit is done with the hand just cuz he checked the flop; he could easily have checked AA/KK or big underpairs and may pay off a bet or two, no? I'm fine with betting when checked to as it looks like we could be betting literally anything, but I'm also fine with checking and attempting to get value on later streets.

I'm fine with the turn bet.

I just don't think most general opponents make almost-full-and-large PSB blocking bets with weaker Qx. They either bet something like $100 (what they are willing to pay) or check/call. And busted draws are much more likely to bluff against weakness (i.e. a turn check back) than they are constant strength. I don't hate a nit fold here at all, although obviously we don't have to be right all that often to call (but it still seems meh).

GcluelessNLnoobG
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