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trouble hand or standard shove? trouble hand or standard shove?

01-07-2014 , 02:46 PM
The starting stacks are almost all around 300 at this particular table, the big stack with 700 folds. I open in mp with AKto 16(my standard raise) and get 3bet by the small blind to 36. And I call.

The small blind is a new player to the table who I know nothing about. I assume him to be strong in this position since he is new.

The flop comes 2 5 10 and he leads out for 75. We both started this hand with around 300. With only like 200 behind I ship it all in. He calls.

Is this a standard shoving spot where im going to want to play for stacks? I know he is strong is this spot im not confused about his hand at all. Im thinking about my preflop call and my shove on the flop.
trouble hand or standard shove? Quote
01-07-2014 , 02:58 PM
yes it is pretty standard.

you often aren't generating a ton of fold equity, but your flush equity alone is almost good enough, and most of he time you have additional outs to aces or kings.
trouble hand or standard shove? Quote
01-07-2014 , 03:02 PM
assuming this is a 1/2 game there is $74 in the pot pre flop he bets out more than the pot so otf it is $150 and you jam for more than the pot?! he either has 1010 or 55 or an over pair JJ+ against an overpair you are not that bad in shape but a call would be better against a set you have a lot of cards you have to dodge over all bad bad play
trouble hand or standard shove? Quote
01-07-2014 , 03:08 PM
I think you call there and see the turn. He has overpair, a set or maybe AT but even there, not sure he snap calls.

I fold before i shove
trouble hand or standard shove? Quote
01-07-2014 , 03:08 PM
Can't see how you can do anything besides ship it.
trouble hand or standard shove? Quote
01-07-2014 , 03:20 PM
if his range contains anything but AA and KK it's an easy ship. Even if it's just KK+ it's probably still a ship.
trouble hand or standard shove? Quote
01-07-2014 , 03:23 PM
This is a spot where people will differ in opinion all the time ... know the math and know your opponent. Will you get paid off? Against an unknown better to press the action IMO.

You are calling $75 into $150 and shoving $200 more (into $225) so in both cases you are about 2:1 with your money if the shove is called. This is good money except against sets where you are about 25% to win and AA where its an even money venture. You are even ahead of QQ in this spot with 2 cards to go and only slightly behind KK.

This is a spot where you play poker/gamble if you have another bullet. You might even get a fold here from an opponent who 'knows' the flush is coming. GL
trouble hand or standard shove? Quote
01-07-2014 , 05:01 PM
I think calling is actually pretty bad here. you are only about 30% to improve on the turn card, and almost every card the improves your hand is going to be a huge action killer for the villain.

You still have fold equity, there's lots of money in the pot, and you are still close to 50% against his snap-call range (QQ+)
trouble hand or standard shove? Quote
01-07-2014 , 09:15 PM
on this particular hand im going to rule out 22-99. I dont see a new player to the table 3betting a smaller pair than 10s out of position. I Put him on 1010+
trouble hand or standard shove? Quote
01-07-2014 , 09:39 PM
Shove all day long.

ProPokerTools Hold'em Simulation
20,790 trials (Exhaustive)
board: 2 5 T
Hand Pot equity Wins Ties
AdKd46.95% 9,74727
TT,JJ,QQ,KK,AA53.05% 11,01627
trouble hand or standard shove? Quote
01-07-2014 , 09:42 PM
Grunch: ya shove.


I'm concerned by the statement, "my standard raise." Please explain.
trouble hand or standard shove? Quote
01-07-2014 , 09:44 PM
I think his 3! screams KK+. He knows you are not gonna fold for $20. He wants value. His bet on the full pot to protect from draws for his KK+. So in my opinion your over cards doesn't have much equity in here. You have only fd equity. It's still arguable shipping or folding. I think you don't have fold equity here. So when you ship you become fishy asian gambler. I can find fold here after investing just $36 rather shipping $264. His bet sizing tells everything.
trouble hand or standard shove? Quote
01-07-2014 , 09:46 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by radioheadfan
Shove all day long.

ProPokerTools Hold'em Simulation
20,790 trials (Exhaustive)
board: 2 5 T
Hand Pot equity Wins Ties
AdKd46.95% 9,74727
TT,JJ,QQ,KK,AA53.05% 11,01627
This.

Add in the fact that if we give him a 10% chance to fold, and the dead money in the pot, shoving is fine.
trouble hand or standard shove? Quote
01-07-2014 , 09:52 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by farrique
I think his 3! screams KK+. He knows you are not gonna fold for $20. He wants value. His bet on the full pot to protect from draws for his KK+. So in my opinion your over cards doesn't have much equity in here. You have only fd equity. It's still arguable shipping or folding. I think you don't have fold equity here. So when you ship you become fishy asian gambler. I can find fold here after investing just $36 rather shipping $264. His bet sizing tells everything.
Ick.

1. You realize you're a coin flip vs. KK at this point right?
2. How can you put him on exactly KK? Due to blockers it's much more likely he has QQ which you're actually AHEAD of. If you're not shipping it here, you have a big leak.
trouble hand or standard shove? Quote
01-07-2014 , 09:59 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by spikeraw22
Grunch: ya shove.


I'm concerned by the statement, "my standard raise." Please explain.
I usually raise around 12 to 16 at the 1/3 level depending on the table there will be alot of people who will limp and call light so I bump it up a little more to try and play against one player usually.
trouble hand or standard shove? Quote
01-07-2014 , 10:01 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by iraisetoomuch
This.

Add in the fact that if we give him a 10% chance to fold, and the dead money in the pot, shoving is fine.
he almost folded too. He asked me if i had a set and I sat there and didnt say anything. he tanked for about 2min, then called
trouble hand or standard shove? Quote
01-07-2014 , 10:32 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by dustizzl13
he almost folded too. He asked me if i had a set and I sat there and didnt say anything. he tanked for about 2min, then called
Well played then. Sorry you didnt win.
trouble hand or standard shove? Quote

      
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