Board texture

[nddst]

You raise in mp with AKo

You are called by hijack, button and bb.

Rate these boards on cbet frequency.

QTx r

589 two suit

QQ3r

Q33r

J89 two suit

Q89r

234r

665 two suit

Discuss...

Add your own.

[masaraksh]

Originally Posted by nddst

You raise in mp with AKo

You are called by hijack, button and bb.

Rate these boards on cbet frequency.

QTx r

^ not the worst (since we actually have decent equity), but 4way its close, will cbet 4way at mid/low freq

589 two suit

check/fold, 4way, almost always (even HU might c/f) cbet freq 4way very low

QQ3r

medium. for some reason i feel like people love to float/bluff these boards

Q33r

better than above & great for several barrels

J89 two suit

check/fold, 4way, almost always (even HU might c/f) cbet freq pretty much zero... pretty much same as 589

Q89r

same as above

234r

not bad. if 3-way/HU i might chk/call against some players for value. we're ahead of all unpaired hands and if some donk flatted pre with like Q7s and I check they are damn well betting. re-eval turn... you can own a lot of people this way.

665 two suit

medium

Discuss...

Add your own.

as for adding my own opinion:

Our options when we are PFR aren't binary - as in 0) to cbet and 1) to not cbet and c/f. Apart from the obv ones we can chk/call to induce bluffs (and for other reasons....) AND there are def good spots to check/raise bluff as PFR.

[nddst]

Originally Posted by masaraksh

Our options when we are PFR aren't binary - as in 0) to cbet and 1) to not cbet and c/f. Apart from the obv ones we can chk/call to induce bluffs (and for other reasons....) AND there are def good spots to check/raise bluff as PFR.

Just wondering what 2+2 players cbet boards look like. I would esp like you opinion M.

[NJBoss]

In an overwhelmingly large percentage of the 1/2 and 2/5 games I play in, I am generally not cbetting any of these boards 4-handed. I don't think you bet through 4 players very often (i.e. <20%), though it does help slightly that the last caller would be OOP compared to you.

Best candidate is the Q33 board.

Also potentially of note: I check top pair big kicker with far greater frequency than your average winning player at LLSNL, so my checks on the flop don't often get abused by thinking players at this level.

[TheBenfer]

Obviously a lot of this has to do with table image, opponents, etc. But if I have a tight-aggressive image and my oponents are typical loose passive players:

Your callers are mostly going to have small pairs, suited connectors, and weak Aces.

I like C-Betting a lot on the QQ3 and Q33 rainbows. I think you take most pots down and if someone calls you need to slow down. I'd make it a smallish bet in most cases though - you're trying to get people out who hit nothing at all and you don't need to risk much to do that. And if anyone calls there just aren't any draws out there so I'm looking to check-fold after that.

QTx rainbow I'd actually C-bet a good percentage of the time - this one is much more dependent on my image and my opponents. But this is actually a good flop for you, I think. If someone hit a Q, so be it. But weak Aces or small pairs really aren't going to like this flop (unless they hit the "x"). And a lot of the lower connectors won't have much of a draw either.

J98 and Q98 I would not normally C-Bet. You are behind too often and there are too many people that will stick around to see another card. With two players left to act, if either one of them calls you it makes your turn play very difficult.

234r I don't like, but for a slightly different reason. Nobody is going to believe you have squat (unless they figure you for a big pocket pair). So anyone with a medium pair who was set-mining is thinking about hanging around, plus anyone with an Ace who thinks they might have a best hand and also picked up a wheel draw.

665 two-suited I hate more than the rest. Too many of your opponents will now have draws, made hands, or overcards. Just check-fold on this one.

That's my two cents...

[venice10]

TBH, this thread is about useless. Stack size, player characteristics, and size of initial bet all play a role. Board texture is important, but not the only factor. For the most part, cbetting into 3 players oop is usually -EV with AK in LLSNL. It is the hand all the fish put you on.

[nanpa]

Originally Posted by TheBenfer

Obviously a lot of this has to do with table image, opponents, etc. But if I have a tight-aggressive image and my oponents are typical loose passive players:

Your callers are mostly going to have small pairs, suited connectors, and weak Aces.

I like C-Betting a lot on the QQ3 and Q33 rainbows. I think you take most pots down and if someone calls you need to slow down. I'd make it a smallish bet in most cases though - you're trying to get people out who hit nothing at all and you don't need to risk much to do that. And if anyone calls there just aren't any draws out there so I'm looking to check-fold after that.

QTx rainbow I'd actually C-bet a good percentage of the time - this one is much more dependent on my image and my opponents. But this is actually a good flop for you, I think. If someone hit a Q, so be it. But weak Aces or small pairs really aren't going to like this flop (unless they hit the "x"). And a lot of the lower connectors won't have much of a draw either.

J98 and Q98 I would not normally C-Bet. You are behind too often and there are too many people that will stick around to see another card. With two players left to act, if either one of them calls you it makes your turn play very difficult.

234r I don't like, but for a slightly different reason. Nobody is going to believe you have squat (unless they figure you for a big pocket pair). So anyone with a medium pair who was set-mining is thinking about hanging around, plus anyone with an Ace who thinks they might have a best hand and also picked up a wheel draw.

665 two-suited I hate more than the rest. Too many of your opponents will now have draws, made hands, or overcards. Just check-fold on this one.

That's my two cents...

Excellent summary, something i'd not thought through

[gobbledygeek]

In a 4way pot, and OOP to 2 of the opponents, my default would be to not cbet any of these boards. The ones I would come closest to considering are the Q33r and QQ3r boards.

GcluelessNLnoobG

[AnniesBoobs]

You shouldn't cbet these flop OOP 4ways