|
|
| Live Low-stakes NL Discussion of up to 3/5 live no-limit, pot-limit and spread-limit Texas Hold'em poker games, situations and strategies. |
05-27-2012, 03:22 PM
|
#1
|
|
journeyman
Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 317
|
$2/$5 TPGK OTT
$2/$5 at the local casino.
Hero ($450, HJ+1): Been to the table around a half hour, have only played one hand where I iso-raised a limper in position with J-10o and ended up winning one bet on a Q-10-8-5-4ss board.
V1 ($220, CO): 40 year old white man. Seems like the table fish. He bought in for $200, and so far hes called a fair amount of raises pre (probably about 1/3 of the time, although the sample size is very small). He chipped up early on without showdown, but limp-called UTG+1 with Q-9s and lost to Q-10o on a Q-high board. He also called a $25 raise pre from the blinds with $130 behind, and when the initial raiser bet $60 on an A-Q-5 flop, V1 string bet by saying "call $60, and raise $70" so I'm assuming hes not a casino reg.
V2($300, BTN): 40 year old white woman. She also seems pretty loose and passive so far. With my J-10o hand, she called my raise from the blinds with K-Jo, then check/called my c-bet, and checked it down when she missed.
Pre ($7): All folds to hero, hero has A  -J  and raises to $20, V1 calls, V2 calls.
Flop: ($62): A  -9  -6 
Hero bets $30, V1 calls, V2 calls.
Turn ($152): 7 
Hero checks, V1 bets $50 with $120 behind. V2 folds. Hero?
|
|
|
05-27-2012, 03:37 PM
|
#2
|
|
Pooh-Bah
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Barcelona
Posts: 4,014
|
Re: $2/$5 TPGK OTT
Did you see showdown on the hand he tried to raise? Seems important.
And with these villains/stacksizes I prefer $50 on the flop, shove turn.
|
|
|
05-27-2012, 03:45 PM
|
#3
|
|
journeyman
Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 317
|
Re: $2/$5 TPGK OTT
Quote:
Originally Posted by quesuerte
Did you see showdown on the hand he tried to raise? Seems important.
And with these villains/stacksizes I prefer $50 on the flop, shove turn.
|
No, on the A-Q-5 board, the raiser bet $60 and folded to a $70 shove with A-9o...wtf?
|
|
|
05-27-2012, 03:48 PM
|
#4
|
|
old hand
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 1,563
|
Re: $2/$5 TPGK OTT
Your c-bet is quite small. What was your reason for checking the turn?
|
|
|
05-27-2012, 04:34 PM
|
#5
|
|
journeyman
Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 317
|
Re: $2/$5 TPGK OTT
Quote:
Originally Posted by fatmanonguitar
Your c-bet is quite small. What was your reason for checking the turn?
|
I normally c-bet 1/2 pot on dry boards. And the real hand played out where I bet the turn, but after the hand I talked to some friends about this hand and they agreed that by betting the turn, I'm overrepping my hand and will likely only receive action from better hands, and I have a hand that's usually great for two streets of value. Also, if I bet the turn, I'm committing myself against V1 and possibly V2. So I posted this here to see what the proper line would be if I check the turn and face aggression against somewhat short-stacked opponents
|
|
|
05-27-2012, 04:45 PM
|
#6
|
|
Pooh-Bah
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Barcelona
Posts: 4,014
|
Re: $2/$5 TPGK OTT
Quote:
Originally Posted by bball fan 82
I normally c-bet 1/2 pot on dry boards. And the real hand played out where I bet the turn, but after the hand I talked to some friends about this hand and they agreed that by betting the turn, I'm overrepping my hand and will likely only receive action from better hands, and I have a hand that's usually great for two streets of value. Also, if I bet the turn, I'm committing myself against V1 and possibly V2. So I posted this here to see what the proper line would be if I check the turn and face aggression against somewhat short-stacked opponents
|
I think this is a somewhat lazy habit to get into. Given the description of villains what you normally do is not as important as what makes most money.
IME you'll get lots of hands that will basically call any size bet on the flop to around pot but fold turn. It is barreling rather than sizing that induces folds so we want to get max value from a tonne of stuff on the flop.
In hands like this, with this type of villain ans stack size, villains will accidentally play the turn pretty well against your actual hand so get money in on the flop.
|
|
|
05-27-2012, 04:50 PM
|
#7
|
|
journeyman
Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 317
|
Re: $2/$5 TPGK OTT
Quote:
Originally Posted by quesuerte
I think this is a somewhat lazy habit to get into. Given the description of villains what you normally do is not as important as what makes most money.
IME you'll get lots of hands that will basically call any size bet on the flop to around pot but fold turn. It is barreling rather than sizing that induces folds so we want to get max value from a tonne of stuff on the flop.
In hands like this, with this type of villain ans stack size, villains will accidentally play the turn pretty well against your actual hand so get money in on the flop.
|
Ya, I usually have a pretty exploitable c-bet sizing in the $1/$3 game since nobody really pays attention to sizing, and this was one of my first times playing $2/$5 in a while, so I just told myself to be non-exploitable to start the session, even if that meant sacrificing a little bit of equity. In retrospect, since I pegged the two villains as fish, though, you're right that I should have bet more since I've already seen them call down lightly within the past few orbits.
|
|
|
05-27-2012, 06:10 PM
|
#8
|
|
journeyman
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Oklahoma
Posts: 226
|
Re: $2/$5 TPGK OTT
I don't agree with checking on the turn especially if you plan on calling. If you wanna take a check line. C/r the flop instead of bet then c/c. Granted you would still ve over repping hand but you find out a lot more info with the same amount of bets.
That being said, I still prefer bet out on each street and re-evaluate if you are raised. Both players are fish do their ranged include drawing hands and weaker aces.
|
|
|
05-27-2012, 06:38 PM
|
#9
|
|
centurion
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 163
|
Re: $2/$5 TPGK OTT
flop bet is fine, i'd prefer a little more. but when you check turn now, it just looks so extremely weak combined with small flop bet that you must call. He can bet a5-a4-a3-a2 a-8 a-10 or even think 7-8 bet will be good against a scared KK QQ JJ 10 10.
you may think you are overrep by betting but actualyl are underrepping by checking. you checked a non scare card. for sure he may already have two pair or set, but i'm much rather to bet $50 and fold to shove, than to check fold or check call here. if he calls $50, then the river is very tough decision for you, but at least you have more info to act on. because then you know he knows that you got an ace
|
|
|
05-27-2012, 06:38 PM
|
#10
|
|
old hand
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 1,563
|
Re: $2/$5 TPGK OTT
You gave a great description of V and he apparently is happy to call value bets w TPNK. You can easily b/f your hand or check for pot control on the turn against better opponents who are deeper but not here. Any flop bet is probably going to fold out a small pair or a hand like KQ so you may as well upsize for value and to set up the turn to play for stacks.
|
|
|
05-27-2012, 07:08 PM
|
#11
|
|
journeyman
Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 317
|
Re: $2/$5 TPGK OTT
Quote:
Originally Posted by iDrownedByTheRiver
I don't agree with checking on the turn especially if you plan on calling. If you wanna take a check line. C/r the flop instead of bet then c/c. Granted you would still ve over repping hand but you find out a lot more info with the same amount of bets.
That being said, I still prefer bet out on each street and re-evaluate if you are raised. Both players are fish do their ranged include drawing hands and weaker aces.
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by shaveurself
flop bet is fine, i'd prefer a little more. but when you check turn now, it just looks so extremely weak combined with small flop bet that you must call. He can bet a5-a4-a3-a2 a-8 a-10 or even think 7-8 bet will be good against a scared KK QQ JJ 10 10.
you may think you are overrep by betting but actualyl are underrepping by checking. you checked a non scare card. for sure he may already have two pair or set, but i'm much rather to bet $50 and fold to shove, than to check fold or check call here. if he calls $50, then the river is very tough decision for you, but at least you have more info to act on. because then you know he knows that you got an ace
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by fatmanonguitar
You gave a great description of V and he apparently is happy to call value bets w TPNK. You can easily b/f your hand or check for pot control on the turn against better opponents who are deeper but not here. Any flop bet is probably going to fold out a small pair or a hand like KQ so you may as well upsize for value and to set up the turn to play for stacks.
|
It appears that the consensus is to just keep betting and play for stacks vs both villains since both of these players appear to be typical loose-passives. In the real hand, I bet $65 OTT (planning to shove almost all rivers), V1 shoved for $105 more and, getting over 3.5-1, I called. When I play, I almost always take the most aggressive line, especially if I'm going to call or play for stacks either way, but one of the main reasons I posted this was because I was curious about if there is ever a scenario where you would c/f OTT, even though you under-repped your hand.
Let's assume that for whatever reason you decide to check the turn. What do you do on the turn if...?
a) You check, V1 bets $50?
b) You check, V1 bets $100?
c) You check, V1 shoves?
d) You check, V1 bets $50, V2 calls?
e) You check, V1 checks, V2 bets $60 (remember, in a previous hand she check/called with an OESD OTF and just checked both streets when she missed, so she seems the most passive out of the two villains)
f) You bet $65, V2 shoves for $185 more?
|
|
|
05-27-2012, 10:04 PM
|
#12
|
|
Pooh-Bah
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Dallas, TX
Posts: 3,715
|
Re: $2/$5 TPGK OTT
Why do you have these 2 huge fish to your left? Change seats or get up. Also, I'd raise more pre with these 2 donks on my left.
|
|
|
| Thread Tools |
|
|
| Display Modes |
Linear Mode
|
Posting Rules
|
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts
HTML code is Off
|
|
|
All times are GMT -4. The time now is 10:37 AM.
|