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| Live Low-stakes NL Discussion of up to 3/5 live no-limit, pot-limit and spread-limit Texas Hold'em poker games, situations and strategies. |
06-14-2012, 02:25 PM
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#1
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Carpal \'Tunnel
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Don't mess with the Big Puddin.
Posts: 6,051
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2/5 shorthanded fun
At my local room feeder games into the main game are often shorthanded. Often at least one or two players do not know how to adjust and these games are really fun.
5 handed. Hero in BB with 7  5  .
Villain on my right lost two buyins quickly(none of it to me). He left the table and had just returned a few hands ago. Stack $450. This guy played loose, strong and aggressive but I could not tell yet whether this was "his style" or if he was trying to adjust to shorthanded play. Middle aged, tough but friendly looking.
Hero has $550 and a tightish image. Have only won one pot in three or four orbits and it was a decent sized pot I stole on the turn from the best thinking player at the table.
UTG limps, CO limps, Button limps, SB calls, Hero checks.
Flop($25/family): 6  5  2 
Checks around.
I hate small pots. The most aggressive players were CO and Button.
Turn($25/family): 7 
SB bets $20, Hero raises to $65, folds to SB calls.
SB took about 15 seconds before calling.
I don't think he is check-raise guy so it is unlikely he whiffed that otf, though a 6 is still in his range. He is capable of leading the turn with a wide variety of hands. His call though slices a world of hands off the top of his range.
Do you like my turn raise? Can I comfortably fold to a 3-bet?
What do you suppose he puts me on when he calls the turn?
River($155/HU): 6 
SB bets $75, Hero...
I think the question here is not "is my hand good?" The questions are "what hands does villain bet here?" and "what better hands will he lay down to a raise?"
I will stop there and let you boys and girls do your magic. Comments on all streets welcomed!
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06-14-2012, 03:08 PM
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#2
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enthusiast
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 75
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Re: 2/5 shorthanded fun
blah not a fun river!
i like your turn raise, i think you could comfortably fold to a 3-bet since he potted the turn. im guessing he's not really putting you on a range maybe if i had to guess i'd say a strong semi bluff, 7x, 2p.
his limping range is super wide, so the flop could very likely hit his range.
his bet on the turn could be a scared 6x or 7x with a check on the flop. but with his hesitation with you raise, i dont see him playing a 7x or betting a draw on the turn with the long pause to call. if he's play 89 or 34 here or even 2p i feel that he'd raise. i feel like it's weighted toward 6x and him not believing you/being loose etc.... so he flats your raise.
on the river, he knows you're clearly interested in the hand, namely on the turn with your raise. another 6 on the river im going to have to say he's bet smells value-ish so i feel like it's 6x. i also feel like it's possible we're behind 7x with a better kicker. i dont see any worse hands betting the turn, calling the raise on turn and leading the river. i think it's a fold. cant see him laying a hand down here.
Last edited by pampers; 06-14-2012 at 03:15 PM.
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06-14-2012, 03:20 PM
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#3
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Carpal \'Tunnel
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Wearing a purse
Posts: 11,454
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Re: 2/5 shorthanded fun
bets a 6 or a FH, is never folding, dont bluff, dont call
ez game
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06-14-2012, 03:32 PM
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#4
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old hand
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 1,501
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Re: 2/5 shorthanded fun
Quote:
Originally Posted by dhcg86
bets a 6 or a FH, is never folding, dont bluff, dont call
ez game
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This sounds about right to me, but I'm not sure how clear our read is on villain. If this was a typical "decent" 1/2 reg, then this advice would be spot on.
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06-14-2012, 03:33 PM
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#5
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old hand
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 1,287
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Re: 2/5 shorthanded fun
i like a slightly larger raise 70-80. i dont think hes b/c with just naked 6 here ott i think he could have 68/69, FD, 27/a7/k7 type hands, that is if hes completing sb here 100% which i assume he is being short and the table limping to him.
i think he bets obv all his 6's and his busted draws. i dont know if hes thinking enough to bet his 7s here like he might be thinking oh crap i dont know what to do now with my 7 i just bet. so he is going to fold a small part of his range here but im not sure if its enough to make a raise here. also the fact that he has reloaded a few times reduces our FE imo. think about when ur stuck, call call call call call to get unstuck
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06-14-2012, 06:40 PM
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#6
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Carpal \'Tunnel
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Don't mess with the Big Puddin.
Posts: 6,051
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Re: 2/5 shorthanded fun
Quote:
Originally Posted by dhcg86
bets a 6 or a FH, is never folding, dont bluff, dont call
ez game
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Villain does not bet a 7?
It is more likely villain has a 7 than a 6.
Remember hero could have any two cards.
Does anyone think this could be a blocking bet with a hand that wants showdown and wants to set the price?
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06-14-2012, 06:44 PM
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#7
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Carpal \'Tunnel
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Don't mess with the Big Puddin.
Posts: 6,051
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Re: 2/5 shorthanded fun
Quote:
Originally Posted by BatsShadow
This sounds about right to me, but I'm not sure how clear our read is on villain. If this was a typical "decent" 1/2 reg, then this advice would be spot on.
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Is villain then check folding hands like A7 and 97/87?
I think we have removed made straights from his range when he does not 3-bet the turn.
Also 65 and sets are highly unlikely so the only hand that boats otr is 76.
Last edited by TripleH68; 06-14-2012 at 06:56 PM.
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06-14-2012, 09:15 PM
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#8
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Carpal \'Tunnel
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Wearing a purse
Posts: 11,454
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Re: 2/5 shorthanded fun
Quote:
Originally Posted by TripleH68
Villain does not bet a 7?
It is more likely villain has a 7 than a 6.
Remember hero could have any two cards.
Does anyone think this could be a blocking bet with a hand that wants showdown and wants to set the price?
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No, once villain bets river, it is more likely villain has a 6 than a 7
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06-14-2012, 09:26 PM
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#9
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centurion
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 172
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Re: 2/5 shorthanded fun
Easy fold.
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06-15-2012, 08:24 AM
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#10
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old hand
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 1,501
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Re: 2/5 shorthanded fun
Quote:
Originally Posted by dhcg86
No, once villain bets river, it is more likely villain has a 6 than a 7
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I agree. He will almost never bet a 7 there because a 7 cannot beat anything.
The bet looks too large to be a blocking bet. I think he either has a 6, and is essentially overplaying it, or he has a busted straight like a naked 8.
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06-15-2012, 08:31 AM
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#11
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Pooh-Bah
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Barcelona
Posts: 4,014
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Re: 2/5 shorthanded fun
How he lost two stacks is pretty important for this hand.
Turn is good, yes fold to a three bet. People don't go bat **** crazy with 56 or 8sxs often enough on this turn to make continuing profitable when 3 bet.
River donk is obviously confusing, although very often these situations are exactly what they look like. 6sxs, 86, 65, 62. I just fold to an unknown. As I said at start, previous hands changes everything.
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06-15-2012, 10:02 AM
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#12
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old hand
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 1,449
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Re: 2/5 shorthanded fun
super polarized spot. this is a 6 or nothing. As stated above, how he lost the other two bullets is very important to making this decision.
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06-15-2012, 10:23 AM
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#13
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enthusiast
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Gainesville FL
Posts: 80
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Re: 2/5 shorthanded fun
I fold the river as played - the only thing you beat is busted FD - half pot into 150 seems too rich for that, esp given your raise on turn. From his perspective, what raises turn and folds river? Only your specific 2 pair hand (or 2-7) or another FD. To me, this reeks of a 6. Incidentally, am I the only person who'd bet out on the flop here? We have a pair!
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06-15-2012, 01:36 PM
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#14
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veteran
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Value-owning myself with 3rd pair
Posts: 2,464
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Re: 2/5 shorthanded fun
I like your thinking, however you should understand that a thinking player here should be considering a hero call to your river raise long and seriously here with any 7 because your story seems a little fishy. The fact that you didn't bet the flop makes a 6 a bit more difficult for you to represent, and your turn raise means that you are very specifically representing basically 67 or 89 exactly, and 89 may be very wishful thinking to represent here because villain has to think you'd be more wary of the possibility of a boat, particularly when he stop-and-go's when the river pairs. If you raise here, your hand looks more like exactly what you have imo: a middle pair hand that caught two pair on the turn and decided to raise, and is now getting fancy, possibly being internally egged on by the fact that it's blind v. blind.
Most villains here are probably not capable of that call, though, so I think a raise here should show moderate profit if you honestly think villain would make this blockish-looking river bet with most 7's and occasional bluffs.
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06-15-2012, 01:39 PM
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#15
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Pooh-Bah
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: beantown
Posts: 5,150
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Re: 2/5 shorthanded fun
Hard to think villain has a 6x, my reasoning is that if he is the type to donk 6x on the turn when an overcard comes he will very, very likely donk his 6x on the FLOP.
Can't give low stakes villains credit for being good thin value bettors, so our 75 is a pretty solid bluffcatcher here. There are def hands that missed that he could be bluffing with.
Overall, I think it would come down to how he played before & how he lost the two buy-ins to decide between calling and folding. I can't fault you for stationing him there, I might call there too...
Btw, I don't think you can exclude straights from villains range since he didn't 3b turn... but whatever.
Last edited by masaraksh; 06-15-2012 at 01:54 PM.
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