Two Plus Two Publishing LLC Two Plus Two Publishing LLC
 

Go Back   Two Plus Two Poker Forums > No Limit Hold'em > Live Low-stakes NL

Notices

Live Low-stakes NL Discussion of up to 3/5 live no-limit, pot-limit and spread-limit Texas Hold'em poker games, situations and strategies.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 08-05-2012, 03:02 PM   #1
journeyman
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 298
2/5 NL: Flopped set in 3-bet pot heads-up

2/5 Saturday afternoon. Effective stacks of ~$900.

Villain is late 20s/early 30s, muscular build. Seems to be a semi-regular (I've seen him in the room before and he knew at least one other player at the table). My general reads on him were that he was on the tight side and on the aggressive side (rather than passive/station-y), but neither to the extreme. He had 3-bet maybe 5-6 times total in about 4 hours of play, so not excessive, but not like he never does it either.

We have one hand of history, as follows:

*HISTORY HAND (note: not including hero's hand as I never showed so villain wouldn't have this info)*

Pre-flop: Effective stacks $700. Hero is HJ and makes it $30 with 2 limpers behind. Folds to villain in BB, who makes it $80. Hero calls.

Flop ($170): 853
Villain checks, hero checks.

Turn ($170): 2
Villain bets $115, hero calls

River ($400): J
Villain checks, hero bets $235, villain calls

Hero says "one pair" and villain flips AA and scoops pot.

*HAND IN QUESTION*

Pre-flop: Effective stacks $900. Hero is HJ with 22 and makes it $35 after 4 limpers behind. Folds to villain in BB, who says "35 . . . are you stealing?" and makes it $75. Hero calls.

Flop ($170): J92
Villain bets $125, hero calls.

Turn ($420): 3
Villain bets $300, hero shoves $400 more

Thoughts on all streets appreciated. Thanks.

Last edited by JPeezy55; 08-05-2012 at 03:03 PM. Reason: Edit: Didn't include my cards
JPeezy55 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-05-2012, 03:32 PM   #2
Oberbiergenießer
 
Garick's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: In warehouse playing against ZZ Top
Posts: 4,819
Re: 2/5 NL: Flopped set in 3-bet pot heads-up

Pre-flop is a bit steep to pay to set mine, but you have a pair and position, so even though you don't have initiative, you should be able to win sometimes unimproved.

I would raise flop. That board is very wet, and there are a lot of cards that will kill your action. AP, 3d is not one of them, so fine with doing this OTT.
Garick is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 08-05-2012, 05:19 PM   #3
veteran
 
tmckendry's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 2,353
Re: 2/5 NL: Flopped set in 3-bet pot heads-up

I think pre is fine given immediate odds and effective stacks.

I'm making it $350 that board vs 90% of players, shoving turn. Unless you have a read that he can/may double/triple barrel into you with bare AKo/AQs, raise OTF.
tmckendry is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-05-2012, 05:48 PM   #4
old hand
 
beaverslayer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: SoCal
Posts: 1,319
Re: 2/5 NL: Flopped set in 3-bet pot heads-up

Seems fine as played. Did he fold ott? Your line is fine as I dont think he is b/f ott with $400 left to call to win $1400 with QQ-AA, or AQc, AKc. I would say click it back otf but he would 3bet otf with any of those hands anyway. Sounds like you got good value by flatting otf because if you do raise and he has air or 88/1010, he might flat and give up with a c/f ott without the top of his range instead of double-barrelling you.
beaverslayer is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 08-05-2012, 10:53 PM   #5
journeyman
 
Ahutz's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 224
Re: 2/5 NL: Flopped set in 3-bet pot heads-up

Your opponents three-betting range is likely something such as -- { QQ-AA, AK/AQ. Fringe hands being stuff like; 99-JJ, AXs, suited connecters, etc} Considering the 4 limpers and then your raise, I think his range is composed of less of those fringe hands and more of his strongest hands.

So if we take that range into account heading into this board texture. We are stacking and over-pair here a large majority of the time and the board is relatively safe for our hand, as his range doesn't have many draws and he is drawing to 2 outs frequently.

In my opinion the most important aspect of this hand is your opponents perception of your 3bet calling range PF and how that evolves with your flop call of his continuation bet. Our hand range should look very strong with our flop call. So when he bets the turn again, I think it is safe to assume he has a hand that is showdown able and not an Ahigh.

We also consider that he checked AA on a board texture of 853 that isn't too dissimilar from this hands J92 board and the dynamics were similar with PF action. So who knows ?
Ahutz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-06-2012, 02:06 AM   #6
adept
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Beautiful Southern California
Posts: 802
Re: 2/5 NL: Flopped set in 3-bet pot heads-up

Raise flop. You're fortunate to not have a turn card that kills your action here.
acescracked84 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-06-2012, 02:48 AM   #7
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
SirRawrsALot's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Denver, CO
Posts: 8,294
Re: 2/5 NL: Flopped set in 3-bet pot heads-up

Quote:
Originally Posted by JPeezy55 View Post

*HAND IN QUESTION*

Pre-flop: Effective stacks $900. Hero is HJ with 22 and makes it $35 after 4 limpers behind. Folds to villain in BB, who says "35 . . . are you stealing?" and makes it $75. Hero calls.

Flop ($170): J92
Villain bets $125, hero calls.

Turn ($420): 3
Villain bets $300, hero shoves $400 more

Thoughts on all streets appreciated. Thanks.
Yeah, that's like KK+ right there.

Raise the flop. Board is so draw heavy that villain is likely to get it in with any over-pair.
SirRawrsALot is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 08-06-2012, 03:07 AM   #8
centurion
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: san diego/ventura
Posts: 123
Re: 2/5 NL: Flopped set in 3-bet pot heads-up

Quote:
Villain is late 20s/early 30s, muscular build
lol

what was table norms for pre flop? i guess with 4 limpers 35 is fine. and since you felt like set mining for 40 more so be it.

with 2 toned board i prob raise flop but since he showed aggression i suppose flat on flop is ok.

and yea, when he leads turn for that much basically auto ship.
jazzarello is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-06-2012, 03:38 AM   #9
adept
 
spooner90's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: Travelling EU, US and UAE
Posts: 1,144
Re: 2/5 NL: Flopped set in 3-bet pot heads-up

Quote:
Originally Posted by tmckendry View Post
I think pre is fine given immediate odds and effective stacks.

I'm making it $350 that board vs 90% of players, shoving turn. Unless you have a read that he can/may double/triple barrel into you with bare AKo/AQs, raise OTF.
I don't hate calling flop, he is very much polarized and we get him committed OTT with overpairs. There is EV in both calling and raising flop, OP played hand fine
spooner90 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-06-2012, 03:40 AM   #10
adept
 
spooner90's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: Travelling EU, US and UAE
Posts: 1,144
Re: 2/5 NL: Flopped set in 3-bet pot heads-up

I would get used to raising flop in those spots IP so you don't fall into become over-tricky
spooner90 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-06-2012, 09:53 AM   #11
journeyman
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 357
Re: 2/5 NL: Flopped set in 3-bet pot heads-up

I would generally raise the flop here when there's a flush draw on board. On a less wet flop it's a standard c/c.

Anyway, you played it fine. If you call flop you need to get paid on blank turn - can't give another cheap card.
nota bene is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-06-2012, 10:09 AM   #12
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Bluegrassplayer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: China
Posts: 17,419
Re: 2/5 NL: Flopped set in 3-bet pot heads-up

I limp behind pre bit everything else is good.
Bluegrassplayer is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 08-06-2012, 02:34 PM   #13
veteran
 
tmckendry's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 2,353
Re: 2/5 NL: Flopped set in 3-bet pot heads-up

Quote:
Originally Posted by spooner90 View Post
I don't hate calling flop, he is very much polarized and we get him committed OTT with overpairs. There is EV in both calling and raising flop, OP played hand fine
I think that he won't commit on any club, J, 8.. essentially a third of the time on the turn he is c/f'ing, mayyybe b/f'ing small.

I also think he is not b/f'ing QQ-AA 33%+ of the time on this specific flop.

Either way, I do agree with you that both options are +EV, and that its close.
tmckendry is offline   Reply With Quote

Reply
      

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -4. The time now is 08:00 PM.


Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2013, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.6.0 ©2011, Crawlability, Inc.
Copyright © 2008-2010, Two Plus Two Interactive