Table is very loose passive. Everyone's got 80bb or more and calls super liberally


Hero is UTG with K♣️J♣️


Raise to 12, 2 callers


Flop 9♦️ 6♥️ 8♣️


Everyone checks


Turn Q♣️


Hero bets 25, 2 calls


River J♦️


Hero checks, UTG (bad reg player, overvalues TP, 150 stack) checks, CO (old man, seems tight, 200 stack) bets 40, hero ??

Should I call the river bet? Better yet, should I have bet the river myself?

25 is probably too much on the turn when everyone calls liberally. Their calling ranges will be pretty inelastic so smaller is better. 20 is plenty.

River if we bet an amount where the bad reg will fold his queens, we're probably betting too large an amount to be profitable given the number of tens that are out there. Any ten is going to call the turn because it's a double gutter. So I'd give up and check. Check calling would be suicide.

yea, id probably check turn honestly.

Think you played it correctly

Call river. Fold to a raise from the guy behind of course.

We get two folds some amount, there are still a bunch of no hoper hands on this board (A4hh, 22, etc). Mostly we just get to set the price. Getting raised sucks, but should be pretty rare, would basically need to be exactly JT which checked the flop.

What are you hoping an old man who seems tight is betting 40% of the pot here with? He could have a busted flush draw, that's about all I can come up with, but even if he bluffs that this bet seems sized for value.

^^^^

Just feel this board is all over their ranges and we wont ever get enough folds. Unless we hit our flush or straight i wont feel too good about betting. Dont want to face a bloated pot OOP and im sure im gonna have bet or call another street.

Think leading flop is much better option then checking then leading turn, seems like we are saying we have KQ, AQ only.

OBV i would be betting a lot more frequently in position.

Nah I'm not going for a bluff on the river if it blanks. That's not the point of the bet. The point of the bet is to pick up the pot against junk hands (but that might still be winning, like ace high and small pockets) and to set the price.

We have a third of the deck (clubs, tens, kings) so a $20 bet is only actually costing us like $12-13 and it means we get to bet more when we hit OTR, so the actual cost of the bet is probably only like $5-10, worth it to pick up the pot sometimes and stop us facing a $30 bet other times.

Although the Q does hit their ranges to some extent, the check around OTF cuts out stuff like Q9 and J9 and makes it somewhat more likely they whiffed completely with Ax, Kx or small pockets.

Well OP opens from UTG and we get 2 calls. Think Vil 2 could have middling connected cards.

I udnerstand why we should bet we got great equity and FE, but I feel this is a good spot for lots of villains to go to call down mode. The description reads loose passive, think that could go both ways here meaning they might be caling wide but they also to wanting to fold a lot.

Iwould like to add though, the better read i got Villains whether its history or some tell, im more likely to bet turn.

I think I really disagree with my response above. This hand has stuck with me, because it does feel like a really awkward spot. Trying to think about why, a few things jump out:

loose passive ... calls super liberally
Everyone checks
2 calls

So, that implies that initial ranges are really wide, the flop gave people draws, air, or monsters, and the Q gave people something, or a draw to something, or a confirmed monster, although confirmed monster range actually goes down, as wouldn't that be the right point to r/r?

I think the key to the hand is how much of the turn calling range contains A9, K9 and x7s that remain missed draws along with 22-44.

Assuming no r/r, you are calling $40 against a pot of either $150 or $190. You really don't need to be right very often ... meh. I still don't know. The lack of aggression makes it really hard to eliminate much from their ranges, even with the t calls.

That, I think, is the key to the hand: how much of their range do you think the turn call removes?

Even w the 4liner, this sounds like a table that autocalls any reasonably sized riv bet with any 2p and probably most Qs. routine ck, routine fold.

X/c turn. X/f river.

There's no value in betting draws on the turn, even really big ones, when you have very little FE, and you might get raised off of it (or have to pay a price you really didn't want to pay).

I guess if they're all calling random one pair hands even if a club hits otr, *maybe* it would make sense to bloat the pot up, but then it makes zero sense to try to bluff a one-liner. The fact that you're thinking about calling makes me think you're just another loose-passive like all of your villains