1/2: bombing 77 on a paired board

[scelsi]

Players in the hand are two extreme fit-fold Villains and a clear Newbie to live poker in general. I have a winning image and am sitting at about 350bb. V1 has $250, V2 and Newbie have $100.

The Hand:

Effective stack 50bb ($100). Hero UTG opens for $7 with 77, called by V1, V2 in LP, Newbie callls out of SB.

Flop: ($28) 886r

Newbie leads $23.

I know that there are lots of 8's in Newbie's range, but I also remember someone (Bart maybe?) saying that donking into the field on a paired board is often air or at the least a very polarizing bet.

So I raise to $100 knowing that V1/V2 are checked out, and I'm willing to race whatever the Newbie has for 50bb...

Spew?

[crsseyed]

Spew IMO.

How do you know V1/V2 are checked out?

[crsseyed]

Originally Posted by scelsi

I know that there are lots of 8's in Newbie's range, but I also remember someone (Bart maybe?) saying that donking into the field on a paired board is often air or at the least a very polarizing bet.Spew?

Also I don't see Newbie leading into 3 others including preflop raiser w/unpaired overcards. Also I take 77/55/44/33/22 out of his range, also take 97/75 out of his range (you have 77). Best scenario for you he has a 6.

[scelsi]

V1 and V2 were incessantly discussing hands during play, and on this flop both exasperatedly telegraphed folds while I was thinking.

[scelsi]

Originally Posted by crsseyed

Also I don't see Newbie leading into 3 others including preflop raiser w/unpaired overcards. Also I take 77/55/44/33/22 out of his range, also take 97/75 out of his range (you have 77). Best scenario for you he has a 6.

Why did you remove 22-55?

[fivechips]

I don't play 1/2 but I am assuming a $7 bet doesn't diminish the ranges in these three hands significantly. That said if you're going to raise with 77 preflop the idea is to limit the field not build a pot and get three callers. Second, you raise $100 after a "newbie" flop bet with two (I guess solid) players behind with wide open ranges (including A8). V1 stack size on this flop (250 vs my 350) that makes me want to call the $23 (see the other two players actually fold) and then get the money in against the newbie on the turn. I guess I don't have a problem with that provided its really a "newbie" (so you say) who could be betting air.

Foot note: sometimes I "telegraph" folds with the intention of keeping the action alive.

[1ns71nct]

Fold pre, donky

[crsseyed]

Originally Posted by scelsi

Why did you remove 22-55?

I just don't see someone playing that badly, even a newish player. Why would he lead out with that 4 handed?

[gobbledygeek]

I would have just open limped. Keeps our implied odds massive and invites as many people into the pot as possible, all of whom we can now setmine against. All we've done now is created a bloated multiway pot where we'll be OOP and hating most flops (this is one of the few non-terrible flops).

I fold the flop. Newbie bet into the world. Newbies don't 3bet QQ-99 (which this often is). There's still two guys behind us to act.

GcluelessNLnoobG

[Ray Zee]

i am more concerned you dont worry more about the two other players. as they could ruin your day easily.

[venice10]

77 in the UTG is one where if I can raise and get HU, I'll raise. If I can limp, not get raised and see 4-5 other players on the flop, I'll call. Otherwise, I'm folding it.

HU, I can represent a lot of high card hands. Many flops crush the hopes of the range of cards that just call a UTG raise. If lots of people call, I'm getting the odds to set mine. Otherwise, I've got a hand that has little chance of being good at SD and won't get paid off enough if I hit.

As played, the noob is saying he's not afraid of 7s. Easy fold, thank you very much Mr. Noob for making life easy. A raise is spew. He's rarely folding.

[fivechips]

Originally Posted by venice10

77 in the UTG is one where if I can raise and get HU, I'll raise. If I can limp, not get raised and see 4-5 other players on the flop, I'll call. Otherwise, I'm folding it.

HU, I can represent a lot of high card hands. Many flops crush the hopes of the range of cards that just call a UTG raise. If lots of people call, I'm getting the odds to set mine. Otherwise, I've got a hand that has little chance of being good at SD and won't get paid off enough if I hit.

As played, the noob is saying he's not afraid of 7s. Easy fold, thank you very much Mr. Noob for making life easy. A raise is spew. He's rarely folding.

Like this, but you're never absorbing a raise with 77? Ever?

[masaraksh]

flatting is better for numerous reasons:

- you don't overplay your hand
- you get to see what players behind you do
- on the turn, you should be able to figure out if villain who donked out has 8x or not...
- you "control" the pot size (keep it smaller) with a hand you don't want to get stacks in with

[playertee]

Grunch: I dont think your raise gets called by worse very often, u already have 2 sevens, so him having an OESD is unlikely...I just flat here

[ArBar]

Flat on the flop IMO. You won't be called by worse.