It was storming as little as 30 minutes ago, but I got up anyway to see the blood moon eclipse. There are no stars, but the moon is an orange-red orb in the Western sky. Very cool.

Robbed.

One of these years I'm going to acquire a +46 phone number and prank call egomaniacs at 2 in the morning.

ok ethics/ettiquete question:

No limit game, limped pot, some ragged board with 2 clubs ,utg leads out, mp (fast-talking prop who plays weak-tight) calls, bb rec player xr. call call. turn brings another club, bb bets, utg folds. prop starts to hem and haw saying "i guess you got it huh". bb says "which one you want to see?" prop says left one. bb flips it over, no club, prop says "i tell you what i'll do, i have a flush, so i'll just call and we check the river. ok?". bb agrees, doesn't seem upset or anything and prop calls and wins. Is this ok? given that he's a prop, should i have complained about this to the shift manager?

Ethically, I see no problem. Action offered and accepted.

Etiquettely, just downright horrible. All these sorts of "special deals" type scenarios make it uncomfortable for people to play, and props should be the last people to engage in such behavior.

If the shift manager is the type who likes new people coming in to play, you should tell him/her. If the shift manager is the kind who's happy to have the same 10 regs show up and play what is essentially a private game, don't.

I don't see a problem here. The only way I'd think this was a problem is if the two remaining players knew before UTG folded that they were going to make an arrangement like this, e.g. because they'd done so many times before. Otherwise, what's the problem, exactly?

But sometimes it makes people more comfortable in playing, e.g. because they know the prop isn't always acting like a shark.

4/8 afternoon game

utg is waiting for his 20 seat.

By the river I ended up with a one card straight to the ace, which happened to be the nuts. Checks to me five ways, I bet, utg check raises, folds to me. I didn't realize that I never put in the $8 to call until the guy to my left told me after the hand. Instead, I was convinced that the guy had a straight, which annoyed me because I want the overcalls, which he shut out. I say "I have a straight." and I flipped my cards over. He throws his cards up in the air as he says "two pair on the flop!" with a sadface.

1) am I an ass for not actually calling him?

2) 3 bet river obviously.

3) all of the above.

1) not an ass.

2) 100%

3) nope

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Bob, you did nothing "wrong" (other than not raise the nuts closing the action), and follow that guy to the 20 game!

bob, so you never called his river raise? did the dealer ship him the pot?

No I never called. He tossed his cards up and towards the muck showing two pair. The dealer collected his cards and pushed me the pot.

Did they come down again? Face up, or face down? I guess he relinquished his claim on the pot by throwing his cards away.

1) Not an ass. Since you were apparently awarded the pot, putting the chips out would have been a meaningless formality. But you were lucky to have been awarded the pot, I think, since you never called.

2) Yeah.

3) No.

Well ordinarily when someone is facing a bet and his opponent offers to show, it's understood that the other guy will fold and be satisfied he wasn't bluffed or whatever. I think the prop here was abusing that understanding to get information and so it's a bit unethical, esp. coming from a prop.

weird situation. something seems not right to me as far as you not calling his raise but him still losing the pot. i suppose if he had just sat there waiting with cards face down after you'd shown your cards and said 'straight!' that you would eventually have called or re-raised, or probably someone at the table would have asked why the action had stopped. i guess when he mucks his cards it makes it irrelevant that you didn't call?

One time in a NL game I went all in with my full house on the turn, and the other guy just turned over his quads without calling. The dealer wasn't doing anything so I said "I think that's a call, go ahead". I can't remember if the guy ever put his money in or not. I guess that could have been a problem had I hit my one-outer on the river, although he probably would have been happy to put in the rest of his money and win the jackpot.

Anyway, my point is I think it's assumed one is not folding when he turns over the nuts when facing a bet.

Hello Bay Area players. I'm heading to SF/Berkeley in a couple of weeks for a wedding, but probably going to stop by to play some poker. Some questions:

1) Oaks or Bay 101? Oaks is 10 minutes away, Bay 101 is an hour away.
2) Does anywhere offer bigger stud, O8, or mixed games?
3) How does one shoot craps with cards?

Thanks, much appreciated.

Really? I guess in the clubs where I play, people pull all kinds of shenanigans with table talk, and nothing is ever "understood." Everybody assumes anyone could be lying at any point in the hand, because that's part of the game -- so nobody gets upset when it becomes apparent that it happened.

I would never flip my hand over without acting first.

That being said, when someone flips over the nuts without acting, I'll gladly surrender the pot, especially when I would have called a raise.

How long do you have to play and what stakes do you want to play?

If you want to play 15/30-20/40 or below and have 3 hours, it'd be silly to spend half of your time traveling. If you want to play 80/160, go to Bay. If you want to play 30/60-40/80 and have a whole day ... shrug.

2/4 stud (rarely 4/8) and 6/12 HK O8 at the Oaks, 4/8 HK O8 at Bay. I think there's a spiradic 20/40 O8 at M8trix (the Captain would know).

Nothing wrong here. You can fold at any time, even when not facing a bet. I mean, you can call the river and fold out of turn or whatever, you can muck your BB preflop even if there's no raise, all kinds of stuff. Perfectly legal.

You see this occasionally, usually by accident, but it happens.

Biggest non-HE game is 8/16 LO8 at Bay101. Runs daily, maybe like 10am-???

I believe the Oaks only has 1-2 15/30s and 1 30/60. Not sure how long the waits are/how the lists work. That's the only benefit of driving to Bay101 -- they have more tables of mid-high LHE so depending on time of day and how you work the lists, it may or may not be faster to get into a game.

You can call up to an hour in advance at the Oaks (and Bay 101) for 15/30+.

If there's no 30/60 going when you call, be sure to put your name on the list. Last year the props were shuffled so that there are always 2 on duty from noon to midnight, and they are required to play 4, so any two customers can start a game.

They really will start a game for two customers and two props? And what if the props are already holding together other games?

As a 30 player, I wouldn't care at all.