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| Small Stakes Limit Discussions about small stakes Texas Hold'em (from 2/4 to around 15/30) |
07-13-2012, 01:36 AM
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#1
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adept
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: 128 area
Posts: 930
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Foxwoods $4/$8: HU against solid player
Villain in this hand is button and friend of mine, who normally plays red chip games and is killing time before a bigger game opens. We play a lot, I perceive him as a tricky LAG HU, he perceives me as a somewhat tricky LAG (with a big emphasis on the aggressive part) HU who will defend a big blind light against him. He loves opening the button with a big range (something like 76s would not surprise me here).
I'm BB with Q  3
Folds to villain who raises, SB call, I call.
3 handed, 2.5 BB after drop: KQ3, 
Check to villain who bets, SB fold, I raise, villain call.
Turn, 4.5 BB: 5r
I bet, villain raises, I...call? 3!? Fold isn't an option, obviously.
Last edited by jdr0317; 07-13-2012 at 01:42 AM.
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07-13-2012, 01:52 AM
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#2
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Wot
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Money for nothin and chips for free
Posts: 6,131
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Re: Foxwoods $4/$8: HU against solid player
You're ahead of his range, 3!
I'm assuming he's raising most Kings here, like probably K9+ or so.
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07-13-2012, 01:55 AM
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#3
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adept
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Baby, you've got a stew going.
Posts: 907
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Agree with the Captain. Easy 3! Here.
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07-13-2012, 01:58 AM
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#4
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adept
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: 128 area
Posts: 930
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Re: Foxwoods $4/$8: HU against solid player
Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain R
You're ahead of his range, 3!
I'm assuming he's raising most Kings here, like probably K9+ or so.
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Flatting the flop in position in order to raise the turn is a pretty strong line though, no?
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07-13-2012, 02:05 AM
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#5
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Wot
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Money for nothin and chips for free
Posts: 6,131
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Re: Foxwoods $4/$8: HU against solid player
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdr0317
Flatting the flop in position in order to raise the turn is a pretty strong line though, no?
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Yes, but maybe you and I have different definitions for the word "strong".
Assuming that you would c/r the flop with any King, any flush draw, JT... if that's the case, then K9o would be a strong hand and taking a strong line is fine for villain.
LHE is all about estimating ranges, so give an estimate for what you think the worst hand your friend would take this line with, and then see how Queens and Threes measures up to that.
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07-13-2012, 02:09 AM
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#6
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adept
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: 128 area
Posts: 930
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Re: Foxwoods $4/$8: HU against solid player
Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain R
Yes, but maybe you and I have different definitions for the word "strong".
Assuming that you would c/r the flop with any King, any flush draw, JT... if that's the case, then K9o would be a strong hand and taking a strong line is fine for villain.
LHE is all about estimating ranges, so give an estimate for what you think the worst hand your friend would take this line with, and then see how Queens and Threes measures up to that.
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Fair enough.
I ask because clearly I called here @_@. A quick stove of this shows it was a bad play, but I tend to flat my wa/wb spots...maybe a tendency I need to break.
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07-13-2012, 02:16 AM
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#7
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Wot
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Money for nothin and chips for free
Posts: 6,131
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Re: Foxwoods $4/$8: HU against solid player
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdr0317
Fair enough.
I ask because clearly I called here @_@. A quick stove of this shows it was a bad play, but I tend to flat my wa/wb spots...maybe a tendency I need to break.
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Just calling down when you're WA/WB is fine. That's not a leak you need to fix; the leak you need to fix here is that you're not identifying this situation correctly. This isn't a WA/WB situation, this is a WA situation.
I mean, sometimes he'll show up with KQ here or 55 or whatever, but that only makes up a small % of his range. The rest of the stuff you beat.
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07-13-2012, 02:30 AM
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#8
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adept
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: 128 area
Posts: 930
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Re: Foxwoods $4/$8: HU against solid player
Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain R
Just calling down when you're WA/WB is fine. That's not a leak you need to fix; the leak you need to fix here is that you're not identifying this situation correctly. This isn't a WA/WB situation, this is a WA situation.
I mean, sometimes he'll show up with KQ here or 55 or whatever, but that only makes up a small % of his range. The rest of the stuff you beat.
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I'm more worried about 33/KQ/K3s/KK here, and wouldn't r/f be a good line to take w/ a lower king, like KT? that was my thought process in calling.
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07-13-2012, 03:34 AM
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#9
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adept
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: 'murrcah.
Posts: 796
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Re: Foxwoods $4/$8: HU against solid player
I'd 3! with the range you've given him. There's noway I'm folding to a 4, either.
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07-13-2012, 07:38 AM
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#10
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Most interesting man on 2p2
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Not deserving of an undertitle
Posts: 9,843
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Re: Foxwoods $4/$8: HU against solid player
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdr0317
I'm more worried about 33/KQ/K3s/KK here, and wouldn't r/f be a good line to take w/ a lower king, like KT? that was my thought process in calling.
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You're overly focused on those hands that beat you, whereas you should be thinking about the range of hands that "a tricky LAG HU" would play like this. The turn is a pretty straightforward 3-bet.
You also said, "he perceives me as a somewhat tricky LAG (with a big emphasis on the aggressive part)" so I wouldn't worry much about him folding a hand like KT to a 3-bet from such an opponent.
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07-13-2012, 12:59 PM
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#11
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adept
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: 128 area
Posts: 930
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Re: Foxwoods $4/$8: HU against solid player
Quote:
Originally Posted by leo doc
You're overly focused on those hands that beat you, whereas you should be thinking about the range of hands that "a tricky LAG HU" would play like this. The turn is a pretty straightforward 3-bet.
You also said, "he perceives me as a somewhat tricky LAG (with a big emphasis on the aggressive part)" so I wouldn't worry much about him folding a hand like KT to a 3-bet from such an opponent.
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Fair enough.
Thanks guys, good for next time I'm in this spot.
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07-13-2012, 01:40 PM
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#12
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grinder
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 417
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Good tips in this thread. Do you guys like villain's line with top one pair hand given straight and flush draw flop?
If hero 3 bet turn what do you want to do on river heart, k, ace, 5?
Thanks
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07-13-2012, 01:58 PM
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#13
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Juris Donktorate
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Posts: 1,651
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Any chance he folds to a 3 bet, though? A lot of naked kings might do that. If he can, there might be merit to waiting for the river.
But I think 3 betting the turn is more correct.
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07-13-2012, 02:07 PM
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#14
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adept
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Somewhere between 1/4 and 1 BB/hr
Posts: 959
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Re: Foxwoods $4/$8: HU against solid player
Villian has to think his king is frequently good on the flop so his turn raise still does not shift his range to hands that beat you.
I'm not folding to a cap on the turn, especially given your reads, but I'm probably trying to show down as cheaply as possible.
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07-13-2012, 05:12 PM
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#15
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adept
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: location ,location.
Posts: 1,086
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SadDonkey
Any chance he folds to a 3 bet, though? A lot of naked kings might do that.
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No one who thinks you are an aggressive lag will ever fold a king there when there is a flush draw too. We may even get 4bet by a pair with a flush draw (the OP didn't specify which cards are hearts).
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