Two Plus Two Publishing LLC Two Plus Two Publishing LLC
 

Go Back   Two Plus Two Poker Forums > Limit Texas Hold'em > Small Stakes Limit

Notices

Small Stakes Limit Discussions about small stakes Texas Hold'em (from 2/4 to around 15/30)

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 02-04-2012, 02:57 PM   #1
veteran
 
Bill Haywood's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: May you live to throw 1,000 shoes
Posts: 2,563
Crunching K9o that's been capped.

Say we open K9o otb, and it is 3b and then capped by BB.

Using the below ranges, K9o has 20% equity, i.e. 1:4 against. But the pot odds are 5:1, so in strict, all-in equity, we should call two to the face. But much of the value of the hand will be post flop -- whether we manage to win more when ahead than we lose when behind. Assuming two competent opponents, my guess is that being in position still makes this a call.

BU 19.97% 19.29% 0.68% { Kd9s }
SB 35.56% 33.67% 1.89% { 77+, A7s+, K9s+, QTs+, JTs, ATo+, KTo+, QJo }
BB 44.47% 42.72% 1.76% { 88+, ATs+, KTs+, QJs, AJo+, KQo }
Bill Haywood is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-04-2012, 03:00 PM   #2
centurion
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 123
Re: Crunching K9o that's been capped.

My first inclination is that your 3-bet and cap ranges are a bit loose given "typical" players...

K9o is a quintessential reverse implied odds hand. I throw it away.
Flipman888 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-04-2012, 03:15 PM   #3
veteran
 
Bill Haywood's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: May you live to throw 1,000 shoes
Posts: 2,563
Re: Crunching K9o that's been capped.

Tightening up, our equity only goes down about 1 point.

BU 18.15% 17.80% 0.35% { Kd9h }
SB 35.70% 33.26% 2.44% { 88+, ATs+, KJs+, AJo+, KQo }
BB 46.15% 43.76% 2.39% { TT+, AJs+, KQs, AQo+ }
Bill Haywood is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-04-2012, 03:21 PM   #4
veteran
 
DosXX's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Green Tea Partay
Posts: 2,320
Re: Crunching K9o that's been capped.

I *generally* don't fold a hand here that can make a 2 card straight or flush. But, then again I'm probably opening wider and people are definitely 3 betting me wider in the sb than your ranges. So I can have stuff like K5o, which is the type of hands I fold in this spot, not a hand as strong as K9.
DosXX is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-04-2012, 03:52 PM   #5
One Bet at a Time
 
DougL's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Boulder, CO
Posts: 12,933
Re: Crunching K9o that's been capped.

How well do they play post flop?

This hand is on the list of hands that I tend to fold against many people. You make non-nut straights. You're crushingly dominated. If folding this hand is a mistake it can't be a big one. Allowing them to drive you off the bottom of your range is never a big deal.
DougL is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-04-2012, 09:10 PM   #6
grinder
 
...one...'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: my own private hell
Posts: 435
Re: Crunching K9o that's been capped.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Flipman888 View Post

K9o is a quintessential reverse implied odds hand. I throw it away.
+1
...one... is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-05-2012, 12:15 AM   #7
veteran
 
nonsimplesimon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: daddyville
Posts: 2,568
Re: Crunching K9o that's been capped.

The other thing is folding when you vpip here wont be exploited by observant players BC you are opening otb and folks are.assuming you're opening wide to begin with so im not worried about a metagame blunder if.you know what i mean. I do understand what dosxx is saying although in my cp 8/16 and even 15/30 unless its short handed k9 would be crushed in this spot.
nonsimplesimon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-05-2012, 10:55 PM   #8
adept
 
rodeo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: niether here nor there
Posts: 938
Re: Crunching K9o that's been capped.

it seems like this situation comes up so rarely in small stakes games that it's not really going to matter too much what you do pre flop as long as you don't mess it up post flop.
rodeo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-06-2012, 01:33 AM   #9
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
BigBadBabar's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: playing, coaching
Posts: 16,276
Re: Crunching K9o that's been capped.

online i wouldn't fold it

live usually not but i guess if both guys are super nits i could see it
BigBadBabar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-08-2012, 04:55 PM   #10
old hand
 
Mike_757's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: San Francisco, CA
Posts: 1,710
Re: Crunching K9o that's been capped.

Quote:
Originally Posted by rodeo View Post
it seems like this situation comes up so rarely in small stakes games that it's not really going to matter too much what you do pre flop as long as you don't mess it up post flop.
10-7 to the flop, yes, rare to be OTB and first to act in a low limit full ring game.

Got me thinking for a bit there.
Mike_757 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-09-2012, 11:15 AM   #11
adept
 
rodeo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: niether here nor there
Posts: 938
Re: Crunching K9o that's been capped.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike_757 View Post
10-7 to the flop, yes, rare to be OTB and first to act in a low limit full ring game.

Got me thinking for a bit there.
not only is it rare in ss games for it to fold to the button, but it's also rare that after the button opens the sb and the bb have hands they want to raise with. i can't think of a time where this exact scenario has come up in the games that i play.
rodeo is offline   Reply With Quote

Reply
      

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -4. The time now is 04:34 PM.


Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2012, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.6.0 ©2011, Crawlability, Inc.
Copyright © 2008-2010, Two Plus Two Interactive