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Old 05-27-2012, 02:51 PM   #1
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8/16 Capping Loose All In PF

V1 is super tilted lady who is calling 100% PF, but will raise premium hands.
V2 is super tilted gentleman who is calling almost 100% PF
V3 is super loose passive calling PF about 80%

Hero is viewed as aggressive winning player.

UTG folds.
V1 calls.
Folded to hero in MP who raises with KJ

Upside to raise: I'm WAAAY ahead of her range.
Downside: Probably not going to ISO against this line-up......

Folded to V2 who calls on button.
SB folds. V3 calls in BB.

V1 now 3! all in.

Hero caps. I'm thinking I'm still pretty far ahead of these guys' ranges and would like to keep initiative if we all whiff (?).

All call.

Flop: 4 plrs. 1 all in. 15.5 SB 7 5 2 rainbow.

Hero bets. V2 calls. V3 calls.

Turn: 10 completing rainbow.

Hero checks. V2 checks.

River: 8

Hero checks. V2 bets. Hero folds. V3 folds,

I'm thinking that if I'm gonna cap this PF then I need to bet the turn and river as well on this board targeting Ax and KQ. I'm also thinking PF cap maybe spew. ??
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Old 05-27-2012, 05:41 PM   #2
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Re: 8/16 Capping Loose All In PF

I ran some rough range estimates through stove and we have close to 29% pre so i think cap is fine.
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Old 05-27-2012, 11:11 PM   #3
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Re: 8/16 Capping Loose All In PF

I concerned about the reason behind your flop cbet. You're bluffing to win 3 bets? When the side pot is nearly dry, it isn't worth fighting for. Can you bet K high for value? What is your plan?
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Old 05-28-2012, 12:11 AM   #4
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Re: 8/16 Capping Loose All In PF

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Originally Posted by DougL View Post
I concerned about the reason behind your flop cbet. You're bluffing to win 3 bets? When the side pot is nearly dry, it isn't worth fighting for. Can you bet K high for value? What is your plan?
+1
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Old 05-28-2012, 02:23 AM   #5
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Re: 8/16 Capping Loose All In PF

Unless youre buying a turn card, I don't see any reason to bet a pot without a pair vs these fish. They're never folding anything.

Pre is fine. They're checking everything through but big pairs+.
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Old 05-28-2012, 03:01 AM   #6
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Re: 8/16 Capping Loose All In PF

I'm betting the flop so I can bet the turn (and river if necessary) to fold out Ax and KQ and scoop whole pot.

Am assuming I can still beat all-in. Her range is literally 100% with almost all premium holdings eliminated.

Terri-spew?
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Old 05-28-2012, 09:04 AM   #7
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Re: 8/16 Capping Loose All In PF

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Originally Posted by crueleye View Post
Downside: Probably not going to ISO against this line-up......

Folded to V2 who calls on button.

I'm thinking that if I'm gonna cap this PF then I need to bet the turn and river as well on this board targeting Ax and KQ. I'm also thinking PF cap maybe spew. ??
I'd consider KQ a big hand here against a limper so KJ can't be that far off. You only got one caller behind you. That's a pretty good result. If you expected more players behind you then I wouldn't like the preflop cap, but here I like it. The only problem with capping that I see is that you're going to have to hit. If you don't then your hand becomes a draw. While you are getting some implied odds on a K or J, this is opposed by the preflop showdown equity that you never get to realize when you fold the river. This is why I don't like the c bet even if the all in lady had a full stack.

I'm not a fan of betting three streets unimproved with any hand except against tight players or when scarecards fall. Multiway I nearly always give up on bluffs unless I have good chances to improve, buy outs, or protect/bluff at the same time. <6 outs+only KQ, AJ, AK to buy outs from but they're not folding anyways(some discounted more than others)+some hands to protect against(many that we dominate anyways)+0% chance of winning the main pot immediately= I play it like a draw.
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Old 05-28-2012, 12:30 PM   #8
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Re: 8/16 Capping Loose All In PF

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Originally Posted by crueleye View Post
I'm betting the flop so I can bet the turn (and river if necessary) to fold out Ax and KQ and scoop whole pot.

Am assuming I can still beat all-in. Her range is literally 100% with almost all premium holdings eliminated.

Terri-spew?
So, they dealt the guy napkins? His hand is already dead? On a 752 board, would you rather have 100% of all hands - premium holdings removed, or KJo? Also as a bonus to the bad hand, he gets to show down for a decently huge pot with no more action. The KJo gets to make bets and raises for a tiny side pot, beating two people for that. The best of those hands gets to play for the 12 bets vs. the bad hand on a all low board.

The plan is to 3 barrel into a dry-ish side pot to try to show down K high against the AI player. Yes, spew. Stove up some equity. I don't think you're building the side pot for you. Even if you get to the end, I think you lose to the all in player a lot. If you were playing partners with the AI player, your plan may have merit.
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Old 05-28-2012, 03:16 PM   #9
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Re: 8/16 Capping Loose All In PF

Me vs AI on flop

20,887,469 games 13.375 secs 1,561,679 games/sec

Board: 7s 5h 2d
Dead:

equity win tie pots won pots tied
Hand 0: 44.860% 44.19% 00.67% 9229517 140650.00 { KhJd }
Hand 1: 55.140% 54.47% 00.67% 11376652 140650.00 { 99-22, A9s-A2s, KJs-K2s, Q2s+, J2s+, T2s+, 92s+, 82s+, 72s+, 62s+, 52s+, 42s+, 32s, ATo-A2o, K2o+, Q4o+, J6o+, T6o+, 95o+, 85o+, 73o+, 63o+, 52o+, 42o+, 32o }

Me vs AI on Turn

Hand 0: 38.275% 37.71% 00.56% 4255031 63617.00 { KhJd }
Hand 1: 61.725% 61.16% 00.56% 6900898 63617.00

Me vs AI on River

Hand 0: 22.780% 22.20% 00.58% 2554966 67256.00 { KhJd }
Hand 1: 77.220%

I'm not that far behind on the flop. It's a massive parlay though, that the two remaining players will have hands they can fold AND I'll be good UI OTR.

God help me, I still kind of want to bet this flop maybe the turn. Either villain may "fit or fold" a small pp. A flop AND turn bet might fold out KQ OTT, giving me two more outs in what is shaping up to be a pretty big pot.

Betting river does seem a little stupid looking at stove. Firing into one or two players who called a turn bet can only target a TINY part of their range, and only protects 22% vs AI. Probably not the best plan.......
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Old 05-28-2012, 03:45 PM   #10
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Re: 8/16 Capping Loose All In PF

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Originally Posted by crueleye View Post
God help me, I still kind of want to bet this flop maybe the turn. Either villain may "fit or fold" a small pp. A flop AND turn bet might fold out KQ OTT, giving me two more outs in what is shaping up to be a pretty big pot.
It's a big pot, but I don't think cleaning up those outs will help you all that much. Against every other hand, besides KQ in their ranges it's spew. Given their description I'd expect Ax to call at least the flop(they'd probably be correct to do so anyways.) This is like thinking of a hand that you can beat on the river and calling hoping to catch that one hand bluffing. Sure, if his range is small enough then that one hand will make up a significant portion of that range, but in this situation one hand is not worth much in the grand scheme. I'd like your flop play better with 98.
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Old 06-01-2012, 01:59 AM   #11
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Re: 8/16 Capping Loose All In PF

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Originally Posted by DougL View Post
On a 752 board, would you rather have 100% of all hands - premium holdings removed, or KJo?
This. 752r board, 4 ways ... le check et le fold, s'il vous plait.
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