Just wondering how situations like this should be handled. This might be closer to mid-stakes but posting here anyways. Any comments would be greatly appreciated - these situations seem to pop up semi-frequently in the games I play.

Villain in BB is tricky and aggressive.

Live 10/20

Preflop: I open-raise AJ from EP, one cold caller, SB and BB call, 4 to the flop.

Flop (8 small bets): Q72 rainbow, no hearts.
It's checked to me, I bet, only the villain in the BB calls.

Turn (5 big bets): another Q putting a 2-flush on board.
Villain donks, I ???

Against tricky, aggressive players, is this a calldown? Is a fold too nitty?

My first inclination is super-easy Fold, because he has "something"... he called on a super dry flop and almost zero chance he "floated" the flop OOP.
However, this is great spot to raise if he's able to bet/fold all non-Q hands... and he shouldn't have a Q very often.

I think this is super read//villain dependent. What do his turn donks usually signify?

He shouldn't have a Q very often but he might have a 7 or a PP a lot and be willing to call down.

i tend to want to call down in these spots until i have a better idea of what villain is capable of showing up with here.

I'm not saying it is wrong, but can you go over why you bet into 3 opponents on this flop?

My general thought when a bad passive player donks the turn is that he's afraid you won't bet. He was going to c/r, but then the board convinced him that you might not. He's lost in the hand, so he tosses a bet. Sadly for a tricky player, you also have the rando-bluff. What's he repping? He's saying he has a Q that tripped up. Does that make sense? Well, he didn't raise the flop. Do you think he raises TP vs. your bet?

You're getting 6:1 if you can call now and safely fold to more action. That works if you think he just fires once as a bluff. If he has two barrels, you're getting 7:2 to decide to call down. Oddly, your hand cannot improve unless you think he also has other pairs in his range -- he's turning 55 or J7 into a bluff (thin value bet, putting you on AK?) with the Q pairing.

Talk to us about what hands he has on the turn in total, and then tell us which of those he might donk.

fold, live to play another hand. although villan is tricky, aggro, I dont think he calls the flop to donk the turn on a bluff.

his range consists heavily of weaker pairs. I'd just fold. He'd have to float with weird stuff like K9/JT OOP and then donk the turn; if that were to happen, he'd be floating waaaaay too often and you'd have noted it by now.

I'm not a big fan of raising here. You're not getting called by worse, so you're trying to bluff out better. Against his likely range, you have 6 outs. So you're semibluffing with 6 outs, and IMO, that's too few.

What would be much sexier is to raise this turn for value with 88+/Qx.

If villain's range is mostly weaker pairs than JJ, wouldn't 6 outs + implied odds lead us to want to call? Add in a few bluffs that only fire once and this becomes a snap call due to the mostly weak pairs.

I think there is a good chance my hand is still good and I want to protect it against the various 6-out pair draws. The flop is super-dry so if I get c/r on the flop I am probably behind.

I think this player would c/r trip Qs on the turn instead of donking (and maybe even c/r the flop with top pair), which is why the donk confused me.

After calling the flop his range contains pocket pairs JJ and below, 2x, 7x, Qx, maybe AK. Unfortunately, I don't have much history with this particular villain and I don't know if hands such as AJ or 86s would be in that range. I have no idea what his donking range on the turn might be, which is why I was confused. I don't recall seeing him donk the turn in our session before this hand.

And yes, this villain would definitely fire a river barrel if I called the turn.

Go get equilab, and put in the villain's range. Now look and see if you have enough equity to draw or enough to call down. If he doesn't have a Q (maybe even give him a couple combos with a Q), I'm guessing you can draw. As described, he doesn't have enough bluffs for you to bluff catch. Rebluff? I'm guessing he's enough of a station you shouldn't.

I would snap call here because at best we could have up to 9 outs vs this villain.

Raising is an intresting idea if villain is capable of folding 7,2, small-mid PP. I don't know if people are donking 2 pair on turn bc they want to fold to a raise though. With up to 9 outs the bluff is cheap and we can still beat missed flush draws by checking behind river.

With the pot laying 9:1 immediate, doesn't villain have a large float range when only one big card spikes on a rainbow board? There is a good chance this flop whiffed an EP raise and that floater is drawing to 6 outs still, or could be looking to semi-bluff a scare card.

I'd at least call the turn.

A fold here would be very noticeable, not only to a tricky lag, but also to anyone else that might be paying attention (a stretch, I know). This villain is repping a queen, but tricky players can have many hands that don't contain a queen, many of which you have 6 outs against as well as a few possible counterfeit outs.

I think the river's a tougher decision, especially if it bricks. If this villain thinks you are positionally aware- you opened from EP- I'd likely fold if I didn't improve. Otoh, it might be worth a BB to decloak the meaning of his turn donk- especially if you're gonna be playing against him a bunch.

And btw, 10/20 hands are well-suited for this forum.

*g*

I probably don't even c-bet here. We've completely wiffed the board and we're four handed versus a tricky player and at least one baddie who CC'd (a baddie who's probably loose/passive and is gonna peel lightly).

As for villain, has he pulled any kind of bluff donk play like this before? If so, what is he doing it with? Air? A ****ty pair? If he were an unknown I would drop ship on the turn, but if he'll do this with a ****ty A hi or even the draw that's come in on the turn then I'll call the turn and re-evaluate on the river (calling any A or J and folding to a third flush card).