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Micro-Small Stakes Limit Discussions about micro-small stakes Texas Hold'em (all stakes up to around 15/30)

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Old 04-30-2010, 02:51 AM   #176
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Re: OFFICIAL MicroStakesLIMIT stats thread (part 2)

Quote:
I read this post like a week ago but couldn't reply due to being ban. The main problem I see is you not stealing enough. you can steal in co to 35%, Btn 65%, and SB 85%. Once you get that down your win rate would increase at least .5/BB. one thing I also notice is your turn c-bet is 10% lower then normal this could be due to taking passive line like check turn and call river. or not two barrel your non showdown hands enough. my assumption for this is your higher wtsd 38% and lower w%wsf. Also you should 3 bet more in later position try to get it up to 7-8%.

With defending I call any two from the BB when SS steal reason due you have position so you control the pot size. Work with floating and pure bluffing more.

It is tough to pay attention when you playing a lot of tables just keep working at it. I am doing this to make it up to all the time I didn't post advice in the forum and helping out.
hi Don

thanks for the feedback. I only just read this not because i was banned but because i havent checked this thread for a bit (figured everyone had moved on from my turn at the head of the queue )

one issue i have with stealing and bvb is that when MMTing (ive got down to like 12-15 tables in what has so far been a failed attempt to curb the draining of my bankroll) is that im flip flopping between whether the marginal steal hands are working for me or whether im getting pwned by people who play back at me because im not supposed to have anything and i dont have heaps of time to figure out what to do. 2 months ago i thought i was doing just fine but the last 2 months i feel like no matter what i do im getting soulread by some regs who im sure have reads.

i guess what im saying is that yes i know i should steal alot and i really thought i was stealing with a fairly wide range given that im MMTing - but you arent he first person to say i dont steal enough which is interesting and something im taking note of. Sometimes i just feel that its not worth it trying to steal versus tags taht palyback and lags with the marginal junky hands. im anecdotally sick of shipping small HU postflop pots to my villians. if this happens alot thats really gunna add up and kill my winrate. as i said im flip flopping cos even as i type this i know what the inevitable reply will be.

if what you guys are getting at is that whilst im winning when opening in blind battles that im not winning enough then please clarify by replying to this. i'll try and look back over others stats to see what they are doing when opening in blind battles.

Don, would you be able to post shots of your stats that match the ones i posted that are relevant to this bvb discussion? thanks
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Old 04-30-2010, 08:44 AM   #177
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Re: OFFICIAL MicroStakesLIMIT stats thread (part 2)

OK Guys, please take a look. I THINK I am just running real bad since I was once a winner over a large sample to the tune of 1BB/100 and used to play as high as 5/10. Took a break from the game to go donk around at PLO after withdrawing a bunch of profits. Trying to grind it back up, but off to a rough start. Thank god for Rakeback is all I can say.

Bankroll is sitting at $3200. It was $3300 when I started this experiment even though I am down much more based on play alone. Help me find my leaks because it can't be all run-bad.

Note: HEM treats calling a raise out of BB as a cold call so that number is a bit skewed

Results By Stakes



By Position:



Steal Results



Blind Steal Defense and Attempts:



Hands at Showdown:



Preflop Action:



Graph: And now the ugly visual (note the couple of horrible downswings...variance? Or am I sucking up the joint?)

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Old 04-30-2010, 08:55 AM   #178
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Re: OFFICIAL MicroStakesLIMIT stats thread (part 2)

You don't showdown enough, IMO.

Edit: And steal more from the SB. This should be > 50%. And defend your blinds more.
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Old 04-30-2010, 09:29 AM   #179
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Re: OFFICIAL MicroStakesLIMIT stats thread (part 2)

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Originally Posted by Leroy2DaBeroy View Post
You don't showdown enough, IMO.

Edit: And steal more from the SB. This should be > 50%. And defend your blinds more.
On blind steal/defense. The numbers are heaviily skewed by my early hands where this was a big problem. Since reading WITHG (last 3K or so?) I have opened it up and also been defending more.

Showdown......point noted. Where should this number be these days?

Also: 1/2 VPIP is inflated because most of those hands are 6 max....rest is FR.
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Old 04-30-2010, 09:31 AM   #180
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Re: OFFICIAL MicroStakesLIMIT stats thread (part 2)

Playing a 17/12-18/14 style, somewhere between 35-38, IMO.
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Old 04-30-2010, 11:21 AM   #181
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Re: OFFICIAL MicroStakesLIMIT stats thread (part 2)

Ant,

Leroyisrite

I think you should 3! more in late position, think about how wide MP3 and CO open's are and adjust accordingly.

AF + your Strat posts makes me think you are too spewy post-flop. Don't spite raise donk-bets. LOL, thank them, and play your hand vs the info they just gave you.

I think your AF should be in the 1.8-2.0 range.

Also, DONT FOCUS on the stats for the next 10K hands. Drop down and play more 1/2, adjust your play there calling down lighter, calling more raising less, etc. As you find success there, your confidence and play will be ready for another shot at 2/4.
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Old 04-30-2010, 11:35 AM   #182
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Re: OFFICIAL MicroStakesLIMIT stats thread (part 2)

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Ant,

Leroyisrite

I think you should 3! more in late position, think about how wide MP3 and CO open's are and adjust accordingly.

AF + your Strat posts makes me think you are too spewy post-flop. Don't spite raise donk-bets. LOL, thank them, and play your hand vs the info they just gave you.

I think your AF should be in the 1.8-2.0 range.

Also, DONT FOCUS on the stats for the next 10K hands. Drop down and play more 1/2, adjust your play there calling down lighter, calling more raising less, etc. As you find success there, your confidence and play will be ready for another shot at 2/4.
Thanks. Will definitely make the modifications. I think the post flop aggro is a fair and valid comment.

As far as the stakes go, since my overall BR is only down 25 Bets due to RB, I will try to make these changes at 2/4, but I promise to give myself a stop loss where I will drop down. Playing FR 1/2 with 1600 Bets would drive me nuts. Need to figure out a proper stop/loss but I think it will be something along the lines of another 100 Bets or so. The RB is keeping me afloat thankfully so I can try to work these leaks out at this level (or so I think )
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Old 04-30-2010, 12:08 PM   #183
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Re: OFFICIAL MicroStakesLIMIT stats thread (part 2)

Moving out of your comfort zone is easier at lower stakes IMO.

Also what's wrong with 1/2? I play it because its profitable, and your "hourly" is currently negative at 2/4 so you aren't giving up anything but Ego...
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Old 04-30-2010, 12:46 PM   #184
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Re: OFFICIAL MicroStakesLIMIT stats thread (part 2)

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you aren't giving up anything but Ego...
Did I mention I have a big one? I promise to impose a strict stop loss if I can't correct this at 2/4. When you add in my R/B I am only down about $100 over 12000 hands.

I won't let my ego destroy my bankroll. I grew it from $100 to $6100 (accounting for $3000 I have withdrawn) and cherish it even though I make in excess of 100K a year in my real job. I have no interest in going on mega tilt and refusing to drop down. Just the act of working in 1/2 games as opposed to the 3/6 games I was working in will serve affectively as me dropping down.

Heres the deal. If over the next 12000 hands I post similar results (I am down 138 bets) I will drop down. Actually I won't go that far. 100 BB stop loss. I am going to filter my database from today forward so I can track it, but mostly because I want to see my numbers after the next 10-12 K without them being impacted by the first 12K.

God I hate sounding like the stubborn guy who refuses to see the forrest for the trees, but I really believe I just need to tweak things a little. Yes, the games are tougher than in the past, but I have won as high as 5/10 a little less than 2 years ago so I have confidence that I can iron this out at 2/4.

I am also participating in a session review this month for the first time. I am committed to eliminating my leaks. I will try to post more hands also. I started posting a lot, but slowed down as of late.
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Old 04-30-2010, 01:05 PM   #185
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Re: OFFICIAL MicroStakesLIMIT stats thread (part 2)

Ant,

Grunch MOAR! makes you think much harder about everything.

-You don't know results
-You have time to think through various lines, use pokerstove, etc. to come up with the best line.
-people will let you know if your though process is off, whether you were the OP or not
-When people start "+1" your grunches you'll get a warm fuzzy (good for that ego too )

I've learned SOOOOO much more by responding to threads, than posting hands and "looking for answers".

IMO
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Old 04-30-2010, 01:23 PM   #186
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Re: OFFICIAL MicroStakesLIMIT stats thread (part 2)

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Originally Posted by Duff86 View Post
Ant,

Grunch MOAR! makes you think much harder about everything.

-You don't know results
-You have time to think through various lines, use pokerstove, etc. to come up with the best line.
-people will let you know if your though process is off, whether you were the OP or not
-When people start "+1" your grunches you'll get a warm fuzzy (good for that ego too )

I've learned SOOOOO much more by responding to threads, than posting hands and "looking for answers".

IMO
Abrolutely!

Even took my first stab at a ninja grunch...Although I think the response is severely lacking since I was trying to work through my stove while I was on a conference call
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Old 05-02-2010, 10:50 AM   #187
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Re: OFFICIAL MicroStakesLIMIT stats thread (part 2)

Since I withdrew a few months ago I have been suffering. At first I was thinking downswing and since my graph dropped straight down for a good while, I still think that was at least part of it. But I finally got around to looking at stats and comparing them with others. I thought I would post this for suggestions.

These are my last 29k hands at 6 max. Looking at about 30k of FR stats my losses aren't so dramatic but the blind defense is about as wide. My blind losses are awful. The other positions are all winning but I can see where I need to improve in those so I didn't post it.

It appears to me I am defending waaaay to wide a range in the blinds (especially the big blind).

I know I am a little tighter in the other positions (maybe play too many early or too few late idk) than most of the better players here and it looks like I don't three bet enough but I think the only spurting arterial leak is in the blinds. Any thoughts?

Edited to add: These are Mostly 1/2 stats, a lot of .50/1 and a few recent .25/.50

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Old 05-02-2010, 10:55 AM   #188
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Re: OFFICIAL MicroStakesLIMIT stats thread (part 2)

Bona,

3Bet Stat is way too low. Check my Poohbah Post for example.

AF and AFq are too low. Each poker site normally has a nice big raise button. Use it

You're definitely losing too much money in the blinds. Maybe sign up for a Blind Play Session Review?

More stats would help.
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Old 05-02-2010, 10:57 AM   #189
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Re: OFFICIAL MicroStakesLIMIT stats thread (part 2)

I don't play FR anymore, but 23/14 seems a little off to me. I'd imagine that it's certainly not bad, but isn't something like 21/16 a little better?

Oh, and yeah, your 3-betting is definitely pretty low at 5.1%. Are you ever 3-betting steals from the BTN/SB with Ax hands or lower pocket pairs?

Your AF/AFq is what really strikes me as odd, however. 31.9% is incredibly passive, and it might be what you need to address the most. Do you have problems value betting? Are you giving up the initiative a lot in favor of check/calling?
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Old 05-02-2010, 11:06 AM   #190
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Re: OFFICIAL MicroStakesLIMIT stats thread (part 2)

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Bona,

3Bet Stat is way too low. Check my Poohbah Post for example.

AF and AFq are too low. Each poker site normally has a nice big raise button. Use it

You're definitely losing too much money in the blinds. Maybe sign up for a Blind Play Session Review?

More stats would help.
Ya, agree and will follow through. More stats would be good but I am 1-2 tabler and only play about 4k hands per month combined 6 max and FR so by the time I get more stats they will not reflect my current playing style I am afraid. Good advice thanx for the response.

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Originally Posted by JamesBJames View Post
I don't play FR anymore, but 23/14 seems a little off to me. I'd imagine that it's certainly not bad, but isn't something like 21/16 a little better?

Oh, and yeah, your 3-betting is definitely pretty low at 5.1%. Are you ever 3-betting steals from the BTN/SB with Ax hands or lower pocket pairs?

Your AF/AFq is what really strikes me as odd, however. 31.9% is incredibly passive, and it might be what you need to address the most. Do you have problems value betting? Are you giving up the initiative a lot in favor of check/calling?
Ya, 3 betting is low compared to others I obviously need to fire at a little wider range there. That might be the AF problem also.

These stats are all 6 max. I didn't post my FR stats. So really my VPIP and PFR may be low not high.

Thanx for the help
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Old 05-02-2010, 11:08 AM   #191
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Re: OFFICIAL MicroStakesLIMIT stats thread (part 2)

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These stats are all 6 max. I didn't post my FR stats. So really my VPIP and PFR may be low not high.
That's 6max? You'll need to lag it up big time than...
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Old 05-02-2010, 11:10 AM   #192
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Re: OFFICIAL MicroStakesLIMIT stats thread (part 2)

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That's 6max? You'll need to lag it up big time than...
This.

Those are really really nitty 6-max stats. Standard TAG stats a few years ago were 26/18, so I would try to at least get there.
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Old 05-04-2010, 04:13 PM   #193
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Re: OFFICIAL MicroStakesLIMIT stats thread (part 2)

Weird trend ....



Its the same at all limits, I for some reason keep overplaying from this position, but I am its not costing me..yet

Thoughts?
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Old 05-04-2010, 04:21 PM   #194
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Re: OFFICIAL MicroStakesLIMIT stats thread (part 2)

You're underplaying your other positions, IMO.

Well, technically, it's somewhere in between, I suppose.

Edit: You're somewhere between Stages 1 and 2 in EP and roughly Stage 2 in LP. Focus on position and why you're doing what you're doing.
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Old 05-04-2010, 06:36 PM   #195
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Re: OFFICIAL MicroStakesLIMIT stats thread (part 2)

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Originally Posted by Leroy2DaBeroy View Post
You're underplaying your other positions, IMO.

Well, technically, it's somewhere in between, I suppose.

Edit: You're somewhere between Stages 1 and 2 in EP and roughly Stage 2 in LP. Focus on position and why you're doing what you're doing.

Gotcha, and took another look at my stats and filtered out everything except .1/.2 and broke it into first 17k and last 10k to view a progression (I hoped)

First 18k


Last 10k


I can def see my positional awareness has improved but it looks like my PFr is low, I can see an increase in profitability (won more in last 10k than first 18k hands and I am closer to 2BB/100) But I can also can see I got a long way to go in comparing stats.

My ATS is weak
MY AFq is low
I cold call too much and 3 bet too little (simple solution seems instead of CC I 3bet?)
Im folding too much out of BB
I limp when I should raise too much

If I cut it down to last 4400 hands it gets a little better with it being 16.84/10.34 thought I still have some of same problems but am averaging 3.06BB/100 but Ill attribute it to variance.
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Old 05-05-2010, 02:33 PM   #196
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Re: OFFICIAL MicroStakesLIMIT stats thread (part 2)

Interesting phenomenon I just saw...not sure what it means, but maybe you guys can check.

I just filtered my stats by VPIP=yes to see how I am doing when I choose to enter a pot. In my 13K or so hands (running horribly as you all know) I am up $2704 for a 23.08 BB/100 when I decide to play. When I don't VPIP I am down $3500 for a -7.68 BB/100.

What does this mean? This just does not seem logical to me. What are your guys numbers in this situation.
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Old 05-05-2010, 02:44 PM   #197
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Re: OFFICIAL MicroStakesLIMIT stats thread (part 2)

You fold your blinds too much and/or spew postflop/don't maximize value when you get a free look in the BB?

Or you don't VPIP/PFR enough and/or spew/don't maximize your value when you do.

Probably some combo of the above.

Edit: Analyzing this isn't really going to help, IMO. You're not playing well and/or running bad. Trying to play better is all you can do.
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Old 05-05-2010, 03:05 PM   #198
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Re: OFFICIAL MicroStakesLIMIT stats thread (part 2)

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Originally Posted by Leroy2DaBeroy View Post
You fold your blinds too much and/or spew postflop/don't maximize value when you get a free look in the BB?

Or you don't VPIP/PFR enough and/or spew/don't maximize your value when you do.

Probably some combo of the above.

Edit: Analyzing this isn't really going to help, IMO. You're not playing well and/or running bad. Trying to play better is all you can do.
I agree, but since my overall stats are basically in line it seems odd that I would draw a conclusion that i am not vpip'ing enough. I guess I was curious to see what other players win rates are when vpip'ing. If I am spewing postflop my hunch is my BB/100 would be lower than others when i enter pots.
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Old 05-05-2010, 03:17 PM   #199
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Re: OFFICIAL MicroStakesLIMIT stats thread (part 2)

The answer's in your blind play, primarily, IMO.

You're getting smoked in the SB and merely beat in the BB. Are you completing/calling in multiway pots often? I'd look there for some issues postflop, especially with regards to your WTSD.

Edit: Filter for when you called or 3! from the BB vs. an ATS. I happened to do this recently for my last ~12k hands and I was +BB/100.
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Old 05-05-2010, 03:26 PM   #200
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Re: OFFICIAL MicroStakesLIMIT stats thread (part 2)

regarding my early question on WTSD, does anyone have any good posts bookmarked on this stat or on the concept of showdown value?
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