Sounds like you're well on your way to being the world's best 4/8 player.

^^ Why the snark? Sounds optimal. Limp in spots you should limp in. Realize you shouldn't limp in other spots.

Because just like "I'll be more charitable when I make more money" and "I'll study harder when it's something I want to study," it's fine when it happens but it almost never happens.

Most people on this forum who adopted the attitude "I want to be the best 3/6-6/12 player ever" end up playing 3/6-6/12 forever, and most people who adopted the "I want to crush that juicy 20/40-40/80 game" attitude move up.

And it's easy but not obvious to understand why. Ay small stakes nobody is bankroll limited. While it's nice ego-wise to move up from 3/6 to 80/160 without putting in additional money, the reality is that an 8/16-20/40 bankroll is wrll within reach of most incomes. So the goal should be to spend as LITTLE time at each stake, not the most. Winrates are super variable - you can play good poker for 500 hours and break even, then play bad poker for 500 hours and crush, and then convince yourself that bad poker is good poker. So the only way to really become truly good at small stakes by self study is to put in a holy metric ****ton of hours, and when you do that, chances are you just don't have enough time in your life to move up.

In that case, why give advice on sslhe at all? Just reply to every thread with "get a job and move up stakes".

Assuming someone wants to play live/low stakes lhe, I think it's better to give advice for that stake.

Sent from my LG-D950G using Tapatalk

Playing 4/8 as if it were 20/40 doesn't lose money. It's not like I'm giving advice which is counterproductive. It's accepting, say, $4/hr now instead of $6/hr now in return for $40/hr later instead of $20/hr later.

And to be clear, the reason why open-limping is a thing you give up at higher stakes is that it's marginal to begin with. It's not so profitable that it can encounter resistance and still be profitable. Close decisions, by definition, are not insanely profitable. You get 3.2 overlimpers instead of 3.5 or 3.8 instead of 4.2 and the scales of the decision tip the other way.

I agree with Cali. Correct spots to limp first in are so infrequent that you could probably raise all the hands that you could limp with profitably to the effect that any change in your winrate would be negligible.

People limp all sorts of garbage that they would overlimp with.

If a player thinks he has figured out which hands to limp in small stakes, and recognizes that at higher stakes he would limp less, that's already boss. No reason to treat him like a noob and tell him to move to a more simplified style.

If same player then posts in medium LHE about a hand he limps, go off on him there.

Go back through the ranges he posted and tell me whether he needs a more simplified style or whether he can handle additional complexity.

In particular, note what he's proposing to raise in EP and which hands he'd open limp.

lol...you ARE giving advice that's counter product and it's obvious, hence the snark. Tables with people open limping 95% of their hands and folding the same hands to a raise are pretty common at 4/8, and for anyone saying otherwise, you obviously don't play 4/8. As far as being the best "4/8" player in the world...thank you lol. I try to keep ego out of my game tends to make you do stupid things, I play where I'm comfortable,(prob lucky for you,lmao), have no prob losing $200 in a session, back to back it hurts a lil, not ready to lose $400-500 in two hours. is that a reflection of my knowledge or ability, honestly, who cares lmao. Pretty obvious I was right tho! :0)

In particular, note what he's proposing to raise in EP and which hands he'd open limp.[/QUOTE]

In which type of game? Tell me where my open limping range is wrong in the game that I described. In fact, in that type of game, there are NO hands Id raise up front with..I"m limping Aces, if a raise means it folds around to the blinds. LMAO there is nothing "simple" about my game...I'm a knowledgeable thinking 4/8 player, in fact on my way to greatness according to a reliable source lmao. ANd in a tuff game, once again I'm raising in EP A10s+ 1010+ AJ+ and every so often kQ or mid suited connectors (balance). Can't give same advice for a 4/8 game as you do for a 20/40, now maybe at 20/40 this type of game is rare.

and FYI, not really here for advice. Kept reading all the horrible advice you were giving my fellow 4/8 er's, not all the time, but at times you guys are way out in left field somewhere lmao! And figured I'd come back and lend them a helping hand. Case in point, the raise or fold in early position..DESPITE what the table is doing lmao...yea great advice, not counter productive at all. lol. To my fellow 4/8 er's I'd take what some of these guys say with a grain of salt and don't mind their condescending tone, they're like that with all 4/8 players.

and no noob, have done my homework, read the books, ska mal, etc. honestly, though if you're playing 4/8 get your hands on IZMETS fakali or something...its old, but relative to alot of 4/8 games.

I'll reorganize the quotes and leave out the feelings stuff, but I think Bob's post answers this...

If one of us were to sit in a 3/6 game (say waiting for a buddy to punt a stack off at a Golden Nugget MTT), we're probably not open limping a lot. We're raising a lot. Why? It is more fun. It isn't less profitable. Good things happen.

I'm sure there are games where open limping some hands is the most correct way to play them. I disagree with the idea that this stuff isn't habit forming. People learn an instinctive way to play cards because playing live is boring. These habits can be expensive to break. For me, it was limping small PP in early position. It took online poker to break me of this habit.
Assuming this isn't sarcasm, this is the perfect example of why you don't adjust your game based on experience. If people are folding to you too much, raise much more. Raising nothing in EP is clearly wrong, as most of the hands you'd play in EP are highly profitable. It makes me think that you don't raise enough or this is the best game in the world, as you can just steal the blinds rake-free.

You profit in two ways in small stakes games

• You fold clearly losing hands.
• The pots you win are bigger, because you raise when you have the best of it and they don't.

Giving up half your profit is bad.



Short term luck make some wrong things seem like good poker. "Hey, I'll adapt by limping everything." I think there's one spot where it would be OK. If you were in EP and you had a true maniac behind you (he's not looking and raising every hand), you could argue that you'd limp 100% of your playing hands and then have a liberal LRR strategy. You'd get a bunch of free information from the field and still be able to charge them the max.

WOW, people aren't just folding to me, there folding to everyone! habit forming??? lmao will the condescension ever end! lmao...heres the ONLY habit I have I watch the people at the table, note the way they are playing and make adjustments based off of those observations..if it's correct to NEVER limp up front..a tough game..then I'm never limping up front (and I've said this multiple times???) BUUUT if its correct to open limp all of your playable hands then that's what I'm gonna do, based on table, not some idiotic dogma... so chasing out the j8os,

You profit in two ways in small stakes games
You fold clearly losing hands.
The pots you win are bigger, because you raise when you have the best of it and they don't.
my reply...a DUHHHHH lmao!

and how does raising a hand like A10suited, in EP, chasing everyone out of pot, accomplish either of those???? (once again assuming that the raise will most likely fold table around) like I said , I'm here to help others, from the oft times simplistic to just dead wrong advice you people tend to give to my fellow 4/8 ers. But your replies are humorous if nothing else.

any of you that play 4/8 regularly,take note and understand that some of these people think that a game where you will have 4-5 people limp in, ESPECIALLY if someone limps early! BUUUT fold those sames hands to a early raise is RARE!????? lmao...just a glimpse into how out of touch they are with the game they are "advising"?? you on, lmao. You guys always did make me laugh.

Why don't you just pretend to look and raise a bunch of hands? J7o will show huge profit stealing the blinds.

ATo will win less than the blinds per hand in the long run, thus when they all fold it's the best possible outcome. The only hands that typically win more than 1.5 small bets are AA, KK, and AKs.

Just to make something clear, I am a lifetime loser at 4/8.

I wouldn't doubt it, lmao

wow you guys are clueless...stealing blinds at 4/8? Yea that's the way to make money lmao!

what about A10suited which is the hand i was refering too, but enough of this tread I made my point...play your hands as you like ...just my opinion on subject.

I would prefer that they all fold when I have ATs.

This is spot on for the three casinos I regularly play. Limp or raise from EP....and you still get 6 to the flop. At one casino I place, it will be 3! or 4! pre....and easily the flop average is 4 players. Nobody folds PF in the games I play. (3/6 and 4/8)

I would prefer they all fold when I have anything except AA. Stealing the blinds is insanely profitable. I'm also happy to play a hand HU vs the BB.

Yup. The opposition would have to play very badly to make me want calls.