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Old 01-19-2013, 12:47 PM   #76
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Re: Survivor Caramoan - Fans vs. Favorites (Premieres Wednesday February 13th at 8PM ET on CBS)

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Wat? He traded 6th place in an alliance for 7th place in a different alliance, without ever negotiating what he'd get in exchange for it, or even trying to form a sub-alliance with the new tribe, though he had a lot of time to do so while they were Pagonging all the people he screwed.

All he did was whine at TC how he was "entitled" to get something. Then they voted his ass off.
I didn't say he didn't make mistakes, or do dumb things. I wasn't very impressed with his play, but he was on the chopping block from day 1 (and was told so by his tribe constantly), and made it to day 30. He's clearly there to play, loves the game, and I think he's a reasonably intelligent person, even if he did do some dumb stuff last time around.
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Old 01-19-2013, 01:32 PM   #77
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Re: Survivor Caramoan - Fans vs. Favorites (Premieres Wednesday February 13th at 8PM ET on CBS)

I'm not defending Cochran's flip, but people ITT are being incredibly results oriented. Making F7 with no allies and a fractured six-person alliance is a pretty excellent position to be in, especially when you have self-interested, rational players like Albert still in the game to help you orchestrate a flip. The problem Cochran ran into was that the people on the bottom of the alliance who should have flipped were all passive idiots who didn't realize their position in the alliance until it was too late.
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Old 01-19-2013, 03:29 PM   #78
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Re: Survivor Caramoan - Fans vs. Favorites (Premieres Wednesday February 13th at 8PM ET on CBS)

7th in a 7 person is often times going to be a lot better then 6th in a 6 person anyhow. He was just duped/mismanaged his situation post-flip. He could easily learn.
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Old 01-19-2013, 05:31 PM   #79
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Re: Survivor Caramoan - Fans vs. Favorites (Premieres Wednesday February 13th at 8PM ET on CBS)

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I'm not defending Cochran's flip, but people ITT are being incredibly results oriented. Making F7 with no allies and a fractured six-person alliance is a pretty excellent position to be in, especially when you have self-interested, rational players like Albert still in the game to help you orchestrate a flip. The problem Cochran ran into was that the people on the bottom of the alliance who should have flipped were all passive idiots who didn't realize their position in the alliance until it was too late.
And as far as lasting long, yes Ozzy wanted him out from day 1. But Cochran did nothing to save himself, he just got lucky they saw Semhar as even more useless, Papa Bear as more of a social outcast, then the others got nervous Elyse was too close to Ozzy, etc.

Cochran could have stayed with Dawn and drawn rocks, then those two could have worked something with the other tribe. Seeing as he was terrible at challenges, not well liked by anyone, and a clueless strategist, flipping didn't gain him anything at all.

But yes, I suppose he could have learned and play better this time around. It can't get much worse than when Coach owns you.
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Old 01-19-2013, 06:02 PM   #80
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Re: Survivor Caramoan - Fans vs. Favorites (Premieres Wednesday February 13th at 8PM ET on CBS)

Why do so many of you think Cochran is any good as a player? He's one of the worst players who have ever been on. He's a physical weakling who cannot contribute to challenges or compete for an immunity idol. His social skills are even worse. Who cares if he's a "big fan" of the show?

He's a waste of space.
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Old 01-19-2013, 06:17 PM   #81
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Re: Survivor Caramoan - Fans vs. Favorites (Premieres Wednesday February 13th at 8PM ET on CBS)

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Who cares if he's a "big fan" of the show?

He's a waste of space.
well apparently hes now a survivor favourite instead of a fan
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Old 01-19-2013, 06:25 PM   #82
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Re: Survivor Caramoan - Fans vs. Favorites (Premieres Wednesday February 13th at 8PM ET on CBS)

The reason I'm so optimistic for Cochran this time because Savaii was historically one of the worst tribes for him to end up on whereas this Favorites tribe seems to be the opposite of that. He's got Wine and Cheese bonds with Andrea and Francesca, both Corinne and Shep seem to love him, he's got good relationships from SP with Dawn and Brandon, and the young strong guys (Malcolm/Erik) are both big fans of the game that I think are going to be far easier for him to get along with than Ozzy and Keith. If people buy the "flipping didn't work for me last time, I'm not going to make the same mistake twice" motivation, I think he could find himself in a really cushy spot entering a merge.

I was also really impressed with his continued referencing of what Yul has taught him about the game in the previously posted interview with Dalton Ross. Cochran's clearly an intelligent guy who is very capable of understanding what changes he needs to make to have more success, it's just a matter of actually executing, but at this point I think it's fair to say that almost all signs seem to be pointing in his favor.
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Old 01-19-2013, 06:26 PM   #83
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Re: Survivor Caramoan - Fans vs. Favorites (Premieres Wednesday February 13th at 8PM ET on CBS)

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Why do so many of you think Cochran is any good as a player? He's one of the worst players who have ever been on. He's a physical weakling who cannot contribute to challenges or compete for an immunity idol. His social skills are even worse. Who cares if he's a "big fan" of the show?

He's a waste of space.
I mean he wasn't very good on his season, but he's not one of the worst players to have ever been on the show. He's not even one of the worst players on his own tribe this time around. Phillip/Brandon/Francesca are all pretty brutal.

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Cochran's clearly an intelligent guy who is very capable of understanding what changes he needs to make to have more success, it's just a matter of actually executing, but at this point I think it's fair to say that almost all signs seem to be pointing in his favor.
This is well put imo
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Old 01-19-2013, 06:51 PM   #84
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Re: Survivor Caramoan - Fans vs. Favorites (Premieres Wednesday February 13th at 8PM ET on CBS)

I don't think the people knocking Cochran are considering that All-Star seasons play much differently from normal ones.
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Old 01-19-2013, 07:58 PM   #85
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Re: Survivor Caramoan - Fans vs. Favorites (Premieres Wednesday February 13th at 8PM ET on CBS)

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Why do so many of you think Cochran is any good as a player? He's one of the worst players who have ever been on. He's a physical weakling who cannot contribute to challenges or compete for an immunity idol. His social skills are even worse. Who cares if he's a "big fan" of the show?

He's a waste of space.
But he wrote a paper at Harvard, or Yale, or Wichita State, or wherever it was that he went to school.
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Old 01-19-2013, 08:28 PM   #86
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Re: Survivor Caramoan - Fans vs. Favorites (Premieres Wednesday February 13th at 8PM ET on CBS)

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I'm not defending Cochran's flip, but people ITT are being incredibly results oriented. Making F7 with no allies and a fractured six-person alliance is a pretty excellent position to be in, especially when you have self-interested, rational players like Albert still in the game to help you orchestrate a flip. The problem Cochran ran into was that the people on the bottom of the alliance who should have flipped were all passive idiots who didn't realize their position in the alliance until it was too late.
Except for the fact that if he had made it to the end there are 5 jurors who are almost 100% never giving him a vote. He might have got Dawn's vote but he had no chance at the others.

He definitely is set up well though this season. Savaii may have been the worst tribe for him (I don't think so) but this is without doubt the best tribe he could ever hope for and I see him sticking around for awhile.

I think it is very different to any other all star type season though with the type of players cast. There's certainly no Boston Rob type that will target the thinking players straight up.
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Old 01-19-2013, 08:38 PM   #87
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Re: Survivor Caramoan - Fans vs. Favorites (Premieres Wednesday February 13th at 8PM ET on CBS)

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Except for the fact that if he had made it to the end there are 5 jurors who are almost 100% never giving him a vote. He might have got Dawn's vote but he had no chance at the others.
That's why I said I wasn't defending the move. I do think this is a stretch, though, as Jim and Dawn both could have voted for him.
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Old 01-19-2013, 09:01 PM   #88
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Re: Survivor Caramoan - Fans vs. Favorites (Premieres Wednesday February 13th at 8PM ET on CBS)

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Originally Posted by K.O.S. View Post
I'm not defending Cochran's flip, but people ITT are being incredibly results oriented. Making F7 with no allies and a fractured six-person alliance is a pretty excellent position to be in
Keeping in mind what Survivor is and the ultimate purpose of the game, please explain how a 6-person alliance that all voted together through six straight tribal councils was "fractured".

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The problem Cochran ran into was that the people on the bottom of the alliance who should have flipped
Pro-tip: The actual "pecking order" isn't always so clearly defined when you're out there actually playing the game. If Special Agent Shepherd and/or Natalie play in South Pacific under that tribe/group dynamic, they most likely leave around where Edna, Brandon, or Rick were booted. But playing in RI with the GOAT, they're at the top of the pecking order and make it to the F3.


edit- in for BrendAndrea

Last edited by swag_check; 01-19-2013 at 09:08 PM.
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Old 01-20-2013, 04:44 AM   #89
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Re: Survivor Caramoan - Fans vs. Favorites (Premieres Wednesday February 13th at 8PM ET on CBS)

The Cochran haters are trying to generalize too much from his performance in SP imo. Every season there are people who screw up a challenge, don't mesh with their tribe, or whatever, and up being booted with little fanfare; the difference with Cochran is that he flamed out in much more dramatic fashion and received enough focus in the editing that his failure looked a lot more significant than it really was. Unlike most of those people, Cochran knows enough about the game that given the right cast he could do very well; and as cstone said, this is basically the best possible cast for him.

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edit- in for BrendAndrea
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Old 01-20-2013, 06:07 PM   #90
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Re: Survivor Caramoan - Fans vs. Favorites (Premieres Wednesday February 13th at 8PM ET on CBS)

I so would've preferred to see Stephen Fishbach fill the Cochran role. It's pretty disappointing really. Fishbach would've navigated his way through this season magnificently.
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