Two Plus Two Publishing LLC Two Plus Two Publishing LLC
 

Go Back   Two Plus Two Poker Forums > > >

Notices

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old Yesterday, 04:14 PM   #10676
Namath12
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Namath12's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 44,093
Re: Game of Thrones Bookreader Thread: ***TV SPOILERS ITT***

Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisV View Post
Was pointed out by someone on r/asoiaf that Tyrion is one of the few people on Westeros who knows that Littlefinger betrayed Ned and that Jon is riding south for a little chat with him. The Hound also knows and is riding north and might call in at Winterfell. Littlefinger has to be not long for this world.
Yeah I didn't even think of all this.

I can't find anything saying that someone else was given lordship of Harrenhal since I made that post so I assume it's still Littlefinger. If they're planning on maintaining consistency with the "curse of Harrenhal" then Littlefinger's days must be numbered. A quick glance at the Wiki indicates that not only did bad things befall previous Lords of Harrenhal, but their entire families/houses were wiped out. http://awoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/Harrenhal#Curse

Quote:
Houses to have held Harrenhal
House Qoherys held Harrenhal from 1 AC - 37 AC, wiped out by Harren the Red.
House Harroway held Harrenhal from 37 AC - 44 AC, killed by King Maegor I Targaryen.
House Towers held Harrenhal from 44 AC - unknown, died out two generations later.
House Strong held Harrenhal from unknown - 131 AC, last of the line executed by Lord Cregan Stark.
House Lothston held Harrenhal from 151 AC - unknown, line was brought down in the reign of King Maekar I Targaryen.
House Whent held Harrenhal for three generations. Lady Shella Whent surrendered Harrenhal in 298 AC to the forces of Lord Tywin Lannister.
House Slynt held Harrenhal for a short period of time in 299 AC.
House Baelish has held Harrenhal since 299 AC.
Also Littlefinger actually mentions the curse out loud when he's given Harrenhal after Tyrion sent Janos to the Wall
Namath12 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Yesterday, 04:15 PM   #10677
Namath12
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Namath12's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 44,093
Re: Game of Thrones Bookreader Thread: ***TV SPOILERS ITT***

(That assumes we assume House Whent is also extinct, can't remember if that's been confirmed or not)
Namath12 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Yesterday, 09:19 PM   #10678
Bluegrassplayer
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Bluegrassplayer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: China
Posts: 32,144
Re: Game of Thrones Bookreader Thread: ***TV SPOILERS ITT***

I think that the shield Brienne chooses is Whent's and she comments that it's a dead house or something along those lines.

Pretty sure they are done for.
Bluegrassplayer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Yesterday, 10:05 PM   #10679
ChrisV
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
ChrisV's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Adelaide, Australia
Posts: 33,580
Re: Game of Thrones Bookreader Thread: ***TV SPOILERS ITT***

Quote:
Originally Posted by StringerB View Post
I've been telling friends for years I think Dany is going to go down the "Mad-King" path... I think it would make for a great turn in the story (and Martin is a bit of an unconventional story teller).

TV would probably dictate that she redeems herself at the end. But if that fat bastard ever finishes the books I'm hoping for full blown bad guy status by the end!
This is one reason I think it would be interesting if Dany isn't really a Targ, because her Targaryen identity is how she justifies her use of violence to herself. ADWD ends with her rejecting the peace and compromise she has been trying to build in Meereen. She has a hallucinated conversation with Jorah:

Quote:
You are a queen, her bear said. In Westeros. “It is such a long way,” she complained. “I was tired, Jorah. I was weary of war. I wanted to rest, to laugh, to plant trees and see them grow. I am only a young girl.”

No. You are the blood of the dragon. The whispering was growing fainter, as if Ser Jorah were falling farther behind. Dragons plant no trees. Remember that. Remember who you are, what you were made to be. Remember your words.

“Fire and Blood,” Daenerys told the swaying grass.
This is how Dany justifies her actions to herself: that this is what she was MADE to be, it's her birthright, the same song Viserys has been singing to her since she was a kid. I struggle to think that GRRM is going play this Manifest Destiny stuff straight. Even if Dany continues to believe it, the reader will be made to question it. That's why I think the revelation about Dany's past foreshadowed by Lemongate is going to undercut this somehow.
ChrisV is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Yesterday, 10:20 PM   #10680
ChrisV
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
ChrisV's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Adelaide, Australia
Posts: 33,580
Re: Game of Thrones Bookreader Thread: ***TV SPOILERS ITT***

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluegrassplayer View Post
I think that the shield Brienne chooses is Whent's and she comments that it's a dead house or something along those lines.

Pretty sure they are done for.
That's House Lothston, who were also lords of Harrenhal and got wiped out. There are still some Whents around, but it looks like the line might end due to infertility.
ChrisV is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Yesterday, 10:27 PM   #10681
Bluegrassplayer
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Bluegrassplayer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: China
Posts: 32,144
Re: Game of Thrones Bookreader Thread: ***TV SPOILERS ITT***

Ah both previous owners of harenhal and both bat sigils. So the only whent left is married to a frey and has given birth to several stillborns according to the wiki.
Bluegrassplayer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Yesterday, 10:43 PM   #10682
Bluegrassplayer
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Bluegrassplayer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: China
Posts: 32,144
Re: Game of Thrones Bookreader Thread: ***TV SPOILERS ITT***

Having Dany not be a targ at all seems like a pretty big leap. To begin with it just doesn't seem practical to have two major reveals like this in the same series. Jon as a targ is enough (still rooting for tyrion targ though). Also there's no major house for her to belong to. Dayne or some valyrian house? People will throw their books across the room.

I think it's far more likely it's not a major reveal or it is to make her only half targ so there's some confusion and tension over who is the rightful heir between her and Jon.
Bluegrassplayer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Yesterday, 11:02 PM   #10683
ChrisV
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
ChrisV's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Adelaide, Australia
Posts: 33,580
Re: Game of Thrones Bookreader Thread: ***TV SPOILERS ITT***

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluegrassplayer View Post
Having Dany not be a targ at all seems like a pretty big leap. To begin with it just doesn't seem practical to have two major reveals like this in the same series. Jon as a targ is enough (still rooting for tyrion targ though). Also there's no major house for her to belong to. Dayne or some valyrian house? People will throw their books across the room.

I think it's far more likely it's not a major reveal or it is to make her only half targ so there's some confusion and tension over who is the rightful heir between her and Jon.
There's some symmetry to the bastard actually being a Targ and the Targ actually being a nobody. Identity substitutions don't stop at Jon in the books, we have Jeyne being subbed in for Arya, Sansa becoming Alayne, hints about the Lannisters not being trueborn, etc etc.

If Dany is not a Targ at all then she will not have a House, she will be a Lyseni slave that Illyrio bought as an infant. Remember that at the start of AGOT Illyrio talks about "years of planning" for the wedding to Drogo even though he apparently only met Dany 6 months ago. Lyseni women are specifically said to have the blood of Old Valyria and resemble Targs. From The World of Ice and Fire:

Quote:
The Lyseni are also great breeders of slaves, mating beauty with beauty in hopes of producing ever more refined and lovely courtesans and bedslaves. The blood of Valyria still runs strong in Lys, where even the smallfolk oft boast pale skin, silver-gold hair, and the purple, lilac, and pale blue eyes of the dragonlords of old. The Lysene nobility values purity of blood above all and have produced many famous (and infamous) beauties. Even the Targaryen kings and princes of old sometimes turned to Lys in search of wives and paramours, for their blood as for their beauty.
And we know Illyrio has bought Lyseni slaves before and appreciates their beauty, because that's where he got his wife:

Quote:
"A maiden? I know the way of that." Illyrio thrust his right hand up his left sleeve and drew out a silver locket. Inside was a painted likeness of a woman with big blue eyes and pale golden hair streaked by silver. "Serra. I found her in a Lysene pillow house and brought her home to warm my bed, but in the end I wed her.
I still have the Dany not Targ theory as a clear underdog, for the record, but it's one example of how I think a revelation about Dany's birth might play out.
ChrisV is offline   Reply With Quote

Reply
      

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off


Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 12:34 AM.


Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright © 2008-2010, Two Plus Two Interactive
 
 
Poker Players - Streaming Live Online