is it sunday yet?

You took one sentence out of all the argument's i made, a little unfair. What i'm saying is people try to make out every decision Walt makes is only about him, that he has no redeeming qualities(which good people have). But he does have redeeming qualities(all the examples of selfless acts for jesse). That you or i could be Walt(if you consider yourself a good person) given the right circumstances. Him not excepting charity out of pride, him a little bugged that his son was getting the credit for Walt's contribution to the family, him being annoyed that Walt Jr. was listening more to hank than himself etc... Are all normal emotions that some of you guys are trying to use to say Walt is a bad person, and always was. Wouldn't you want credit for something good you did? Wouldn't it annoy you a little if someone was getting credit for something you did? Where has Walt showed something in the beginning of this show where he flucked anyone over? Maybe some of you haven't risked your lives to save a friend(but Walt did for Jesse), but yet you judge him as being a bad person, and you guys are the good ones. I think he should be admired for his loyalty to Jesse, and to his family.

Let me ask you this? If there is no good in Walt then why do we all pull for him? There must be some redeeming qualities no? Why do we like him?

HF eats glass but not plastic. They are accurate to use plastic.

Imo, it is showing Skyler falling into the same situation Walt did, another good person falling into a grey area of good/bad due to the right circumstances. This is exactly what Cranston said in an interview, the show is about ALL people, given the right circumstances, can go bad.

Yes Walt had choices, but he didn't think his choice to go into the meth making business was gonna cause such destruction(that he would cause deaths). He thought he could get in, make some money for a few months(to provide for his family when he was gone), and get out. Skyler has choices too, she doesn't have to do illegal activity, she pushed Walt to let her into the dirty business.

He may have also let jane die to save jesse, beside the benefit it had to him.

I get the pride and ego aspect of the show, but i think the "we can all be bad given the right circumstance" part of the show is an even bigger part than many seem to dismiss.

Cmonson

That's like the only picture that she's not completely grotesque, and she's still not even hot in it.

jane had called his home and extorted him. granted, the money was jesse's due, but you can't say she didn't pose enough of a threat that walt doesn't have good reason to kill her.

of course, this is not an argument against your broader point.

6) He killed him because the show needs to keep portraying Gus as a really dangerous man, but there was no ****ing way he'd kill or injure either Walt or Jesse. Killing the guy was not a bad move on Gus' part, but the scene was a bit lame.

I thought it was the worst bid in the entire episode, and there were much better solutions available. The best bit were the Kenny Rogers t-shirts, obviously.

fishbulb strikes me as the kind of person who watched 6 seasons of The Sopranos before deciding that Tony is essentially just a good man who loves his family.

you're killing this thread, bro. please stop. there are a lot of people itt who are very good at watching TV and breaking it down, so maybe read more and post less. if you can't manage that, then at least go back and carefully watch S01E01 of this show, it lays out the entire thing for you.

or just look at the title, and think about that.

Ffs I was quoting s1 Jesse.

I'm honestly surprised you guys like a real good show like this. I mean, you're demonstrating intense lack of rationality by arguing about a duality of good/bad and claiming Skylar is ugly. I would only assumed you'd be watching Fox and Friends or something instead

Given all the logical reasons for Gus to kill Victor, I think you're gonna have to elaborate if you want your argument that the scene was lame to have merit.

Wow i actually watched the episode DVR'd earlier then I wanted to because I thought there would be some cool convo's about the episode but instead it's just ******ed arguments about Walts morality. This topic should have been discussed and over by season 4.

Looks like I may end up just DVR'ing a few more episode and going the mini-marathon like I originally wanted to.

keeping with the only real discussion about the episode.

I believe there is a couple reasons Gus killed Victor.

1) Because he was acting like an ass by undermining Gus's judgment about Walt/Jesse.
2) He was spotted at the murder scene (this is just standard in the criminal world of movies/TV).
3) To show Walt and Jesse how heartless he really is.

There's isn't just one right and wrong reasons for any ones actions irl or TV/Movies.

I think it's just that he had to kill him because he was spotted at the crime scene and not much else, he's smart enough to use that to try to show walt and jesse that he can be unpredictable/will be willing to kill them even if it's not completely reasonable, to remove the certaincy walt has that if he is needed he won't be killed, but it's fake, the kill is within reason..

were we shown if walt/jesse heard the "were you seen?" conversation? watched twice but a bit unsure how far from them that conversation was and how loud they were talking.

I just think the writers/director tried a bit too hard to show us how dangerous Gus is and the scene came out a bit over the top. The long walk, the careful way of putting his jacket and tie neatly on the hanger, the whole mood of the scene just came across wrong. Gus is a calculated, shrewd, rational person. The scene was about showing off, and he was never a man to show off, but rather a man to get things done discreetly and efficiently.

In my opinion, a scene in which Gus sits Walt and Jesse down, tells them how unforeseen circumstances have made the two of them once again needed for the job to be done properly, and then cut Victor's throat because in needed to be done. No swagger, no great build up to it, just doing all the necessary actions for the operation to run smoothly.

Someone help me explain why Walt and Jessie have a "limited time" until Gus finds another chemist.

After Victor, it is obv that Gus wants quality and won't just let anyone do this. Gale was hard to find and he worked with Walt for weeks/months before he was comfortable enough to attempt to go solo. I'm fairly sure things won't be quite the same if Gus brings in another chemist to observe and ask questions.

Do we think Gus would off Walt/Jessie based on some guy who monitors the cooking via cameras and peepholes?

The show's been off TV forever, there's a bunch of people (like me) watching it live for the first time who haven't been in these discussions before, it's the first ep of the season. There's going to be some talk about the bigger themes.

Also, basically like 3 things happened in this ep (which was awesome) but there's not a lot to talk about. 4 minutes of Gus changing clothes was good TV, but doesn't make for a lot of discussion.

I'm sure it will get better as more eps air.

Loved it. It amazes me how much the actors are capable of doing with each little look and gesture, and how the writers are able to strip all of the fat from the script and leave nothing but the bare essentials, allowing the actors to just do their thing.

I thought the Pulp Fiction scene was great. They also did the weapon choosing scene in Fly so that's at least two scenes they have done, I wonder which one they will do next.

jesse did an amazing job in the episode

so exciiiiiiiiiiited

They did a similar one in episode 2 or 3 as well. I liked that one more, but any tribute to PF is a good one.

Absolutely agree with all of this!!!!

The Jane situation didn't bother me too much. She was a pretty awful person, she threatened the hell out of him, and he does nothing to actively kill her. I'm not that worried about it.

1)What's more a efficient way to talk than saying nothing? As far as discretion goes, they are in the secret superlab.

2)Did you not understand the point that Gus is making to Walt and Jesse? Why on Earth would he want to be calm and reassuring under these circumstances?

1)We don't know that they do. Walt thinks they do, and if Gus could find a chemist he could trust, they would, because Gus clearly doesn't want to work with the unstable Walt. Jesse thinks the chances of Gus finding a new chemist are so slim that they're basically in this for the rest of their short-ass lives.

2)We've seen plenty of Victor monitoring Walt's cooking in person, at least in the last episode of S3.

all these reasons people list here are mostly secondary at best.

the real reason why Gus killed Victor was because he was the only one emotionally adversed towards Jessie and Walt, there was no way he could work with him any more if he continues to employ Walt and Jessie - so it was logical to kill him.

They are now all in the same boat, a boat Victor could have never boarded.

btw: Jessie has to get useful already, his role in the operation become more and more unbelievable.

I tend to agree with Jesse. Victor monitoring with a gun is different than a chemist asking questions.

Imagine if it were another Gale. He'd walk in with a mean look and a gun saying "hurry up and cook"....then check in every 20 min or so and ask "by the way, how do you determine the aluminum consistency?"

if that did happen, then at least walt guys have a heads up until their lives are about to end. In that sense, their time is essentially unlimited as long as their is a need for meth and their product remains superior.