Poker Stars, $2.50/$5 No Limit Omaha Cash, 6 Players
Poker Tools Powered By Holdem Manager - The Ultimate Poker Software Suite. View Hand #37744067

BTN: $1,028.09 (205.6 bb)
SB: $781.78 (156.4 bb)
BB: $496.62 (99.3 bb)
UTG: $618.88 (123.8 bb)
Hero (MP): $706.53 (141.3 bb)
CO: $6,479.51 (1,295.9 bb)

Preflop: Hero is MP with 6 8 5 4
UTG folds, Hero raises to $17.50, 2 folds, SB raises to $57.50, BB folds, Hero calls $40

Flop: ($120) Q 8 4 (2 players)
SB bets $69.67, hero?




sb is a reg(4tabeling)...no other relevant reads/info since i dont PLO much

Call OTF and play turns, tbh if villain is a reg and you aren't that well versed in PLO you're probably going to lose a lot more than your 3.5bb open by defending this pre vs a SB 3bet range at 140bb on average.

Seaking you still folding 50% to 3b:s on plo? Both ip on op

Are you serious? Yeah, wtf is he even doing playing zoom plo 500.

OP, probably best to shove against his c-bet range because turn likely to be difficult or he check folds, unless you hit non spade 2 or 3 and maybe 4 and 8 he continues. Probably best to shove to realise that equity on the flop, 2 pair + gutter to nuts straight. You are not that deep as seaking implies..

It's not 50%. I'll just say that certain hands are profitable opens and are not profitable continues vs players with very tight ranges that play decently postflop where you wont realize anywhere near 100% of your preflop hot/cold equity, this isn't six years ago where players are 3betting and pot/calling all textures where you have massive implied odds. I am quite content with what my stats are when I look at certain filters in HEM. In before "but you have at least 33% equity and are getting 2:1 so you have to call no matter what."

What I said was specifically about OP who said he is an inexperienced PLO player and who is likely up against a player who has played a few million hands. Villain is 3betting in a spot where his range is such that it is going to crush OP on quite a lot of textures for stacks and OP will get little value on the boards he smashes besides low trips. I am assuming that OP will miss at least some value bets and bluff opportunities that would make this a somewhat clear call vs most players in a reg vs reg scenario. In practice vs OP Villains R is going to be near 100% if not > 100% some % of the time so yes when you factor in the average pot size postflop and hand vs range realized equities, OP is likely going to be losing more than the 3.5bb he opened for preflop by calling.

bombonca you literally play 21/11 preflop, please don't pretend like you are actually winning money at online poker in 2017, especially not at midstakes+. Great analysis though, you are a postflop virtuoso and contribute greatly to all strategy threads. The extra 40bb in preflop stacks is going to change preflop ranges a bit, it should shift villains 3betting range a bit more towards the playability side than raw equity side which is going to hurt your hand for at least a few extra %s points when the broadway card on this texture is offsuit and villain starts off betting.

I found it funny you advocate folding to a 3b with a hand that is clearly a +EV call for any reg besides you. Even though all the things you state are relevant and sound nice, you might some day realize that in PLO you shouldnt be folding to 3bets alot (I remember you folding somewhere 40-50% both oop and ip), especially in the great game of PLO.

You never once mention in your post that the hero is in position, which makes playing alot easier. Also how is someone new gonna learn how to play the game if he is folding these hands preflop?

In the hand, I would also just call flop, and giin on blank turns. Not gonna go trough every scenario.

bombonca, time to start your propbet

yeah i shoved for those same reasons...

but it also makes sense to me to just call the flop cb to protect my range/induce turn barrels...but i can only raise turn cb(or at least i think) on the cards you mentioned...so i just jamed flop

should i ever just call flop cb when playing this spot 100bbs effective, or always rip it?

yes, you should mix it up with just call a lot of the times. In same hand being 100 bbs deep , call is a good option as he jams more turns with lower stack/pot ratio and your hand is disguised as most would expect shove on flop with 2 pair+, so yeah call is good with intention to svove any non spade on turn.

Gay, i consider myself slightly above average player, not more. Every day i realise how much i really suck at the great game, so i never intended to make a skill prop bet, but gambling run good bet that anyone could do, i made myslef clear about that. I will come up with something soon.

Also, prolly better not to listen badger1 advice to just call because he has an actual plan on turn being deep and i dont think you do right now

SK, i dont win money in 2017, mostly because i play too much hu with toughest opponents. If i was playing only zoom 500, i am pretty sure i would be making money. Those stats would be slightly different now too, i think those are oldish.

Also, i am not a professional, have great job that pays for my gambling habit, i dont play to show profit over long term, i play to run up stacks in one or a few sessions..

Call OTF and giin blank turns. Giin OTF is not a mistake either. Simple.


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I wouldn't be surprised if it's correct to raise fold some percentage of your opening range preflop in both a game theory and exploitative sense, despite the long running point of "don't ever fold to 3bets in PLO" which stems from how good a price you get compared to your preflop equity, but in the context of continually tougher games & opponents it's probably important to challenge these ideas to eek out more edges in games that are slowly becoming tougher to get big edges in.

I also may not have any idea what I'm talking about, I don't play online anymore and only have to contend with significantly softer live games.

What do we consider a "blank" turn?

People saying call flop, are you then continuing only on 2-8 non-spade turns?

Thats almost half the deck..., there is also a big chance opponent checks any card from K-9 or spade, and then we probably most of the times check back and try to showdown on river. If he bets it depends on the sizing.

readless/hudless, vs a reg, what are we doing when we call flop and face a turn barrel on a non-spade card, higher then the 8?
...and how does a stack of 100bbs vs 140bbs change our turn continuing range?

thoughts?

I like raising here, we want to be able to commit on a lot of turns - I think villain will slow down a lot unimproved and river can be really awkward for us

are you answering my turn question or are you talking about the OP(flop)?

never mind...i see now you were talking about flop

turn question, anyone?

PF - I'm calling the 3 bet in position.

Flop - close between a call or raise. Fold not an option.

Turn - depends on the card and his bet sizing as your question lumped a lot of different cards together. Is he full potting? I'm going to feel a lot worse about an Ace or King of diamonds full pot bet than I am about half pot on a ten of clubs.

potting flop is good.

well played

call

Top gapped hand EP. With lowest card being 4. In ZOOM I can't muck this fast enough, not open.

I think it would be fun. Please analyze every scenario

I'd raise flop. Hand is tricky on high card / spade turn.