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Old 06-08-2015, 06:36 AM   #176
Zsipali
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Re: Massive bot ring on PokerStars and how to spot them

If it's true I quit poker.
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Old 06-08-2015, 06:40 AM   #177
freewilly12
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Re: Massive bot ring on PokerStars and how to spot them

Here is imo one of the most obvious bot currently playing zoom 50:



This one from zoom fits the bill too imo:




I'll try to find some more..

Last edited by freewilly12; 06-08-2015 at 06:56 AM.
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Old 06-08-2015, 07:08 AM   #178
Bull$hit Man
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Re: Massive bot ring on PokerStars and how to spot them

could you please post a screenshot for the top winners for zoom 200 this year joey?
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Old 06-08-2015, 07:25 AM   #179
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Re: Massive bot ring on PokerStars and how to spot them

NP guys! While we are talking Susaninn playing 4 tbls plo200 zoom!

Anyway agree with Zsipali. If its true maybe time to take some serious decisions..
I mean some of us lost 10+, 20k+ against these accounts and get 200$ back from Stars.
Plus the software is ready you can just change some parameters next time with new accounts... so sick.

*edit
emperor playing all reg tbls now from 100-200..
did stars get anything from you?
Main thing would be to freeze at least those accounts !

Last edited by naggeri; 06-08-2015 at 07:32 AM.
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Old 06-08-2015, 07:44 AM   #180
madsamot
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Re: Massive bot ring on PokerStars and how to spot them

Quote:
Originally Posted by ChicagoJoey View Post
I want to see these regular table bots play the 10/20 games against droon and lautie but I think it would probably be naive to think that isn't already taking place right now.

The bots would not have a chance imo. ^^

Does not FedorZaysev have a positive winrate over a high amount of hands at 5-10? Afaik no other account that are suspected as a bot/whatever plays that high. He also battles really tough regs HU, like d2themfi etc.
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Old 06-08-2015, 07:46 AM   #181
rubenrtv
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Re: Massive bot ring on PokerStars and how to spot them

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Originally Posted by madsamot View Post
The bots would not have a chance imo. ^^

Does not FedorZaysev have a positive winrate over a high amount of hands at 5-10? Afaik no other account that are suspected as a bot/whatever plays that high. He also battles really tough regs HU, like d2themfi etc.
that's a lot easier when you know for sure you'll print money at lower stakes
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Old 06-08-2015, 07:51 AM   #182
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Re: Massive bot ring on PokerStars and how to spot them

Quote:
Originally Posted by Schwein View Post

As for the card sharing I really dont know. That is just a hypothesis. From people that posted here TrollAcount has a really large DB. He provided me with some very valuable screenshots.

A large DB alone isnt worth anything. The only way to find out if they are card sharing is to create a DB with hands where there were always 2 or more of them at the same table. I dont know how to do it using HEM, I am sure its doable but requires some SQL coding skills.

Once you prepare such DB of hands you can check how much above EV they are and calculate the Sigma, if its above 4 then they are sharing without a doubt.
I have SQL coding skills but am not familiar with the structure of HEM or PT4 (I use PT4) databases. Will try and write something to extract hands where 2 or more of these accounts are at the same table at some point (couldn't work out how to do it immediately from the PT4 interface; if someone knows, let me know please).

Am aware holecard sharing is just a hypothesis but I think it's worth checking and doubt it's that hard to implement in bots, if all the info is being sent to a centralised server.

Last edited by shimmy; 06-08-2015 at 07:56 AM.
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Old 06-08-2015, 07:52 AM   #183
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Re: Massive bot ring on PokerStars and how to spot them

if all those guys are bots it would be insane...
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Old 06-08-2015, 07:57 AM   #184
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Re: Massive bot ring on PokerStars and how to spot them

do you guys think there is any chance that stars get closed like full tilt back then if that was true?
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Old 06-08-2015, 08:01 AM   #185
Dandan160808
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Re: Massive bot ring on PokerStars and how to spot them

Quote:
Originally Posted by Schwein View Post
The description of the bot ring can be found here, no need for me to write it all again. http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/sh...58&postcount=1

The stats can be found here http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/sh...25&postcount=5

I found 10+ more accounts. Posting only those that play on daily basis.






I strongly believe those arent fully automated. The playing schedule of the ones on zoom would suggest, that they are operated by humans working a 9 to 5 and 5 days a week job. (some sort of PLOSnowie?)



How to find bots using your own HEM database, a 3 step guide.

Step 1. Go to opponents tab, filter out for most hands played and sort by postflop Agg %. They should be sitting right next to each other like a big happy family. Anyone with postflop Agg% between 38.5 and 41.5 should be checked manually.



Step 2. Check all the other stats, if c/r flop is really high and equal to c/r turn and 3bet is equal to sqz (wtf?) they are a prime suspect.



Step 3. Ask someone with a Russian PTR account to check for final confirmation.

Thats more or less what I did. Thanks to Oink and Grethe and the guy that provided me with access to Russian PTR so I could dig up some dirt.



Bonus step. Go report to PokerStars.

Oh man! I play these guys about 3 days a week & fedor just does not lose that often. The usernames you have given seem to be online 24/7. Fedor having changed his avatar a few tiles and this sergeax guy the same in fact all those you mention I've had suspicions that something is not right with any of them. The same guys/bots insta sit in with full stacks as soon as I'm on a new table with two normal regs who I don't see 24/7.

These guys play me at PLO from $1/2 up to $2.50/5.00 on zoom PLO.

I refuse to play these guys anymore as I've won like 1 out of 20 6max PLO games when they all sit in. I could have the nuts all the way to the last river card and boom 1 outed or two outed with at times pre-flop re raising and all in against what they know I have xAAx and it's the same straight or flush or two pair that beat it or they have xKKx and of coarse they get a king on the flop or the river cards. These guys are deep stacked and fedor always disappears after winning 2 or 3 buy ins. Sergeax has large stacks of 2-5 buy ins per table he's on and these guys just never lose.

I would love pokerstars to investigate the OPS Claims for any kind of cheating as they are 24/7 players With incredible win rates.

Good luck at the felt all.
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Old 06-08-2015, 08:12 AM   #186
sauhund
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Re: Massive bot ring on PokerStars and how to spot them

i cant post?
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Old 06-08-2015, 08:13 AM   #187
Dandan160808
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Re: Massive bot ring on PokerStars and how to spot them

Yes please.
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Old 06-08-2015, 08:20 AM   #188
DaiLad
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Re: Massive bot ring on PokerStars and how to spot them

Realistically is there anything pokersites can do to prevent this?

Sad sad times seeing the winrates and amount of "bots" that are being undetected by stars which is suppose to have top tier security.
TY to everyone that contributed to this topic is been an eye opener for sure.
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Old 06-08-2015, 08:21 AM   #189
sauhund
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Re: Massive bot ring on PokerStars and how to spot them

seems to work now, was somehow deleted when i posted before, so hopefully i┤m not a suspect...
was just saying would be insane if this were true, and if someone thinks there is a chance stars might get shut down just like tilt back in the days...
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Old 06-08-2015, 08:30 AM   #190
potbet
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Re: Massive bot ring on PokerStars and how to spot them

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Originally Posted by ChicagoJoey View Post
this is ****ing just lol

can you filter without hu plz?

the winrates of some players there worry me a bit, too. more than 1$/hand on PLO200 seriously?
i do not want to derail though
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Old 06-08-2015, 08:41 AM   #191
naggeri
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Re: Massive bot ring on PokerStars and how to spot them

Hu are 5.9. For sure
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Old 06-08-2015, 08:59 AM   #192
Pastafiore
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Re: Massive bot ring on PokerStars and how to spot them

Quote:
Originally Posted by Schwein View Post
Updated distance chart as explained in post #123



First 12 columns are botter pairs, where RockfellaJ and BOOTTLEGGER are already banned.

Next 6 are legit accounts pairs, last column is alleged botter SuSaaNiN compared to legit grinder N@T@L@T.

Small distance means accounts are super similar, large distance means they are very different.

I will make this spreadsheet public on Google docs on Tuesday, as promised earlier.

for example watch N@T@L@Ts zoom/last few months stats instead of zoom and normal tables, he was palyin very different way at first when he appeard and i played lot HU with him too when he was new. samanta81 changed his game style verymuch also when he jumped to zoom tables from normal tables, lot of minbets and donkbets and stuff what he did not do in normal tables. IpusMyPrius was a huge nit long time when he came to pokerstars, and his style was veryvery differerent when got banned. there is still a human(s) behind this everything and knows his bots cant play exactly same way every hand, same thing as pros are balancing their ranges. same thing on MDU so can you filter his databise too or something?they both are still playing verybad and shouold not be playing as reg in 500zoom.
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Old 06-08-2015, 08:59 AM   #193
TouchOfEVil
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Re: Massive bot ring on PokerStars and how to spot them

Chatting is -zero- counterevidence. The botters that got busted on svenska spel have been to trial now. They ran 8+ accounts and won close to 7 figures in $ before being busted. They chatted with the opponents through their phones remotely. They built in key words to get highlighted from, like their handle "wp", "nh" etc so they could respond accordingly if needed. All this is in the open docs from court.
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Old 06-08-2015, 09:15 AM   #194
freewilly12
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Re: Massive bot ring on PokerStars and how to spot them

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pastafiore View Post
fIpusMyPrius was a huge nit long time when he came to pokerstars, and his style was veryvery differerent when got banned. there is still a human(s) behind this everything and knows his bots cant play exactly same way every hand, same thing as pros are balancing their ranges. same thing on MDU so can you filter his databise too or something?they both are still playing verybad and shouold not be playing as reg in 500zoom.
I noticed several suspicious account changed their playing style over night going from like 23vpip / 3% Bet to 30vpip/ 3% Bet around half year ago when I played. (And their super tight 3% 3B-range was balanced not only aces.)
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Old 06-08-2015, 09:35 AM   #195
MR.Donkey
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Re: Massive bot ring on PokerStars and how to spot them

99 % sure 4somniare,SuSaaNin and N@T@L@T are NOT a bots.

100% sure MDU is NOT a bot.
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Old 06-08-2015, 09:48 AM   #196
Pastafiore
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Re: Massive bot ring on PokerStars and how to spot them

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Originally Posted by freewilly12 View Post
I noticed several suspicious account changed their playing style over night going from like 23vpip / 3% Bet to 30vpip/ 3% Bet around half year ago when I played. (And their super tight 3% 3B-range was balanced not only aces.)
we talked about this first time over year ago because FEW REGS INC. ME HAVE NOTICED THAT OVER YEAR AGO they are not playing fair. i have played very close 2m vpps on PLO100-600 with those "bots" so dont you think i take my suspicions from the air. support did nothing when we reported them first time (we did report prius for example) and at late as now he is banned. here is my hud and isnt it a bit weird if their every stat are veryvery close each other on that and in pop ups also? any good regs does not have even close as similar stats as players that i mentioned. vpip and pfr could be pretty far of each other with some players but those are balanced on samekind of way with postflop stats ans stuff.

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Old 06-08-2015, 09:53 AM   #197
Pastafiore
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Re: Massive bot ring on PokerStars and how to spot them

and when their game styles changed, it happened few hours-in less than few days and style is still same.
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Old 06-08-2015, 10:02 AM   #198
freewilly12
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Re: Massive bot ring on PokerStars and how to spot them

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Originally Posted by Pastafiore View Post
i have played very close 2m vpps on PLO100-600 with those "bots" so dont you think i take my suspicions from the air.
Maybe you didn't understand that I am with you here.

I found it extremely suspicious that several nitty (pre-flop)balanced accounts go from playing vpip 23 to vpip 30 almost over night, simultaneously, keeping their balanced 3B range at 3%.

It seems there's a lot of bots using same strategy with different VPIP, and agression etc. but their ratios are matching and differ from legit regs..
(For example squeeze/3B ratio, BB agression ratio.)
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Old 06-08-2015, 10:32 AM   #199
Simonsayscall
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Re: Massive bot ring on PokerStars and how to spot them

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Originally Posted by Scar18 View Post
I wonder how long until pokerstars have to implement an esea (for those of you familiar with counter strike) style client? for those who arent its an anti-cheat software that runs constantly in the background and has access to every file on your computer.
Can we get this done asap? ^^^

Is this the type of thing we should petition for? If it actually works...

Personally, I have a laptop i use exclusively for poker, if you're worried about personal info, do the same, the only thing stars will discover is that they have a lot of competition from other sites
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Old 06-08-2015, 10:38 AM   #200
Simonsayscall
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Re: Massive bot ring on PokerStars and how to spot them

Quote:
Originally Posted by Herrigel View Post
I play tight PF and pretty much every winning Reg adjusts to this fact by 3-betting me less than normal.
But all these accounts did not adjust at all and their 3b vs hero stat is pretty much the same as their overall 3b number.
Guessing if the bots fail to adjust to styles of diff regs as well as position then comparing stats vs particularly tight regs could be a good way to find some more evidence.
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