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[Roy]

JJ9ss against 2 people I think is definitely a check-fold with those stack sizes.

[CompEng]

Originally Posted by Roy

JJ9ss against 2 people I think is definitely a check-fold with those stack sizes.

that's what i normally do too, but i re-did ivev's calcs and (to my surprise) got EV[b/c] ~= EV[c/f] = 0.

[gordo16]

so the consensus is that any time you cbet these flops it's with the intent of calling it off to a raise? what do people think of the whole 1/4 pot cbet/decide line on paired flops in 3b squeeze spots?

fwiw, I agree that it's generally a c/f on JJ9ss type flops, but can't help but think that the best 6max players absolutely abuse these types spots and I'm just having a hard time really narrowing down a good c/f, b/f, b/c range for Hero and b/f, b/c range for villains once we get to the flop in this manner.

[Doorbread]

No ofc not...we'll be bluffing sometimes. jj9ss is just a bad example because there will be a lot less leveling going on on this specific paired board and that's basically what it is...leveling. you don't nail 884 boards after you squeeze two people and will be bluffing this board frequently so good reg will bluff raise with a fair frequency. He's more likely to have an 8 than you and knows this, now we play a game of "feeling" that I certainly can't explain, but that and gameflow will be the deciding factors.

[gordo16]

Originally Posted by Doorbread

No ofc not...we'll be bluffing sometimes. jj9ss is just a bad example because there will be a lot less leveling going on on this specific paired board and that's basically what it is...leveling. you don't nail 884 boards after you squeeze two people and will be bluffing this board frequently so good reg will bluff raise with a fair frequency. He's more likely to have an 8 than you and knows this, now we play a game of "feeling" that I certainly can't explain, but that and gameflow will be the deciding factors.

I meant specifically when we are cbetting a KK/AAxx type hand. I was mostly just curious as to how often, if ever, people are bet/folding this spot.

[StreamlineR]

kind of a retarded spot, villain defends 50% doesnt 3bet, c/r 12% (not much). Am i ever ahead there ?

$2/$4 Pot Limit Omaha Hi
2 Players
Hand Conversion Powered by weaktight.com

Stacks:
Hero ($749)
BB ($419)

Pre-Flop: ($6, 2 players) Hero is BTN 2 7 8 8
Hero raises to $12, BB calls $8

Flop: 8 3 A ($24, 2 players)
BB checks, Hero bets $20, BB raises to $84, Hero calls $64

Turn: 10 ($192, 2 players)
BB checks, Hero bets $192, BB calls $192

River: 4 ($576, 2 players)
BB goes all-in $131, Hero folds

Final Pot: $707

BB wins $706 (net +$287)

Hero lost $288

[chinaski101]

Originally Posted by gordo16

so the consensus is that any time you cbet these flops it's with the intent of calling it off to a raise? what do people think of the whole 1/4 pot cbet/decide line on paired flops in 3b squeeze spots?

fwiw, I agree that it's generally a c/f on JJ9ss type flops, but can't help but think that the best 6max players absolutely abuse these types spots and I'm just having a hard time really narrowing down a good c/f, b/f, b/c range for Hero and b/f, b/c range for villains once we get to the flop in this manner.

i like betting small/calling or folding vs different people

[StreamlineR]

villain opens 86% and doesnt fold to 3bets, he 4bets AA only. seems like a pretty weak player

$2/$4 Pot Limit Omaha Hi
2 Players
Hand Conversion Powered by weaktight.com

Stacks:
BTN ($467)
Hero ($1,211)

Pre-Flop: ($6, 2 players) Hero is BB A 2 10 K
BTN raises to $12, Hero raises to $36, BTN calls $24

Flop: 8 2 7 ($72, 2 players)
Hero bets $54, BTN calls $54

Turn: 4 ($180, 2 players)
Hero ?,

[Zacharrrr]

Originally Posted by Zacharrrr

Villain here is A.Allemann on stars.

opinions?
Grabbed by Holdem Manager
PL Omaha $10(BB) Poker Stars
SB ($2,755)
BB ($1,194)
UTG ($1,412)
UTG+1 ($1,000)
Hero ($1,000)
BTN ($1,228)

Dealt to Hero T J 9 9

fold, fold, Hero raises to $20, fold, SB calls $15, fold

FLOP ($50) Q 9 T

SB bets $47.50, Hero calls $47.50

TURN ($145) Q 9 T T

SB bets $100, Hero calls $100

RIVER ($345) Q 9 T T J

SB bets $250, Hero calls $250

replies, plz

[CZI]

Played it fine Zacharrr. Can't raise, really. Expecting him to bet/call anything worse than a boat is optimistic, and the only boat you beat is T9 (1 combo), while losing to a total of 6 combos (3 QQ, 2 QT, 1 JJ). You probably gain a bit of FE by raising JT (1 combo) off a chop, but that's not gonna sway the decision imo. And if he's folding JT, he's def folding T9 so the effects are void.

Then again I think you're asking whether to call or fold rather than call or raise. Against smart/creative opponents, I'm not folding. He could very well be betting KJ/J8 trying to get you off a chop, or trying to prevent you from betting him off a chop, which you sometimes will if he checks to you. Don't count out the occasional brainfart.

[Roy]

i definitely think that it's closer to a fold than a raise.

it's pretty difficult for you *not* to have a boat when you call the turn, so i actually think folding might be best.

[Roy]

Originally Posted by StreamlineR

villain opens 86% and doesnt fold to 3bets, he 4bets AA only. seems like a pretty weak player

$2/$4 Pot Limit Omaha Hi
2 Players
Hand Conversion Powered by weaktight.com

Stacks:
BTN ($467)
Hero ($1,211)

Pre-Flop: ($6, 2 players) Hero is BB A 2 10 K
BTN raises to $12, Hero raises to $36, BTN calls $24

Flop: 8 2 7 ($72, 2 players)
Hero bets $54, BTN calls $54

Turn: 4 ($180, 2 players)
Hero ?,

$172

[MatthewRyan]

Is this profitable preflop vs 2 good players?

Poker Stars $1000.00 Pot Limit Omaha Hi - 5 players
2+2 Hand Converter Powered By DeucesCracked

Hero (SB): $1000.00
BB: $772.00
UTG: $2102.00
CO: $1686.00
BTN: $1373.00

Pre Flop: ($15.00) Hero is SB with K J 8 7
UTG raises to $30, CO raises to $105, 1 fold, Hero calls $100

[Ben86]

no i dont think so i fold everytime from the blinds the button might be ok

[Hoopster81]

no