New England Patriots: Longest Drought in Beantown

[Donkey OT]

I got an idea for a new title.

New England Patriots: AFC Champions

[Dynasty]

I like the current title. It's a reminder how well all Boston teams have done lately.

[BradysBunch12]

Originally Posted by Kneel B4 Zod

so it's silly to go and look at the draft success of BB in recent years and say he is infallible, beyond the point where anyone can question him. even he would admit he's been wrong a ton. could someone do a better job of college talent evaluation than him? sure, I don't see why not.

teams know that BB likes to stockpile draft picks, but IMO they're stupid for not having the same strategy. when you have 2X the amount of picks as some teams, its much easier to take a flier on a guy and if he doesn't work out, you cut him. likewise, if you hit on a 4th rounder or later (or 6th for TB) you look like a god.

1st round picks IMO should be expected to be starters and make the roster the first 5 years of their career at least (barring injury), and taking age into account they should be some of the most valuable players on the roster before playing a pro snap. continually trading down out of the first round can help lower expectations for players, but its mainly done because GM's don't have the same value on 2nd and 3rd rounders as BB does, and they continually overvalue late 1st round picks.

i'm in class so i'm not sure all this makes sense but i hope you get what i'm trying to say... BB values the later picks more than traditional GM's, and GM's overvalue the late first round picks. BB has proven he can find value late in the draft by stockpiling picks and taking chances on guys who weren't big names in college.

basically i'm fine with his draft strategies... he hits some, and he misses some

[Salva135]

Originally Posted by Kneel B4 Zod

finding an all time elite QB in the 6th round has covered up draft mistakes all over the place.

Ding ding ding, we have a winner! For the record I don't really hate BB's drafting in recent years, I just recognize all of the flaws that everyone else does. BB's coaching and Tom Brady's sheer awesomeness mask a huge amount of flaws this team has due to issues with drafting in areas of need and reliance on FAs who have failed to perform.

[Salva135]

Originally Posted by Goodie

Once again I guess I'm being misinterpreted. I agree completely with every single thing in this post.

Honestly I think I'm the one being misinterpreted. You interpret my criticisms of BB as evidence that I think I know better than him. I'm just a dude chatting on a message board. I don't claim such expertise in any way. But it's a Pats thread on a message board so I'm going to spout my opinion. Deal with it.

[Goodie]

Salva, you're last two posts are insanely contradictory. Like the absolute definition of contradiction.

First post - I'm going to point out that a team that has had more success than any other team in the last ten years has a huge amount of flaws and it's because BB is not very good at drafting. Hate to point it out but that CLEARLY states that you think you know better than him.

Second post - Dah dah dah, I'm just an internet guy, I don't know better than BB.

Make up your mind. Either you own that you think you know better than him or you don't. You can't have it both ways.

[Kneel B4 Zod]

Originally Posted by Goodie

First post - I'm going to point out that a team that has had more success than any other team in the last ten years has a huge amount of flaws and it's because BB is not very good at drafting. Hate to point it out but that CLEARLY states that you think you know better than him.

huh? how do you get that?

he can point out that BB is flawed at something without implying that he could do a better job at it.

I know Rajon Rondo is not a elite jump shooter but that doesn't mean I could do any better, I just know it's something he could improve on.

[Goodie]

Originally Posted by Kneel B4 Zod

huh? how do you get that?

he can point out that BB is flawed at something without implying that he could do a better job at it.

I know Rajon Rondo is not a elite jump shooter but that doesn't mean I could do any better, I just know it's something he could improve on.

There are a couple of reasons this doesn't work. First, you're not telling Rajon how he can get better, just that he's not very good at that skill. Second, not being an elite jump shooter is not really a choice whereas drafting is very clearly involved with choices.

When Salva says that BB should do certain things in the draft and that he's unhappy with the things he's done in the past it definitely makes it look like he thinks his decisions would be better (or someone else's decisions would be better). I disagree.

However, as I've said a million times, my main problem is that whatever BB has done (both personal wise and coaching wise) has worked. It's worked better than any other team in the NFL. So, I just don't understand how someone can complain. It's just so friggin ridiculous and spoiled.

[Kneel B4 Zod]

yes, I am telling Rondo that he would be better if we was a great jump shooter. and to an extent, sure it's a choice, practice more. I don't think he's ever going to be Ray Allen but he could get better

[Jbrochu]

Jeez KBZ you are spoiled and I don't understand it. After all, the Celts won the title with Rondo starting.

[Goodie]

Originally Posted by Kneel B4 Zod

yes, I am telling Rondo that he would be better if we was a great jump shooter. and to an extent, sure it's a choice, practice more. I don't think he's ever going to be Ray Allen but he could get better

Yeah, I mean, true enough. To me, the difference is that Rondo's shooting is an obvious flaw.

I'm not sure that BB's personnel decisions are an obvious flaw by any means. It like to see how he stacks up against other GM's in terms of hit/miss ratio of draft picks and free agent signings.

I don't know. Maybe I'm wrong. Maybe he does make more bad decisions than other GM's. I just get annoyed at spoiled fans.

[Toro]

Lol, goodie the good fan.

[Kneel B4 Zod]

Originally Posted by Goodie

Yeah, I mean, true enough. To me, the difference is that Rondo's shooting is an obvious flaw.

I'm not sure that BB's personnel decisions are an obvious flaw by any means. It like to see how he stacks up against other GM's in terms of hit/miss ratio of draft picks and free agent signings.

I don't know. Maybe I'm wrong. Maybe he does make more bad decisions than other GM's. I just get annoyed at spoiled fans.

I think the only frustration is that recently it seems there have been a lot more misses than their used to be. for a while BB was considered an elite drafter but there have been a bunch of misses with high picks recently, particularly on defense, which has people frustrated

otoh drafting is really hard so this type of thing can be expected from even great drafters

[BradysBunch12]

since we're discussing his strategy now, it's going to be very interesting to see how/what he does in 4 weeks.. then we can judge his decisions

[Goodie]

Originally Posted by Kneel B4 Zod

I think the only frustration is that recently it seems there have been a lot more misses than their used to be. for a while BB was considered an elite drafter but there have been a bunch of misses with high picks recently, particularly on defense, which has people frustrated

otoh drafting is really hard so this type of thing can be expected from even great drafters

The last line here is kinda how I feel. What huge misses with high picks have there been lately? Last year the only first round was Solder who I think had a very good rookie year. Ras I Dowling was hurt so I can't blame BB for him not contributing as a rook.

I don't think anyone would say that BB didn't do a brilliant job in 2010. There are three legit stars there and McCourty could be a star as well. Cunningham and Spikes have already made contributions and may also be stars in the future.

2009 wasn't great but we didn't have a first round pick and many of the 2nd rounders and even lower (endleman) have turned out well.

2008 Mayo was our first rounder. He's been a stud.

2007 wasn't great and 2006 was a disaster. We all agree on that.

Seems silly to go back much further but all drafts prior to that were very, very good.

I'd be interested in other perspectives though.