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Win and then lose theory

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09-19-2011 , 07:01 AM

GT-Four

enthusiast

Join Date: Aug 2011 Posts: 84

Hello.
If I win with 5$ to 1000$ and then lose all of them, how much money did I lose, 5$ or 1000$? and why?

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09-19-2011 , 07:30 AM

Chillypill

banned

Join Date: Aug 2009 Posts: 1,122

you lost 1000$ since you had 1000$secured ?

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09-19-2011 , 08:30 AM

Akhanar

grinder

Join Date: Apr 2011 Posts: 435

If you start on Monday with $5 then work all week at your mundane, soul-sucking job and get paid $$995 on Friday, then spend $1000 on hookers and blow on Saturday... How much money did you lose?

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09-19-2011 , 09:36 AM

RustyBrooks

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 24,647

Either $5 or $1000 is valid depending on your point of view. But the shorted the period, the less the point of view is valid.

In terms of poker I tend to think of the amount of money I have as winrate*handsplayed. So if experience indicates that I win 5bb/100 and I have played 1000 hands then to me I am up 50bb - if I actually have made 1000bb or lost 400bb it's not relevant - without trying to make it mystical or anything, the deviation from my expected win rate isn't "mine".

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09-19-2011 , 01:24 PM

ArtySmokes

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Aug 2011 Posts: 6,999

A win or a loss is a momentary occurrence that affects your overall balance.
A win rate takes into account a time period, which could be an hour, a week, or a lifetime etc.

If you won 1000 on day 1 and lost 1005 on day 2, your overall balance would be -$5 (a loss of five dollars), with a win rate (average) of -2.50 per day.

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09-20-2011 , 06:24 PM

Polsk23

grinder

Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 557

Quote:

Originally Posted by RustyBrooks

This

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09-21-2011 , 03:19 AM

acesholdup

old hand

Join Date: Oct 2009 Posts: 1,390

For tax purposes I think $5 is the better answer in most jurisdictions.

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09-21-2011 , 10:16 AM

NoLimitNinjaBri

adept

Join Date: Jun 2011 Posts: 1,159

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Originally Posted by acesholdup

For tax purposes I think $5 is the better answer in most jurisdictions.

Uhh, no. If we're able to deduct gambling losses, we want the larger figure.

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09-21-2011 , 02:51 PM

acesholdup

old hand

Join Date: Oct 2009 Posts: 1,390

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Originally Posted by NoLimitNinjaBri

Uhh, no. If we're able to deduct gambling losses, we want the larger figure.

Uh, no...even if you are able to deduct losses obviously you'd also have to add to wins in this situation (if not every person in the world would play a little low stakes lhe, or better yet something like baccarat, in their spare time and never pay a cent of taxes on anything). It's far better to be able to say you just didn't make any money as there are some spots where you have to add the wins but not deduct the losses (so there are some cases where the $5 answer is better, some where the $1000 answer is the same, and some where the $1000 answer is significantly worse if you aren't able to deduct the loss but have to count the win).

Last edited by acesholdup; 09-21-2011 at 02:59 PM.

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