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| Poker Theory General poker theory |
07-11-2012, 09:16 AM
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#1
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journeyman
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Fairview, New Jersey
Posts: 299
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Turning flush draws face up?
Just something ive been thinking about that i thought i might get some feedback on. I feel like if i raise an fdraw on the flop, and dont continue with a bet on the turn my hand is a bit face up. Of course, each situation is specific, but i am wondering in theory what people like to do. Free card? Barrel? For example, in order to mix up my fdraw strategies, sometimes i will just call or check a smaller f draw, and raise with nut fdraw, fdraw w overs or backdoor straight equity. Often, i feel like im playing too passive when i play for one raise and then check through to the river and give up when i miss, but feel a little spewy when i raise flop, turn and river and get called down when my opponent puts me on a busted draw which usually is pretty easy to sniff out. Any general thoughts here? Again, i know each situation is specific. Im looking to have a general discussion. If anyone wants to bring up specific examples of hands, board textures, in/out of position, villains, etc, feel free. Im thinking of new table with no reads, no image, and generic board textures like k93ss, both in and out of position.
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07-11-2012, 10:34 AM
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#2
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journeyman
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Greater Worcester, MA
Posts: 304
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Re: Turning flush draws face up?
You have to consider what you think your opponent is floating with.
Also, consider varying your semi-bluffing strategy. If you're out position, consider the delayed semi-bluff or checkraise semi-bluff.
Generally speaking, when I semi-bluff, I think about it that I'm trying to represent a made hand and I'm betting in order to protect it from the possible draw I'm concerned villain has. So unless I get a contrary read from the way villain calls, I'm going to at least double barrel when the turn misses me. And when the turn hits my draw, I always always check.
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07-11-2012, 11:37 AM
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#3
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grinder
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Spewing @ uNL.
Posts: 447
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Re: Turning flush draws face up?
As stated above, playing the draw at times as if you're attempting to protect a made hand can be effective. Then when the draw hits, slow down. If your line is standard it allows opponent to bluff in a very obvious bluff spot, allowing you to extract more value.
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07-12-2012, 02:22 AM
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#4
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adept
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: seat #7
Posts: 877
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Re: Turning flush draws face up?
Position makes a huge difference..
For example. If you're in early position and are the pre-flop leader and I call the bet and we see a flop, the flop comes XXX and has 2 clubs, you bet and I call again, the turn brings a X spade and now you check -as decribed by OP, the C-bet didn't really give you much info about my hand, but did give you enough info to know two things 1) you don't have a made hand and have maybe 10 or so outs and you're not crazy about putting more money in the pot because you have nothing, 2) you got a good idea I must have *something*, maybe just middle pair, because I called the first bet.
Anyway, you checked the flop to me, I might check back w/ middle pair, however if you bet into me again -remember I have position on you, 95% of the time I'm going to make a stiff raise that you probably can't call.
Back to a different senario, assuming you checked the turn and I checked the turn and the river brings a medium size offsuite card, not a club, and you check then obviously you're going to be facing a big bet from me, however if you make the big bet then I'm faced w/ having to call a large bet w/ only one pair, a small pair -second or third pair...many times a weaker or Nit type of player will fold, a thinking player who puts you on a [busted] flush draw might make the call, but certainly can't raise.
Bet sizing and reads/tells on your villain really make a difference.
I hope some of this makes sence to you and helps. I like to read about different hands but don't spend much time posting about them -keep that info to myself. ....so I'm not the best at explaining different situations when trying to type them out. Although I know what I mean, LOL, and have lots of expercine in live play under these exact circumstances.
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07-12-2012, 10:28 AM
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#5
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journeyman
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 346
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I have thought about this before as well, my thoughts were to use check raise more on turn. Made or not if im oop ill check it sometimes to induce a raise by opponent. Of course you have to consider the pot odds if you are checking the draw, but you will love this move if you hit the turn.
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