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"Full-bet" rule for NL hold em = need help understanding. "Full-bet" rule for NL hold em = need help understanding.

04-15-2017 , 06:42 PM
Going to post the hand and the convo with BOL support then we can discuss.

Hand History driven straight to this forum with DriveHUD Poker HUD & Database

NL Holdem $0.1(BB)
SB ($6.83)
HERO ($35.66)
UTG ($29.24)
HJ ($13.38)
CO ($18.73)
BTN ($10.5)

Dealt to Hero J J

UTG Folds, HJ Folds, CO Raises To $0.25 (Rem. Stack: 18.48), BTN Folds, SB Calls $0.2 (Rem. Stack: 6.58), HERO Raises To $1.3 (Rem. Stack: 34.26), CO Calls $1.15 (Rem. Stack: 17.33), SB Calls $1.15 (Rem. Stack: 5.43)

Flop ($4.20) 7 6 3
SB Checks, HERO Bets $2.85 (Rem. Stack: 31.41), CO Calls $2.85 (Rem. Stack: 14.48), SB $5.43 (allin) (Rem. Stack: 0.00), HERO Calls $2.58 (Rem. Stack: 28.83), CO Calls $2.58 (Rem. Stack: 11.90)

Turn ($20.49) 7 6 3 8
HERO Checks, CO $11.9 (allin) (Rem. Stack: 0.00), HERO Calls $11.9 (Rem. Stack: 16.93)

River ($44.29) 7 6 3 8 3

SB shows 8 7

CO shows Q Q

CO wins $43.29


Tim: Hello. I am disputing the results of a hand I just played on table #
Tim: the hand # is
David: Thank you one, moment.
Tim: When player B went all-in on the flop and the action was back on me I was only allowed to call or fold. I wanted to shove all-in but that action was not available.
David: I will be right with you...
Tim: Thank you.
David: I am not sure, it is showing me that you folded Pre-flop.
David: After Player B called $0.25.
Tim: I raised from the big blind to $1.40
Tim: Player A called, Player B called. on flop Player B checked, I bet, Player A called, Player B shoved all-in, and I was only left with the option to call or fold. I should have been allowed to raise all-in myself at that point.
David: If the "full bet" rule is in effect, as it usually is in No-Limit games, and the amount of an all-in is less than the minimum bet or the full amount of the previous raise, it's now a "real" raise and doesn't reopen the betting. If the "half bet" rule is in play if the amount is over half the minimum bet it is a raise and reopens the action.
Eg. Player 1 bets $50 into the pot and the player that acts next goes all in for $65.
As the extra $15 is not enough to constitute a "full raise" on Player 1's original bet, a third player can still raise instead of call as he has not yet had the option to raise.
Player 1 would then be able to call or raise the amount of Player 3's raise.
If the third player just calls, however, Player 1 can't re-raise as it would essentially be re-raising his own original bet. Player 1 can only call the extra $15 from both players and would contest an extra side pot of $30 with Player 3.
The main pot would have $50 from all three players in it for a total of $150.
David: We use "Full Bet"
Tim: Ok. His all-in was more than the minimum bet during that round.
David: And so the pot had to be matched, yes.
Tim: So his bet being MORE than the minimum bet SHOULD re open betting? Which it did, giving me the options to call or fold.
Tim: But why would "go all in" be removed as an action?
David: Thank you for waiting. I'll be with you in just a moment...
David: Because you already had the option to raise and also, the player's all-in was not enough on your raise. Meaning you would still be reraising your own bet.
Tim: Ok. I think I understand what you're saying.
Tim: I never encountered a situation where I could act but options were greyed out, unless all other players were all-in before me.
David: I have once or a few times.
David: Also never knew what going on.
Tim: Ok thank you for the explanation. take care


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If anyone can explain differently what exactly happened I would appreciate it. From what I gather Player B's shove was slightly less than 2x my bet size which only allowed me to call/fold but not make another bet. And "closed betting round" doesn't prevent calling/folding necessarily.
If I knew better I may have bet 2.20 into the 4.40 pot which would have met the "full bet" rule and 4b-shoved the flop; yet I should have actually bet larger in either case with the flop draws present. It's the weirdest hand I've ever played that's for sure.
"Full-bet" rule for NL hold em = need help understanding. Quote
04-15-2017 , 09:06 PM
Its basic rule almost everywhere.

Because the raise of the allin player is not enough to count as a reraise, you are only able to call/fold
.
It is a ****ty rule in some spots because you are forced to enter more money in a pot when you know that players behind you will also throw money in the pot, creating a tricky situation for you to respond to on the river. There for you should adjust your betting size if you think villain will shove his stack.

But IMO the bad play here is calling the allin after the CO has already called your bet. For me, him calling your bet with sb who called the preflop raise still to act, reeks of strenght. Pot odds wise folding here is never an option, but with the way everything went, its best to cut your losses there and move to the next hand.
"Full-bet" rule for NL hold em = need help understanding. Quote
04-15-2017 , 09:37 PM
You bet $2.85. A minimum raise would be to $5.70. SB only had $5.43. SB went all-in for $5.43 This is less than a minimum raise and, therefore, does not reopen the betting. Therefore, you cannot raise again.

Had you bet $2.71, a minimum raise would be to $5.42 and, therefore, if SB had then gone all-in for $5.43, it would have been a minimum raise (slightly more actually) and, therefore, would have reopened the betting and you would have been able to raise again.
"Full-bet" rule for NL hold em = need help understanding. Quote

      
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