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Call Any 2... if... Call Any 2... if...

06-15-2014 , 08:48 AM
Would it be correct to call any 2 cards from the BB to a min raise at a playable stack depth vs someone who opens close to 100% and cbets close to 100%? Heads up ofc.

The only depending factor I can see is if he barrels the turn and river a lot.

Last edited by DatDereCellech; 06-15-2014 at 08:58 AM.
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06-17-2014 , 03:22 PM
my guess is no. if he opens and cbets 100% of his range, and you call 100% of your range preflop...you will have to fold a lot on the flop since you'll be OOP facing an uncapped range the rest of the hand.

If you called something like 85% of the hands pre, you will at least be ahead of his range.

I dunno. I know this, you could def call a LOT. and yeah it would depend also on how he reacts to a xr on the flop...and I suppose how he reacts to a donkbet...then how he plays future streets...is he putting in too much money way behind, etc etc.
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06-18-2014 , 10:13 AM
Well, it seems to me that if someone would open and cbet close to 100%, we could earn a ton of money raising those cbets a lot
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06-19-2014 , 05:04 AM
Well the only reasonable way imo to address this question is to look at whether we can actually gain an advantage in this particular spot, rather than how profitable the call is in general since there is just too much missing information about the villain. Such as how he reacts to 3 bets, c/r on the flop, turn play, etc...

But imo It seems that we would have a pretty profitable spot on the flop against someone that is opening 100% and cbetting that entire range. His range would just be way too weak in that spot and I like our chances if we proceed correctly, even with too wide of a range ourselves.

As far as how to proceed, that would be an incredibly difficult question to answer and would be depend again on information not given in the original question
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06-19-2014 , 10:07 AM
i think if you take this more as an abstract theory question and not a strategy question...if he were to open and cbet 100%, it would prob be better if you had 80% range at this point so when you xr you are always ahead of his range. the 80% number would have to be altered based on his folding frequencies and to factor in being oop, and factor in the times you fold preflop. not sure the exact equations to use...but my intuition tells me I'd want to be at like 80% or maybe less calling range. I would give up some blinds and cbets and when we got into medium and large pots, I would have stronger ranges and hopefully make up my money there. It would also be altered based on how he cbet turns, rivers etc etc. and I would prob be adjusting in game as well as I could.

but if you have 100% of your range by the time he cbets flop and he has 100%, you will have the same exact range strength AND be oop in a pot that's already 10bb or so. So I don't think that's going to overcome saving the 1/2 bb.
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06-19-2014 , 12:33 PM
Is calling our only option? Is it a dominated strategy over others?
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06-20-2014 , 04:46 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by spacecakezzz
i think if you take this more as an abstract theory question and not a strategy question...if he were to open and cbet 100%, it would prob be better if you had 80% range at this point so when you xr you are always ahead of his range. the 80% number would have to be altered based on his folding frequencies and to factor in being oop, and factor in the times you fold preflop. not sure the exact equations to use...but my intuition tells me I'd want to be at like 80% or maybe less calling range. I would give up some blinds and cbets and when we got into medium and large pots, I would have stronger ranges and hopefully make up my money there. It would also be altered based on how he cbet turns, rivers etc etc. and I would prob be adjusting in game as well as I could.

but if you have 100% of your range by the time he cbets flop and he has 100%, you will have the same exact range strength AND be oop in a pot that's already 10bb or so. So I don't think that's going to overcome saving the 1/2 bb.
As far as the part where you mention that we will have the exact same range at the point where he cbets but will be oop, this does not mean that we are at a disadvantage. In fact this could be a huge advantage for us because although our ranges are the same, he has invested more money in the pot and we have the choice as to which hands we would like to call, c/r, etc... Its similar to saying that we have no advantage to a player pre-flop that is opening 100% of his buttons because our ranges are the same and we are oop.

I do agree with the fact that we would do better against him if we flatted less hands pre flop though.
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06-20-2014 , 05:10 PM
well when you both have the same exact range and you c/r or call, you are OOP in an already decent sized pot. I mean...if you check / call flop, you still have no idea really where you are at. I know you can estimate where you are at...but you won't know in that hand.

plus any time you fold the flop it is obv hugely +EV for him since you both have the exact same range.

I don't think calling any two is the optimal strategy unless there is something very major you can exploit. It's just going to be so easy to beat this player when you have a tighter range because once the flop bet goes in and you continue, you are going to be so far ahead of him it's going to be really difficult for him to be betting turns and rivers. you will realize a bunch more equity with your marginal and A high hands, etc..and obv you can tinker with c/r different streets or leading streets etc until you figure out what's working well.
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