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08-17-2009 , 09:52 PM
OK, I'm definitely going to get wrecked here, but I'm going to give it a try. It'll be a little slower to play than those games, but I'll hang around for a little while tonight.

1. e4

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08-18-2009 , 02:57 AM
2. d5 Nd7

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08-18-2009 , 06:59 PM
If anyone wants to help me out, I'd take it. Also, I'd be curious if I make any "obvious" mistakes that you feel you can point out after the fact, Tom.

I was thinking about a few things here; only Bb5 seemed like a clearly good move. (It might be terrible, it just seemed good to me -- the intuition about developing/opening lines is completely lost to me right now.)

2.Bb5 exd5 Nf3

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08-18-2009 , 07:36 PM
probably tom shouldnt read this

Spoiler:
as well as general principles "developing/opening lines" you should at least think "can my opponent mate me in 4"
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08-18-2009 , 07:39 PM
Hehe, yeah good point. I was actually thinking about that on my commute and planned on playing d4, but when I got to the computer, I forgot about this minor detail and wanted to prevent him from using his bishop to take my queen. Probably not the best of trade-offs...

If tom wants to grant me a brief reprieve, I'll go with 2.Bb5 d4 exd5


Last edited by Sholar; 08-18-2009 at 07:51 PM.
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08-18-2009 , 07:41 PM
4. e5 Bc5 Qh4 Qxf2++



Bb5 is a reasonable idea there, but obviously you have to dodge the mate. Normally the game is more about gobbling material, but the 3 so far here have been swarm attempts on the 3.

1. e4 if you want to play another.

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08-18-2009 , 08:08 PM
OK, I'll give it another shot.

2.d5 Nh6

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08-18-2009 , 08:31 PM
3. Qg4 Qxc8 Qxd8+

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08-18-2009 , 08:45 PM
4.Kxd8 Ng4 Nxf2 Nxh1



The advantage of this variant is: when you play poorly, the end comes quickly
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03-05-2011 , 03:42 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sholar
the end comes quickly
Spoiler:
or not
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03-05-2011 , 08:29 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by smilingbill
Spoiler:
or not
Heh, had completely forgotten about this.
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03-05-2011 , 08:35 PM
I can't see how white can mate here in 5 moves...or 6... or 7... but I can see with 8
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03-05-2011 , 08:41 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by jewbinson
I can't see how white can mate here in 5 moves...or 6... or 7... but I can see with 8
Mate if White has 7 consecutive moves exists. (I don't see anything faster than that.)
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03-05-2011 , 09:14 PM
I also only see mate in 7 (several different ways)
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03-06-2011 , 03:25 AM
I can see mate in 6. Does all of this mean White is in trouble since there will be so much material left for Black for his 6 moves? And maybe White should try to defend somehow then?

Last edited by smilingbill; 03-06-2011 at 03:26 AM. Reason: Oh wait, it's mate in 7 too
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03-06-2011 , 11:28 AM
smilingbill there is no matein6 right? I found about 1k different mate in 7's but im almost sure 6 can't be done
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03-06-2011 , 12:03 PM
smiilingbill retracted the mate in 6 claim (see his edit reason). I can see lots of mates in 7 as well, but no way to save a move. I'm terrible at solving composed chess problems, though, so who knows.

I actually don't know what the evaluation of the position in the game is (or what I thought at the time). Or whether "trying to defend" really makes sense in this variant -- other than opening enough space around one's king to give escape routes. (Black to play has a mate in 5, for example.)
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03-18-2011 , 02:46 PM
Yes, I spot the mate in 7 now
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07-07-2011 , 03:57 PM
I wish to resurrect this exciting thread, so bump. Looks like an epic variant.
As to the position discussed above: there are no mates for White in fewer than 7 moves as observed previously. Black, however, threatens
Spoiler:
Ng3 a5 Ra6 Rf6 Rxf1 mate
and
Spoiler:
Ng3 h5 Rh6 Rf6 Rxf1 mate.

So White's best choices here appear to be
Spoiler:
Ba6 Bxb7 Bxa8 d4 Nc3(?) to defend against the mates and retain material advantage
and
Spoiler:
g3 Bg2 Bxh1 a4 Nc3 to eliminate the knight altogether and mobilize the queenside.


Feel free to correct and discuss.
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07-07-2011 , 07:09 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Takemusu Aiki
So White's best choices here appear to be
Spoiler:
Ba6 Bxb7 Bxa8 d4 Nc3(?) to defend against the mates and retain material advantage


and g3 Bg2 Bxh1 a4 Nc3 to eliminate the knight altogether and mobilize the queenside.
Spoiler:

I think Black has a big advantage in both lines, though I can't prove a mate.

In the first case Black has 6. e5 ed dc cb baQ Qxc1+ when at first glance it looks like White is toast: he can't mate in 7 and needs four moves to capture the Black Queen (if he doesn't capture her, it is surely mate). BUT White can play 7. Ke2 Kf3 Ne2 Nxc1 h3! (or g4!) Bxd5 Bxf7 when Black can't queen any of his pawns and probably can't mate, so the game goes on. Is there anything else Black can try?

In the second line, 6. d4 dc cb baQ a5!? Qxc1+ looks even stronger. Again White can't get away without taking the Black queen, imo (e.g. 7. Ke2 c4 c5 c6 cb baQ Qxb8+ is met by 8. Kd7 f5 fe e3 ed d1Q mating with 2 moves to spare), and if he does take the Q with e.g. 7. Ke2 Ke3 Ne2 Nc1 e5 Bxb7 Bxa8, then Black can take enough of White's pawns to make sure none of them can promote: 8. h5 h4 hg gf f1Q Rh2 Qxd2+ and wins

Last edited by RoundTower; 07-07-2011 at 09:59 PM.
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07-07-2011 , 08:42 PM
Legit continuations for Black, ty.
Spoiler:
Yeah, allowing Black to capture all the way to the backrank and queen any pawn (a, c, d or g) is brutal in both variations. Looks like White has to play (b3, Nc3) right now AND defend against the rooks at the same time!
Maybe 5. b3 Nc3 d4 Be3 Be2 could hold the position momentarily.
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07-07-2011 , 10:18 PM
Spoiler:
Yeah, that looks like a better try. Black can still play something like 6. c5 c4 cb b2 Kd7 bxa1Q+ when I don't see a mate for White and the Q is still really hard to capture, so Black is probably still winning.

Starting with c5 is better than a5 imo because it stops White playing 7. Kd2 a4 a5 a6 a7 a8Q Qxa1, and gives more luft for the Black king.
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07-07-2011 , 11:19 PM
Not reading those spoilers as I am still holding out hope that TomCowley comes back and I can avenge my loss :-)
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07-10-2011 , 09:04 AM
I am the best player on the planet at this game play me if you want to lose.
I am wheres85 on xbox 360 get chessmaster live we can play online. I will crush anyone who plays me.
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07-10-2011 , 09:51 AM
Well now I don't want to play you. You've done too good a job of convincing me of your crush abilities.
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