*** Chess Low Content Thread ***

[Hackdeath]

ty, this is exactly what I need; a structured way to tackle the problem. I'm meh vs d6, I'm certain I make a lot of inaccuracies but I'm able to generate play which is what I'm aiming for. Over time, after gaining understanding over the positions, I'll make a better attempt at booking up, but right now the plan is just playing chess and only looking up theory only if the opening was dreadful (which it has been vs Nc6 and e6). I don't want to clutter up low content thread, I'll start an open sicilian thread tomorrow.

[Allen C]

Originally Posted by Hackdeath

I'll start an open sicilian thread tomorrow.

Yay. I'd like a better understanding of what to do with the e6 lines as well. Especially with playing Nc3 in front of Pc2.

[BobJoeJim]

In response to this post:

Originally Posted by checkmate36

checkmate3636 on chess.com (prob 1200ish)

If anyone would like to play lets get it going.

I offered our self-described "beginning player" a game. I assumed, with his ~1200 chess.com rating, that it would be a cakewalk and then I could give him some good pointers afterward. Instead, while I did win in the end (and computer analysis shows I missed a few nice tactical shots that I would never have seen in a million years), he pushed me for all I was worth. The only piece of advice I really feel justified in offering him is: "Don't drop your knight after playing so well."

That's not to say he didn't make plenty of mistakes (some of them major). It's just that I matched him mistake for mistake, so I figure he deserves advice from someone stronger than me. And while we're at it, I wouldn't mind some input on my poor play as well

Here is the game: http://www.chessvideos.tv/chess-game...r.php?id=49616

[checkmate36]

so I figure he deserves advice from someone stronger than me

Thanks for any info on this game.

I have studied the Scandinavian and thought this was my best chance at doing well as playing 1...e5 would be playing into whites hands as evident by his tourney win with the fried liver attack tourney on chess.com

Here are some of my thoughts on this game to help any discussion...

6.Bc4 was a welcome move as I planned on 6...b5.
9...Be7 to keep my pawn structure ok should white take on f6.
11...Nbd7 as pushing my c pawn to c5 is part of my plan.
13...Rac8 placing my rook behind the pawn I plan on pushing.
15...Qxd2 to remove my stronger opponents Q
16...Nxe5 17.Rxe5 is what my computer gives as a better move.
17...Nce4 was my plan to fork the Bg5 and Rd2
19.Rd7 caught me by surprise. (hoped for Rd8 )
20...Rb8 is huge mistake. I wanted to swap off rooks if possible so white doesn't get both rooks on my 2nd rank.
23...Bxd8 was played and I knew that my lack of endgame study will be my death in this game vs my stronger opponent.
25...Bf6 and I thought I picked up a pawn with a skewer tactic.
27...Ke7 drops my knight. Whites win will probably be child's play so I resigned.

[valenzuela]

Here is a game I played. http://www.chessvideos.tv/chess-game...r.php?id=49618

some comments.

11) I didnt know what to do so I did a6 to protect b5.
13&14) I thought moving my bishop back was going to give him control of the centre, I took with the pawn to move it to the centre and because I wanted to avoid Bf3 and he wins a tempo.

17) Planning to put the rook on 7th.

Feedback is going to be apreciated

[Ajezz]

Botvinnik Memorial is underway, a two-day rapid event with Anand, Carlsen, Kramnik and Aronian. I have just klicked through the games from day 1; only one decisive game but quite interesting. Aronian with a miracle save against Carlsen. Kramnik with yet another piece sacrifice, this time against Carlsen. He's probably sacrified more pieces these past few weeks than during the ten years before that.

[checkmate36]

Im black and this is a position from our game linked above. I was worried about tactics involving Bxe6 since the Bb3 and my king are on the same diagonal. It seems I was almost right as fritz gives Rxe6. During the game I couldn't see it so felt I was ok when in fact I was lucky BobJoeJim didn't see it as my Q would be removed from the game.

fritz suggests 14.Rxe6 fxe6 15.Rxe6 Kh8 16.Rook takes my Qd6. White wins a Q and 2 pawns for 2 rooks.

BobJoeJim were you also thinking about any (but came up with the same conclusion I did) of this while playing?

[checkmate36]

Originally Posted by KyleJRM82

There's just soooo much to the Ruy Lopez. You are talking about possibly the most theory heavy opening in chess (am I wrong on that? Someone will correct me).

Maybe start with the Exchange Variation, since that's more or less white's option.

I'm also looking to learn the Ruy Lopez but it seems so overwhelming so I never started. I will start with the exchange variation as mentioned. Thanks for the suggestion.

[HipHopRTR]

Originally Posted by checkmate36

I'm also looking to learn the Ruy Lopez but it seems so overwhelming so I never started. I will start with the exchange variation as mentioned. Thanks for the suggestion.

I don't think the Lopez is as theory heavy as many other major openings (Sicilian & Semi-Slav come to mind immediately) & a lot of the opening plans are common to many lines (such as white's Nd2-f1-g3[e3] & a4 to prevent/slow counterplay on the queenside), which is not always the case in some other theoretical lines.
Also the theory is reasonably static, in that it hasn't changed too much in the last 10+ years, whereas this cannot be said of many other openings.
A great book (or series of 2 books) I used to learn the Lopez is 'Opening Ideas & Analysis for Advanced Players' by Soltis.
Volume 1
Volume 2 (with Ruy Lopez)
Both are well worth a look if you can find them.

[Hackdeath]

Black to play.

Spoiler:

I played Nf3+ thinking that it would mate after gxf3 gxf3+ Ng3 hxg3 Bxg3 Qxg3+ hxg3 Rxg3+ Kf1 Rh1#. However white can play Rxc7+! after hxg3 which leads to mate, fortunately he didn't play this .

[BobJoeJim]

I was out of town for the weekend. Back now, will try to add some input on my game with checkmate.

Originally Posted by checkmate36

Thanks for any info on this game.

I have studied the Scandinavian and thought this was my best chance at doing well as playing 1...e5 would be playing into whites hands as evident by his tourney win with the fried liver attack tourney on chess.com

Not playing into the fried liver was probably wise, but not so much because I've specialized in it as just because it's an opening that can only be reached through a black blunder (followed by a white blunder). You probably would have been fine with whatever your normal response to e4 is (presuming your normal response to e4 isn't the Nxd5 variation of the two-knights defense. And if that *is* your normal response, you need to learn the 5. ... Na5 main lines ASAP). As for the Scandinavian, there's not necessarily anything wrong with it, but I generally wouldn't recommend it to beginners just because it REQUIRES you to violate one of the main principles of the opening (don't bring your queen out early). This means that playing the Scandinavian will give you less opportunity to learn "normal" middlegame positions, so it's not a great opening to use if you're trying to learn, in my opinion.

Here are some of my thoughts on this game to help any discussion...

6.Bc4 was a welcome move as I planned on 6...b5.

I wasn't sure where I wanted my bishop. I knew b5 was coming if I played Bc4, but decided I was okay with Bb3 to get my bishop on that diagonal. Probably it wasn't the best choice on my part though.

9...Be7 to keep my pawn structure ok should white take on f6.

And more importantly, to prepare castling. Right?

11...Nbd7 as pushing my c pawn to c5 is part of my plan.
13...Rac8 placing my rook behind the pawn I plan on pushing.
15...Qxd2 to remove my stronger opponents Q

The immediate tactical win was there (the d6 sac), but I didn't find it. Most 1200 players drop pieces left and right, but you did not, your tactical blunder was more subtle and I couldn't find it over the board. Under those circumstances, I was very pleased to trade down. I trusted I'd have an endgame edge on you. By all means, trade queens against a stronger opponent if you think the trade benefits you positionally, or if you think your opponents queen is stronger than your own. Don't just trade for the sake of simplifying, though. Simplification will generally favor the stronger player, not the weaker one.

16...Nxe5 17.Rxe5 is what my computer gives as a better move.
17...Nce4 was my plan to fork the Bg5 and Rd2

Was an annoying move. I thought I was lost for a while, before I found the Rd7 idea.

19.Rd7 caught me by surprise. (hoped for Rd8 )
20...Rb8 is huge mistake. I wanted to swap off rooks if possible so white doesn't get both rooks on my 2nd rank.

While I regret not finding the earlier sacrificial ideas on d6, I can also live with the fact that at this stage in my chess career those are beyond my level of tactical vision. Here, though, missing 22. Nc6 was just a mistake, I *should* see that move every time, and instead I let you back into the game temporarily.

23...Bxd8 was played and I knew that my lack of endgame study will be my death in this game vs my stronger opponent.

I felt pretty good about the position after Bxa4. I'm not winning theoretically, but I have a passed pawn now, and given the rating difference I figured I'd find some way to queen it easily enough.

25...Bf6 and I thought I picked up a pawn with a skewer tactic.

I also had Nc4, which the computer suggested may be stronger, although I didn't want to block the passed c-pawn myself...
[quote27...Ke7 drops my knight. Whites win will probably be child's play so I resigned.[/QUOTE]
Bc6 was a relatively cheap trick. Against a stronger player I probably focus on c-pawn plans, but I figured that if I took away the knights last possible escape square maybe you wouldn't notice and I'd be able to win it on the next move. That hope proved justified, but otherwise it would have been very interesting to see if my optimism for the endgame was justified.

Originally Posted by checkmate36

Im black and this is a position from our game linked above. I was worried about tactics involving Bxe6 since the Bb3 and my king are on the same diagonal. It seems I was almost right as fritz gives Rxe6. During the game I couldn't see it so felt I was ok when in fact I was lucky BobJoeJim didn't see it as my Q would be removed from the game.

fritz suggests 14.Rxe6 fxe6 15.Rxe6 Kh8 16.Rook takes my Qd6. White wins a Q and 2 pawns for 2 rooks.

BobJoeJim were you also thinking about any (but came up with the same conclusion I did) of this while playing?

I definitely was trying to work on the d6 spot, but it never really occurred to me that it might be so weak that I could actually sac material there. I was looking for a way to remove the c-pawn from the defense and win a pawn. Obviously looking back at it with a computer I found the same line you did, and realize I missed a chance to win a queen with a shiny rook sac. Oops

[checkmate36]

Thanks for the feedback on our game.

This means that playing the Scandinavian will give you less opportunity to learn "normal" middlegame positions, so it's not a great opening to use if you're trying to learn, in my opinion.

I have not really worked on any openings as of yet. My opening goals are just to get my pieces out and get my king to safety while not moving any piece twice before I have yet to move any piece for the first time. My current plans are to work on the Ruy Lopez for white probably starting with the exchange variation (so as to get motivated to study the endgame) and the Sicilian kan as black. This should get me learning the game I'm thinking.

6. Bd3 is a troubling line for black as discussed by Andrew Martin on his chessbase cd The Scandinavian the easy way. He said he was crushed by it.

9...Be7 was to allow 0-0 as well.

13...Rac8 and I did look at 14. Rxe6 but I couldn't see it. There is no way of seeing that at my current level but I was happy that computer analysis did show I was at least on the right path. I was wondering if you were looking at it as well?

Simplification will generally favor the stronger player, not the weaker one.

I will look to complicate the situation in the future.

Was an annoying move. I thought I was lost for a while, before I found the Rd7 idea.

I had hoped to give you a run for your money on this game so hearing this pleased me.

22.Nc6 was missed by me as well.

Bc6 was a relatively cheap trick.

It was the best I could come up with. I was happy I had learned about the skewer during my study and when I seen it on the board and thought I was the man.

This game/review process has been a big help and wanted to say thanks again.

[KyleJRM82]

Others may differ, but may I strongly recommend not playing the Sicilian as a beginner? Just respond to e4 with e5 and d4 with d5, and learn from there.

[Sholar]

Originally Posted by KyleJRM82

Others may differ, but may I strongly recommend not playing the Sicilian as a beginner? Just respond to e4 with e5 and d4 with d5, and learn from there.

I've heard this advice given by chess teachers who deal a lot with beginners. Their arguments have always seemed sound.

Also, I love the avatar. (Same people usually recommend 1.e4 for a lot of the reasons you've given here, for what it's worth.)

[KyleJRM82]

I started with d4, and after about six months switched to e4. I don't think it's a coincidence that the e4 period showed much more rapid improvement.