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Originally Posted by carlo
C'mon, effectively place the people of Poughkeepsie on the dole in order to abstractly feed the people of India and "Somalia ? This smacks of elitism but so long as the elite can eat in THE proper manner the rest can eat cake. LOL
Well, I am an elitist, so I don't mind sounding like one. Three points:
1) There is nothing abstract about the hundreds of millions of people that used to live in horrible poverty that now don't - in part due to trade and immigration. Those are real people who will die or live much worse lives if we slow down immigration.
2) Why are you assuming that open borders puts people on the dole? In fact, immigration generally leads to more jobs as it leads to more economic growth.
3) The implicit assumption here, that public policy should never harm any group of people, is a fantasy. There is no making economic policy without some people benefiting more and some less. The point is to try to do so in a way that is consistent with a greater aggregate benefit, and to distribute this benefit as fairly as possible.
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The idea that these business gurus are interested in the welfare of the people of Somalia or India is a joke and I'm surprised that you can make these statements with a straight face.
Bill Gates is the richest man in the US. He probably counts as a business guru. He has created the largest charitable foundation in the world, donated
$28B of his own money and pledged to donate 95% of his wealth to charity. The Gates Foundation has spent
billions of dollars combating malaria in Africa. It spent $50 million dollars on combating Ebola in Africa. In the last five years it's spent $265 million on water and sanitation, much of that in India.
Warren Buffett, the second richest man in the US. Also a business guru, he
has pledged to give away 99% of his wealth to charity - including primarily to the Gates Foundation.
Seems to me pretty reasonable to say that they care about the welfare of the people of Somalia or India.
Anyway,
I care about those people. My opinion here doesn't depend on the views of business leaders or whether or not they are all greedy scumbags. The great value of capitalism is that it is a system that doesn't depend on people not being greedy for it to work. A businesswoman who just wants to make a lot of money can built a great company that provides jobs and goods that people want while herself becoming wealthy.
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The corporate structure and capital is the problem but not in the Marxist sense. A statement which has been used by Marxists and related to Marx but said by others before him is a primary beginning. I'll state it frm memory but it stands tall against your GDP or TVA or Yankee doodle dandy, or whatever.
"The buying and selling of human labor as commodity is a primary economic and social evil".
I think the buying and selling of human labor as a commodity is one of the greatest inventions in history, leading to immense good for humanity. It is one of the foundations of the industrial revolution that has led to longer lives, higher living standards, and more freedom.
Also, if you don't know what GDP is, then you should find out.