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03-28-2011 , 04:11 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by gskowal
Yeah, I agree he did try to jump around from topic to topic so maybe it would have been better to stick to selected topics and pound on them , but at the same time Ray pretty much failed with all of his arguments and it was quite obvious to anyone watching or listening to the show, so I still think they did a pretty good job showing off how silly Ray's beliefs are.
I agree that they refuted all of his points quite well, but what I do not agree with is that it was evident to anybody watching or listening that the entirety of the arguments themselves had been defeated, because they were not. I think it is mostly only apparent to those viewers and listeners who already understand the argument that it has been refuted, but that because not every aspect of each argument was addressed, there is some bit of wiggle room left. There are still people like Jibninjas and NotReady who have demonstrated on this forum that they do not quite fully understand the standard apologetic arguments and because not every aspect of the argument was refuted they still have room to say, 'well wait a minute, what about this.'

Last edited by Deorum; 03-28-2011 at 04:20 PM. Reason: added quotation
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03-28-2011 , 04:19 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by skalf
I think a big part of why Ray looked better than he could have, was that Russell and Matt had clearly decided beforehand to be very civil.
That seems like a good choice; you cant really invite people on your show and just throw a tantrum at them,
but this approach also prevented them from pursuing things when continuing would have been rude.
I agree that this was part of it, but you can still have a civil conversation about one particular argument. Perhaps they decided that this was not the proper forum and that they wanted to cover a range of topics. It is probably good for Ray that Jeff Dee was not able to attend this week (he was initially supposed to be there rather than Russel, but had to cancel before he knew Ray was coming) because Jeff would not have let him slide from topic to topic before acknowledging that his previous statement had been refuted. Jeff is good at that.

Quote:
Backing Comfort into a corner should actually be very easy. He only has one major argument:
The Bible is the word of God because the Bible say the Bible is the word of God.
If you will only eat that one bit of circular reasoning, he is good to go.
Debating anything else lets him build his arguments from the Bible, which should not be taken seriously, until he has demonstrated that the Bible is to be taken seriously
I do not quite think this is true because they specifically asked him if somebody who had not experienced God would be justified in not believing and his answer was no. He uses a lot of the standard apologetics which are not contingent upon a bible for the existence of a deity.
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03-28-2011 , 04:23 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Deorum
I agree that they refuted all of his points quite well, but what I do not agree with is that it was evident to anybody watching or listening that the entirety of the arguments themselves had been defeated, because they were not. I think it is mostly only apparent to those viewers and listeners who already understand the argument that it has been refuted, but that because not every aspect of each argument was addressed, there is some bit of wiggle room left. There are still people like Jibninjas and NotReady who have demonstrated on this forum that they do not quite fully understand the standard apologetic arguments and because not every aspect of the argument was refuted they still have room to say, 'well wait a minute, what about this.'
haha, i get you.. yeah not everyone watching it would see every argument being debunked... I do hope that at least some of them were obvious to them.
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03-28-2011 , 04:25 PM
If all those problems could have been handled in one 59 minute interview, this forum could have been closed down long ago.
People are always going to hear what they want to hear, I think Matt and Russell did a fine job.
That said I would have liked for them to have focused more on how Comfort came to the conclusion, that the Bible is the voice of the one true God.
He is a one trick pony, so focus on deflating his one trick.
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03-28-2011 , 04:26 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Deorum
He uses a lot of the standard apologetics.
haha, yeah but he is pretty poor at it... Seems like he even has a poor understanding of those arguments..
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03-28-2011 , 04:41 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by skalf
If all those problems could have been handled in one 59 minute interview, this forum could have been closed down long ago.
People are always going to hear what they want to hear, I think Matt and Russell did a fine job.
That said I would have liked for them to have focused more on how Comfort came to the conclusion, that the Bible is the voice of the one true God.
He is a one trick pony, so focus on deflating his one trick.
I do not think it would be terribly difficult to shoot down every aspect of, say, the anthropic argument in about an hour's time.
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03-29-2011 , 02:01 PM
[B]"...If indeed there is in Christ Jesus "neither male nor female," but in all touching his kingdom "they are one", who shall dare thrust woman out of the Church's operations, or presume to put my candle which God has lighted, under a bushel?" - Catherine Booth, Co-founder of the Salvation Army

Could this be one of Satan's greatest deceptions? Trying to silence and minimize half of God's followers by elevating the letter of the Word over the Spirit of the Word? It seems possible to me that the devil has been running a doctrinal war on women for a couple of millenia to make them less effective than they would be normally.

This site has a very interesting link to Jocelyn Andersen's video where she explains that the Women's Rights Movement and the Abolition of Slavery were parallel movements that originated with Quaker women and carried on by religious people like Harriet Tubman and Martin Luther King, Jr.

Equality for Christian Women:
http://hungryheartsministries.com/id8.html

I guess we owe another of Satan's deceptions to people's tendency to be more literal than spiritual in their readings because the way you read or interpret the bible affects your actions. It must be one of the hazards we (religious people) perpetually run when we refuse to consciously shed our more carnal natures. There is no one who understands how to upset human nature better than the Adversary.

Last edited by Splendour; 03-29-2011 at 02:08 PM.
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03-29-2011 , 02:37 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Deorum
I do not think it would be terribly difficult to shoot down every aspect of, say, the anthropic argument in about an hour's time.
I agree, that could be done. My point was, that Comfort does not seem particularly invested in the standard apologetic arguments.
He simply keeps demanding, that the atheist must accept the Bible as the word of God. In that regard he debates a lot like Pletho.
So rather than have him defend an argument he does not care about, and barely understands the basics off,
I would prefer to try and get some reason out of him, for why we should accept the Bible as the word of God.
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04-02-2011 , 11:45 PM
Living with Relativism - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ae-jz5usFAk

Not really religious but kind of interesting if you're a philosophical donkey such as myself. Sam Harris wants to debate him.

Quote:
Philosopher Jesse Prinz, distinguished professor of philosophy at the Graduate Center of the City University of New York discusses "Living with Relativism: Can We Find a Common Good in a Morally Diverse World?" as part of the Jepson Leadership Forum on The Common Good. He examines the nature of the concept of good and argues that it cannot be expressed simply as a set of objective standards or a projection of individual preferences, but rather exists as a combination of the two.
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04-04-2011 , 12:46 AM
like Evid3nc3, good storyteller, but more emotional

Deconversion: Jesus & Young People - Part 3
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04-06-2011 , 02:02 AM
Nothing majorly interesting, but it almost brought a tear of joy to my eye. -lol

What a charming, intelligent, and independent young woman! Makes me think there's still hope yet.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zXpAS...&feature=feedu
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04-22-2011 , 08:50 AM
Friday Night Cranks prank calls Shirley Phelps from the infamous Westboro Baptist Church:

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04-22-2011 , 02:08 PM
I haven't watched this entire video yet, but it's PZ Myers speaking about the incompatibility of science and religion:

Quote:
Science and religion are incompatible in the same sense that the serious pursuit of knowledge of reality is incompatible with bull****. -- PZ
PZ Myers - Global Atheist Convention 2010

Last edited by Jibninjas; 04-23-2011 at 07:58 PM. Reason: fixed link
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04-28-2011 , 04:14 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Username^^
Excellent documentary about a guy posing as a faith healer to expose many of the standard tricks in the all too commonly believed scam of faith healing.
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04-30-2011 , 12:33 AM
I liked that. Nathan a.k.a. Pastor James was an excellent person for the job.
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04-30-2011 , 01:03 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by always_sunni_
I liked that. Nathan a.k.a. Pastor James was an excellent person for the job.
I liked it too, but I wouldn't say he was ideal (even putting aside his temper problems). He had some definite strengths though.

Thanks for the share.
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05-03-2011 , 10:51 AM
Discovering Religion: Ep 20 - Secular vs. Biblical Morality

http://youtu.be/RqwAVimMO4w

this is one great video..
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05-05-2011 , 02:51 AM
this seems like a good debate, err discussion, although i only watched some of it

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kvcUjPQi4Tk

Last edited by vixticator; 05-05-2011 at 02:59 AM.
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05-05-2011 , 01:44 PM
Sam Harris and Richard Dawkins discuss
Who Says Science has Nothing to Say About Morality?
University of Oxford
April 12th 2011

http://youtu.be/Mm2Jrr0tRXk
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05-05-2011 , 10:33 PM
A small burb made by an ex Muslim atheist

http://www.youtube.com/user/CEMBadmi.../0/u9LPwA7FRZ4
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05-06-2011 , 03:05 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Huehuecoyotl
A small burb made by an ex Muslim atheist

http://www.youtube.com/user/CEMBadmi.../0/u9LPwA7FRZ4
Pretty good although I suspect there are exactly no persons who ever lived that stumbled upon their worldview by way of reason alone. Everything is rationalization. You got some reason sprinkled in here and there but we're driven by emotions, fundamentally. Nobody is immune. That's something I've been thinking lately.

Spoiler:
I derived this by reason alone
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05-07-2011 , 08:06 PM
Carl Sagan - A Reassuring Fable

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gCfem...el_video_title
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05-12-2011 , 12:23 AM
came out a few weeks ago, may have already been posted, but I really liked this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9IgOV...&feature=feedu


actually wasn't sure if it belonged here or in politics
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05-13-2011 , 10:08 AM
Bibleman, a search didn't turn him up. Ladies and gentlemen, I give you Jesus's Robin:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kjXWHyNENQQ
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