You might want to consider Sigmund Freud before arguing further.

Freud was both right and wrong. He was the starting point of psychology and he started and based a lot of his research and conclusions on his own imperfect life (he was born into an abusive home) and personal assumptions.

Sex research is a lot like Freud's.

Do you think Freud may have left out some variable or over conflated a few based on his own theories? I do.

Imo God's the only one who knows all the variables and can weigh them accurately.

Look at Freud's theory on penis envy. Crazy, huh?

Have you ever met a woman who expressed or suffered from penis envy? I never have. It most probably is a figment of Freud's lively imagination.

Anyone can research this area just like any other. Until you can demonstrate why they are wrong, bringing up perceived biases is a lazy deflection. Again, what psychology has to say on the subject is irrelevant. Individuals determine their own identity.

No, it's not.

It's a realistic reflection. You can read up on Kinsey's personal activities and how they spilled over and commingled into his research making his studies impure.

He certainly didn't remain detached when researching. They even made a movie showing him suborning his students into his questionable activities.

And individuals can self determine into an evil identity. There are plenty of examples of it.

Unless you want to argue evil doesn't exist in which case atheists have no evil to protest about but the argument for the existence of evil is the one a lot of atheists find most persuasive.

But let's stop arguing our biases. By your avatar name that you've identified under I can already tell you might be suborned into thinking degeneracy is a desirable condition.

Lots of intellectuals are guilty of falling under the sway of degeneracy. It's kind of hard to escape the innate dominance the flesh nature wants to exert over the individual without a lot of help and guidance. That's probably why God instituted circumcision among the ancient Hebrews. To tell them that their big heads atop of their shoulders should be in charge of making decisions their little heads between their legs weren't capable of.

When your big head gets suborned by your little head then you refer to the law and identify with God's higher morals and it will keep you out of trouble and able to maintain your relationships through personal integrity.

God should of known the little head has no decision making capability and cut up the part of the brain that sexual desire comes form. Or he as an omnipotent being could of just made us the way he wanted to in the first place...

You're just whining about your own failures.

Everyone personally controls who and what they will give the most attention to. Doesn't the amount of attention and perseverance determine success in this world?

Why should God deny himself relationships with successful people because some people won't listen to Him?

Are you going to give up your family and stop helping them be successful because the family down the street is dysfunctional?

Of course not. So why are you expecting God to?

Own your own choices. Take responsibility for yourself. Man up.

You never answer others questions (because you think they are trying to control you) and you think im going to answer yours? really?

Ya..

God's children are everyone.

One sec, is this not entirely capitulating to my view? You said earlier the gay community was defined by actions not attractions. Then you relaxed the word "defined". Then you seemed to agree that individuals within the gay community identified themselves based on attractions not actions, but still somehow the larger community must be exactly the opposite. And now you seem to be agreeing with me that it is the DESIRE that is at the foundation. Great. Perhaps it is the word "modern"...I thought it was obvious we were talking about today if you want to say some gay community in history passed defined itself differently than today then great but please make that explicit.

And no, sexual orientation is the correct (and very much standard word) here. I said earlier I didn't like the word "attraction" and certainly not the unorthodox "same sex attraction" of the OP. Note that one can have a sexual orientation but that their sexual identity, which can include behaviour, in not the same as their orientation such as in the OP.

As for this big difference between gay people and straight people, I don't see it. When people say "I am straight" they mean about the same thing that most people who say "i am gay/bi/asexual" mean. Namely, that their sexual orientation, or basic attractions, are to people of the same/opposite/both/neither sexes. Just as a matter of description it is a vastly better metric to use anyways because it doesn't worry about all the counterexamples of people who have a sexual orientation but don't act on it for any number of reasons as listed earlier in this thread. For instance, a teenager would certainly know that they like girls/boys, but may never have had sex with one. Even people who didn't "come through" the sexual revolution, such as far right religious conservatives, even they, as far as I know, consider their sexual orientation to be a deeply held and more fundamental aspect than merely who they have sex with. For instnace, they may choose to wait till marriage, but are well known to desire women before that. Note that this is yet another example where whenever people try to give examples of how gay people and straight people are different, it is almost always wrong.

Lol...get over it.

I'm like Dear Abby on here. I like passing out advice based on the real things in life not the imagined or hypothetical ones. I'm a natural born mommy personality so I treat most people on here like they are my kids and I give them that dose of truth whether they like it or not. A lot of people run from the truth you know. I once saw this fat black lady get up and run out of church protesting aloud at the topic when the speaker was talking about gluttony. People always take the bible's truth personally and God meant them to but how you react to it will make or break you.

Do you think I'm going to let "the kids" run over me?

I'm not. The kids no matter how precocious they are don't have the life experience or knowledge to force me into co-operating with them.

I'd probably be more reasonable in real life conversations but I don't have that much personal history or body language and expressions to assess people's sincerity and truthfulness on here and since the locale is a poker forum I'm not really expecting much in the way of honesty since truthfulness for poker players is an occupational hazard.

I'm not particularly concerned about Kinsey. There's been tons of legitimate research done since his time. Of course people can choose evil, what does that have to do with anything. Homosexuality is not evil and isn't classified as evil by anyone other than who believe the Bible tells them it is. The only evil ones are those who humiliate, bully and abuse those who are gay, beat them, kill them or drive them to suicide.

My name could also be a joke and I could be a responsible, well-educated adult who is also a profitable poker player. Everything else you wrote is irrelevant. We have laws designed to guarantee equality under the law, a system far superior to the Old Testament law people used to justify their hatred of homosexuality.

I would stop right here if I were you.

Unless you've done an incredibly thorough historical/contextual research on OT bible passages and have the necessary multidisciplinary knowledge in human anatomy, psychology, theology and sociology (and possibly some other ology that mankind hasn't even developed yet) to know everything God does then you probably don't even know what it took for God to get the human race from point A to point B.

And please stop posting to me on this. I despise arguing on SSM topics because I'm aware that: 1) Nobody on here beside the theists really want to hear God's side of things and 2) Nobody on here has the requisite knowledge. Opinions are like a**holes. Everyone's got one. It doesn't mean the opinion is backed by the requisite knowledge. A lot of sexual research is flawed. Also people don't listen to the research before acting. Even if they did listen to the research there could be a fundamental flaw in the research in the fact that the research failed to be based on multiple generational studies. We really don't know how much damage the impressions from limited studies on human sexuality have caused. In the bible it says sin can pass to the 3 or 4th generation. It's very unclear today if that is still true or not since most people don't even think to investigate it. But people learn from other people. People are raised transgenerationally, aren't they? Are your parents the same generation as you. Don't all teens act like they own the world until they're about 25 or 30 and start to say "You know Mom and Dad were right."

So studies....they spook me. I just don't like to grant all power to the scientists. They might not have looked into things long term enough.

I already know Kinsey did his best to de-program a bunch of people and lead the sexual revolution before we had the brain science results. Google Helen Fisher on the human brain in love some time. The way society approachs love and sex don't really match up with what actually occurs in the human brain...How many people thought to check that before Margaret Mead and Alfred Kinsey released their biased studies?

Basically Splendour, you agree with studies if you like what they say and disagree with them if you don't. You require evidence to believe in things you don't like and require no evidence to believe in things you do like.

So the question is: why do you like hating gays?

Please note I won't be reading your reply, as people can suffer from bias when they respond to my posts. I read it in a study.

Did you read this whole thread or are you posting to entertain yourself?

I agreed with LaVey for a couple of years then found out that his studies weren't so concrete.

I agreed with the evidence until other evidence refuted it.

And my opinion is that the evidence isn't all in on human sexuality but that doesn't stop the incomplete evidence from hitting the mainstream and affecting public opinion and human behavior.

And if you don't like my conclusion: too bad.

I bet I've been a ton more thorough in investigating this topic than you have and that is all that is required of anybody.

In seeking truth you better be thorough. Because you know what ...every a**hole has an opinion but not every opinion is backed by observation or evidence. Some people crack and hold opinions from peer pressure or other hidden motives they might have.

tl;dr, assume it was something about god.

(x) ignore