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Journal BIO-Complexity: Embryo development cannot arise by neo-Darwinism mechanisms Journal BIO-Complexity: Embryo development cannot arise by neo-Darwinism mechanisms

06-05-2014 , 12:46 PM
Peer-Reviewed Paper: Development Needs Ontogenetic Information that Cannot Arise from Neo-Darwinian Mechanisms

http://bio-complexity.org/ojs/index....e/BIO-C.2014.2

Jonathan Wells has published a new peer-reviewed scientific paper in the journal BIO-Complexity, "Membrane Patterns Carry Ontogenetic Information That Is Specified Independently of DNA." With over 400 citations to the technical literature, this well-researched and well-documented article shows that embryogenesis depends on crucial sources of information that exist outside of the DNA.

This ontogenetic information guides the development of an organism, but because it is derived from sources outside of the DNA, it cannot be produced by mutations in DNA. Wells concludes that because the neo-Darwinian model of evolution claims that variation is produced by DNA mutations, neo-Darwinism cannot account for the origin of epigenetic and ontogenetic information that exists outside of DNA.

As Wells observes, many biologists going back decades have accepted the "central dogma" of molecular biology -- without qualification -- which claims genes encoded by DNA entirely determine an organism. This view essentially says "DNA makes RNA makes protein makes us." He writes:

The emphasis on genetic programs owes much to evolutionary theory -- specifically, to the modern synthesis of Darwinian evolution and Mendelian genetics. According to the modern synthesis, new heritable variations originate in genetic mutations. In a 1970 interview, Monod said that with the establishment of the central dogma, "and the understanding of the random physical basis of mutation that molecular biology has also provided, the mechanism of Darwinism is at last securely founded".
No one doubts that DNA encodes RNA, and RNA is translated to make proteins, but it's a lot more complicated than just that. Many other sources of information enter the process along the way that may not stem directly from information encoded in DNA. The idea that the central dogma is incomplete is really not controversial these days, with so much research showing how epigenetic mechanisms are vital for biological function. However, many still think that at base, all the information you need to build an organism is in the DNA. Is that true?
For example, Wells finds that some of the basic axes of organismal development are in place before the initiation of developmental gene regulatory networks (dGRNs), some of the earliest expressions of genes during development: "Spatial anisotropies precede -- and are causally upstream of -- the embryo's dGRNs." Again, it's not that genes aren't important and crucial for organismal development. Rather, Wells argues that they can't be everything:

Embryo development (ontogeny) depends on developmental gene regulatory networks (dGRNs), but dGRNs depend on preexisting spatial anisotropies that are defined by early embryonic axes, and those axes are established long before the embryo's dGRNs are put in place.
He goes on to identify crucial sources of ontogenetic information that exists outside the DNA. Specifically, information can be stored in biological membranes that is crucial for the development of an organism -- also called ontogeny:
So biological membranes are patterned in complex ways. Those patterns serve important functions in cells, tissues and embryos. The following sections summarize the roles of plasma membrane patterns in (a) providing targets and sources for intracellular transport and signaling, (b) regulating cell-cell interactions by means of a "sugar code," and (c) generating endogenous electric fields that provide three-dimensional coordinate systems for ontogeny.
Let's look at these sources of information, briefly.
Intracellular Targets and Signaling

The locations of mRNAs is important in many cells during development for expressing genes in certain locations of cells, and for determining the cells' spatial axes. So how do mRNAs end up in the right location? Wells explains that cells use a "zip code" system to help direct molecules to the proper locations:

The localization of mRNAs commonly depends on specific sequences in their untranslated regions that have been called "zip codes". Like postal zip codes, such sequences identify the "addresses" in the cell to which the mRNAs are to be sent. Like a postal zip code, however, an mRNA zip code is meaningless unless it matches a pre-existing address -- that is, a target.
Evidence from a variety of cells suggests that mRNA localization requires the binding of a protein to the zip code to form a ribonucleoprotein particle (RNP); the combination is then transported to its destination.

However, Wells recognizes that the destinations for these "zip codes" are not encoded by the DNA:
Like zip codes themselves, however, zip code-binding proteins do not specify the destination. Using the postal code metaphor, zip code-binding proteins could be likened to cargo containers, cytoskeletal motor molecules to delivery trucks, and the cytoskeleton to the highway system on which the trucks travel. But destinations for intracellular transport -- like the geographical addresses in a postal delivery system -- must also be specified.
In some cases, destinations might be specified by the spatial arrangement of microtubules; in the postal metaphor, packages could be dispatched on a particular highway and then carried to the end of the road and simply dropped off. In some cases, however, destinations are known to be specified by targets in the form of membrane-bound proteins that respond to extracellular cues.

In other words, for the "zip codes" to function properly, there must be destinations, but those destinations are specified outside of the DNA.
The Sugar Code

Another non-DNA form of information Wells identifies is the "sugar code," determined by complex patterns of sugar molecules, called glycans, on membrane surfaces. These molecules can carry high amounts of information since "carbohydrates can form branching chains that are far more elaborate than linear chains of nucleotides and amino acids." Wells explains:

While the four nucleotides in the genome can form a maximum of 46 ≈ 4 x 103 hexanucleotides, and the twenty amino acids in the proteome can form a maximum of 206 ≈ 6 x 107 hexapeptides, the dozen or so monosaccharides in the "glycome" can theoretically form more than 1012 hexasaccharides. Clearly, the information-carrying capacity of the "glycome" far exceeds the combined capacities of the genome and the proteome. The information carried by the glycome has been called the "glycocode" or "sugar code".
[...]

The sugar code can be "interpreted" by proteins called lectins. Unlike antibodies, lectins are not produced by the immune system, and unlike enzymes they do not catalyze biochemical reactions, but like antibodies and enzymes they "recognize" specific three-dimensional structures of other molecules. They do this by means of "carbohydrate recognition domains".

So what can the sugar code do exactly?
Studies using monoclonal antibodies have shown that cell-surface glycans in early mouse embryos change in a highly ordered and stage-specific manner; the data suggest that they mediate cellular orientation, migration, and responses to regulatory factors during development.
Wells explains that "These patterns play important roles in development." But of course, these patterns are determined by arrangements of complex sugars, and are not encoded by information in DNA.
Endogenous Electric Fields

This next source of extra-genetic information -- electric fields in embryos -- might at first blush sound a bit weird, but it is well established in the peer-reviewed literature and in the field of developmental biology. Wells explains:

It has long been known that probably all living cells (not just nerve and muscle cells) generate electric fields across their membranes. In animal cells, a sodium-potassium pump in the membrane utilizes energy from ATP to move three sodium ions out of the cell while taking in two potassium ions. This raises the intracellular concentration of potassium ions, which corrects the imbalance by flowing out of the cell through ion-selective channels in the membrane. The combined action of sodium-potassium pumps and potassium "leak" channels makes the interior of the cell electrically negative with respect to the exterior. The resulting voltage difference across the membrane is called the "membrane potential".
These electric fields have been measured around cells and within embryos, and it turns out that they themselves are a form of information that can influence development. How so? Wells writes:
One way might be to direct cell movements. For over a century electrically guided locomotion, called "galvanotaxis," has been observed in cells from a variety of organisms in the presence of artificially applied electric fields. ... Applied electric fields can also affect neural networks. Nerve cells establish contact with each other by extending projections called neurites. When embryonic chick ganglia were placed in DC electric fields ranging from 70−140 mV/mm, their neurites grew faster toward the cathode than the anode. Embryonic Xenopus neurons reportedly do the same in fields as low as 7 mV/mm.
Wells further observes that "The most compelling evidence that ion currents, transmembrane voltage potentials and EEFs play significant roles in ontogeny comes from artificially disrupting them in vivo and then observing the effects of their disruption on morphogenesis."
Where Does the Information Come From?

After reviewing these sources of information, Wells concludes that they lie outside the control of DNA:

So membrane patterns -- the three-dimensional arrangements of membrane-associated proteins, lipids and carbohydrates, as they change over time -- carry essential ontogenetic information. Yet (as I demonstrate below) the information carried by membrane patterns cannot be reduced to sequence information in DNA, for at least two reasons. First, the vast majority of proteins in eukaryotes are not completely specified by DNA sequences. Second, even if DNA sequences completely specified all proteins, DNA would not specify their spatiotemporal arrangements in membranes.
As to the first point, Wells recognizes that various well-established processes like alternative splicing and RNA editing often determine the amino acid sequence of proteins. As to the second point, he observes:
Even if DNA sequences uniquely specified the molecular structures of proteins, DNA would not specify the spatial distribution of proteins in the plasma membrane. Some membrane patterns are templated by the membranes from which they are derived, with proteins from the cell interior being incorporated during membrane growth only if they match the existing matrix.
Indeed, Wells notes that these membranes are required for producing new membranes, and "If any type of genetic membrane were lost, it could probably not be regenerated from its constituent molecules -- even if all the genes encoding its proteins and lipid-synthesizing machinery remained -- because the requisite spatial pattern would be gone." So this is another crucial source of information that exists outside of the DNA.
What does all this mean for neo-Darwinism? For one thing, it shows that the central dogma is woefully incomplete:

Membrane patterns are not specified by DNA sequences. First, DNA sequences only partially specify RNAs and proteins. After transcription, many RNAs undergo alternative splicing and/or editing, so thousands of different mRNAs can be generated from a single DNA sequence. After translation, some proteins are edited to produce different amino acid sequences, and many proteins with similar amino acid sequences can adopt more than one folded structure -- or they are intrinsically disordered. Furthermore, most eukaryotic proteins are post-translationally modified by glycosylation. Given the enormous number of possible glycan structures, a protein can be modified in trillions of possible ways. If "makes" is taken to mean "specifies," then "DNA makes RNA makes protein" fails at each step.
Obviously, Wells isn't saying that DNA is unimportant:
Of course, no one denies that DNA is essential for ontogeny, and that DNA mutations can affect phenotypic traits. Furthermore, population genetics may be useful for tracing lineages within existing species. But since the ontogenetic information in an embryo far exceeds that in its DNA, evolution must necessarily involve far more than changes in gene frequencies.
However, population genetics -- the mathematical basis for modern neo-Darwinian theory -- is predicated upon the view that traits are encoded in DNA, and mutations in DNA produce new traits for natural selection to act upon. But since many traits aren't determined by DNA, mutations in DNA cannot produce those traits. The very basis of the theory falls apart. Wells explains:
As we have seen, however, the idea that embryo development is controlled by a genetic program is inconsistent with the biological evidence. Embryo development requires far more ontogenetic information than is carried by DNA sequences. Thus Neo-Darwinism is false.

http://www.evolutionnews.org/2014/06...p_2086201.html
Journal BIO-Complexity: Embryo development cannot arise by neo-Darwinism mechanisms Quote
06-05-2014 , 12:59 PM
Is this a joke? They (Bio Complexity journal) have published 17 paper in 4 years, and almost every paper author is a member of the journal's editorial board!

This is a far fry from "peer reviewed". This is academic fraud.
Journal BIO-Complexity: Embryo development cannot arise by neo-Darwinism mechanisms Quote
06-05-2014 , 01:06 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by tame_deuces
Is this a joke? They (Bio Complexity journal) have published 17 paper in 4 years, and almost every paper author is a member of the journal's editorial board!

This is a far fry from "peer reviewed". This is academic fraud.
How about addressing the actual content of the paper?
Journal BIO-Complexity: Embryo development cannot arise by neo-Darwinism mechanisms Quote
06-05-2014 , 01:26 PM
In the post I made that mentioned that mind is not derived from the brain, it wasn't a claim based in ignorance. With that fear study in mice and the growing interest in epigenetics, the build up is starting to happen.

Of course, the scientific method is limited when it comes to the mind and the non physical but at least some people are starting to question some of the foundational, materialistic assumptions that mainstream science and medicine is based on.
Journal BIO-Complexity: Embryo development cannot arise by neo-Darwinism mechanisms Quote
06-05-2014 , 03:19 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by festeringZit
How about addressing the actual content of the paper?
A journal run by an editorial board of well known creationists who publish almost exclusively their own articles can safely be ignored as academic fraud.

In fact you have a history of bashing any science you disagree with as worthless bias, as have the majority of your creationist peers. That you should now suddenly hold fast to a "scientific journal" and try to hide behind the fact that it is supposedly "peer reviewed science" is hypocritical to the extreme.

I am, however, not surprised.
Journal BIO-Complexity: Embryo development cannot arise by neo-Darwinism mechanisms Quote
06-05-2014 , 03:30 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by tame_deuces
A journal run by an editorial board of well known creationists who publish almost exclusively their own articles can safely be ignored as academic fraud.

In fact you have a history of bashing any science you disagree with as worthless bias, as have the majority of your creationist peers. That you should now suddenly hold fast to a "scientific journal" and try to hide behind the fact that it is supposedly "peer reviewed science" is hypocritical to the extreme.

I am, however, not surprised.
I'm not surprised that you chose an ad hominem attack instead of addressing the content of the paper. I could have predicted it.
Journal BIO-Complexity: Embryo development cannot arise by neo-Darwinism mechanisms Quote
06-05-2014 , 03:31 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by festeringZit
How about addressing the actual content of the paper?
Quote:
Originally Posted by festeringZit
I'm not surprised that you chose an ad hominem attack instead of addressing the content of the paper. I could have predicted it.
Why bother making a point about it being "peer reviewed" if you want to focus on the content?

You're trying to have it both ways. You want credibility based on peer-review, but when peer-review is questioned you want to focus on the quality of the content on its own. If you could not put this forth as a peer-reviewed publication, would there be a sufficient reason to give this paper serious consideration?
Journal BIO-Complexity: Embryo development cannot arise by neo-Darwinism mechanisms Quote
06-05-2014 , 03:32 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aaron W.
Why bother making a point about it being "peer reviewed" if you want to focus on the content?

You're trying to have it both ways. You want credibility based on peer-review, but when peer-review is questioned you want to focus on the quality of the content on its own.
I didn't, that statement was part of the original article.
Journal BIO-Complexity: Embryo development cannot arise by neo-Darwinism mechanisms Quote
06-05-2014 , 03:36 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by festeringZit
I didn't, that statement was part of the original article.
The point stands. You brought this article into consideration, and the article is using peer-review as a way of giving credibility to what follows. In the absence of such credibility, is there a sufficient reason for anyone to give serious consideration to the contents of the article?
Journal BIO-Complexity: Embryo development cannot arise by neo-Darwinism mechanisms Quote
06-05-2014 , 03:46 PM
Also, why isn't this thread in SMP?
Journal BIO-Complexity: Embryo development cannot arise by neo-Darwinism mechanisms Quote
06-05-2014 , 07:26 PM
On a more serious note - because the suggested topic is silly - is 'neo-Darwinist' a real term or just an intended slight conjured up by creationists who find facts offensive?
Journal BIO-Complexity: Embryo development cannot arise by neo-Darwinism mechanisms Quote
06-05-2014 , 07:47 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by WereBeer
On a more serious note - because the suggested topic is silly - is 'neo-Darwinist' a real term or just an intended slight conjured up by creationists who find facts offensive?
Oh man, you caught the creationist bogey-man hiding in the shadows.

ROFL.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neo-Darwinism
Journal BIO-Complexity: Embryo development cannot arise by neo-Darwinism mechanisms Quote
06-06-2014 , 02:57 AM
The conclusion noted has been acknowledged for a long time, but it does not mean that the general theory is wrong - simply that there is more to the theory than remains currently known. This is the case with almost every accepted theory, including the medical Germ Theory of Disease.

In your WikiLink provided it also states that the use of the term neo-darwinism is wrong for this very reason:

Following the development, from about 1937 to 1950, of the modern evolutionary synthesis, now generally referred to as the synthetic view of evolution or the modern synthesis, the term neo-Darwinian is often used to refer to contemporary evolutionary theory.[7] However, such usage has been described by some as incorrect;[1][4][8] with Ernst Mayr writing in 1984:

"...the term neo-Darwinism for the synthetic theory is wrong, because the term neo-Darwinism was coined by Romanes in 1895 as a designation of Weismann's theory."[9]


As such, the conclusions of this pseudo-scientific paper add nothing more to the literature whatsoever, but simply point out what's already known:

"since the ontogenetic information in an embryo far exceeds that in its DNA, evolution must necessarily involve far more than changes in gene frequencies." - Wells, Jonathan.

To conclude that the entire theory is wrong is a gross extrapolation and such an argument will require far more than simply pointing out what biologists already know.
Journal BIO-Complexity: Embryo development cannot arise by neo-Darwinism mechanisms Quote
06-06-2014 , 03:20 AM
If the source isn't credible, the content doesn't need to be dealt with. That's why we don't need a "Weekly World News Containment Thread" in RGT.
Journal BIO-Complexity: Embryo development cannot arise by neo-Darwinism mechanisms Quote
06-06-2014 , 04:52 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by starvingwriter82
If the source isn't credible, the content doesn't need to be dealt with. That's why we don't need a "Weekly World News Containment Thread" in RGT.
The content (or arguments) must always be dealt with. Ad hominem-type dismissals of knowledge are a tool in the arsenal of creationists, not those of us who know better. You do not dismiss knowledge, regardless of its source. Rather, you put it to the test and set the example you want to see in the world - its the best thing you can do; provided you care enough.

Last edited by VeeDDzz`; 06-06-2014 at 05:10 AM.
Journal BIO-Complexity: Embryo development cannot arise by neo-Darwinism mechanisms Quote
06-06-2014 , 05:18 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by VeeDDzz`
The content (or arguments) must always be dealt with. Ad hominem-type dismissals of knowledge are a tool in the arsenal of creationists, not those of us who know better. You do not dismiss knowledge, regardless of its source. Rather, you put it to the test and set the example you want to see in the world - its the best thing you can do.

...provided you care enough, to set an example.
It's a nice principle on paper, but there is really to much nonsense in the world not to have some filters on. If a paper tries to cloak itself in scientific integrity and give pretense of credibility, I have no problems dismissing it when these claims are revealed to be fraudulent. Behavior tends to repeat itself.

There are millions of people who write solid texts without resorting to deceit, and I would rather use my limited time on them.
Journal BIO-Complexity: Embryo development cannot arise by neo-Darwinism mechanisms Quote
06-06-2014 , 05:23 AM
agree with tame_deuces, if a paper is worthy of consideration then consider it and address it but if it's claim to be peer reviewed is seen to be fraudulent there's enough we can infer from that to dismiss it.
Journal BIO-Complexity: Embryo development cannot arise by neo-Darwinism mechanisms Quote
06-06-2014 , 06:22 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by VeeDDzz`
The content (or arguments) must always be dealt with. Ad hominem-type dismissals of knowledge are a tool in the arsenal of creationists, not those of us who know better. You do not dismiss knowledge, regardless of its source. Rather, you put it to the test and set the example you want to see in the world - its the best thing you can do; provided you care enough.
If you could please read the following carefully and, if you believe it not to be true, do a point by point rebuttal of all the facts, please. Please research each point and provide sources if you disagree with anything provided. I have it on good authority that everything here is 100% true, and this article has been printed in my peer reviewed journal, PPGAF* Magazine.

Quote:
Bat Boy is a creature who made several appearances in the defunct American supermarket tabloid Weekly World News. The Weekly World News published patently fabricated stories which were purported to be factual. Within the pages of the paper, Bat Boy is described as a creature who is 'half human and half bat'. His pursuers, according to Weekly World News, are scientists and United States government officials; he is frequently captured, then later makes a daring escape. The original scientist who found him was named Dr. Bob Dillon. Matthew Daemon, S.O.S. (Seeker of Obscure Supernaturals) crossed paths with him on several occasions.

Bat Boy was discovered by former Weekly World News Editor Dick Kulpa. He debuted as a cover story on June 23, 1992. The original front-page photo of Bat Boy, showing his grotesque screaming face, was the second-best selling issue in the tabloid's history, and he has since evolved into a pop-culture icon. He became the tabloid's de facto mascot of sorts. The story of Bat Boy was turned into an Off-Broadway musical, Bat Boy: The Musical.


background[edit]
According to Weekly World News, Bat Boy has a chaotic sense of morality. He has been said to steal cars and not to come to the aid of the needy. According to the mythos, the only person who cares about the chiropteran child is Dr. Bob Dillon, who discovered him in a West Virginia cave (Hellhole Cave in Pendleton County, WV). Origins of Bat Boy are sometimes credited to being in Endless Caverns in Greenbrier County, West Virginia. The original Weekly World News article lists "Hellhole Cave in the Allegheny Mountains of West Virginia". At the time of capture, he was two feet tall and weighed nineteen pounds. By February 2001, he was 2' 6". In 2004, he was five feet tall and his weight was unknown. He sheds his wings every three years, and regenerates a new pair.[1]
On February 27, 2001, the Weekly World News published a story that he attacked a fifth-grader at a park in Orlando, Florida. According to the article, the girl was nearly ripped to shreds.[2] The next day, he endorsed presidential candidate Al Gore.[3]
On August 14, 2003, WWN reported he was running in the California gubernatorial election.[4]
In October 2006, Weekly World News posted a video of Bat Boy "captured" on film riding on top of a New York City subway car. Bat Boy was said to be living in the subway system's tunnels during this time. This story was converted into a "documentary" video on the Weekly World News web site.[5]
In October 2008, Bat Boy supposedly endorsed John McCain but switched to Barack Obama soon after.[6]
In November 2008, Bat Boy was allegedly seen protesting the passing of Proposition 8.[7]

Genealogy[edit]
According to the Weekly World News, the discovery of Bat Boy's family tree on a genealogy chart recently "stunned" evolutionary scientists who used to think the famed imp was a pitiful, one-of-a-kind mutant - but now believe he belongs to a race of creatures who have interacted with humans for at least 400 years. In the tabloid's account, the chart itself was written on vellum and found in the same Ozark Mountains cave where Dr. Ron Dillon, a biologist, rescued Bat Boy after he was trapped by a falling rock in 1992 (it should be noted, however, that the Ozark Mountains are nowhere near West Virginia). Carbon dating supposedly revealed the chart to be over a hundred years old.
Name Lifespan Alleged background
Artemis "Pip" Boee 1591-1622 Little is known of his life. Arrived in the New World days after the landing of the Mayflower at Plymouth Rock on the lesser known vessel, The June Bug. Was a successful jet airliner conductor of the underground railroad.
Charles Alexander "Cotton" Boee 1612-1691 The son of Artemis, he was a prosperous farmer in Massachusetts.
John "Little Cotton Joe Bundy" Boee 1658-1722 The deeply religious firstborn of Charles who was devoted to his wife Rebecca. It is noted that her own birth was hard and long, resulting in slightly elongated ears.
Susannah Boee 1661-1692 John and Rebecca's daughter; she gave birth to two children, Alexander and David. The townspeople, perhaps frightened by her pointy ears, accused the woman of "consorting with Satan" during the Salem witch trials. She was burned at the stake; however, her children were not (In reality none of the victims of the Salem witch trials were burned at the stake).
Alexander Boee 1679-1769 The shortest family member on record, standing at thirteen inches tall. Remembered for having changed the spelling of his last name to "Boie" ("because he wanted people to think he was French").
David Boee 1682-1776 The younger brother of Alexander Boee. He is revered as the oldest soldier to fight for American independence. He was killed the day the British surrendered. He will be remembered by his one hit wonder "magic pants dance."
Catherine Boie 1735-1815 Alexander's daughter who was best known for her work with wildlife. She studied animals and kept many unusual species as pets, including bats. Her oldest child, Andrew, was fascinated with the nocturnal critters but became a gourmet chef.
Andrew Jackson Boie 1785-1866 Made delicious meals out of nocturnal creatures, but soon became a cannibal and ate his ears.

Rodney Boe 1787-1869 Was Catherine's youngest child, an inattentive speller who inadvertently dropped the "i" from the family name. Family friends presume Rodney's poor scholarship was an attempt to focus attention on his smarter siblings, to divert eyes from his short stature, oversized eyes and pointed ears.

Archibald Boe 1825-1911 Rodney's firstborn, he left the family's ancestral home in Massachusetts and moved to California, where people were "more tolerant" of unusual looking people.

Marcus Boe 1875-1930 Eldest son of Archibald, he established himself as respected "bug man" with a successful exterminating business. There were rumors that he did not use flypaper or traps, but caught them with his mouth.

Horace "Joe Ears" Boe 1890-1931 Archibald's youngest son who left California at age thirteen, hopping an eastbound train to Chicago. Horace was shot dead in a shootout with famed federal agent Eliot Ness in 1931.

Margaret Boy 1910-1983 Horace's only child. She dropped the "e" from the family name and added a "y" so people would not associate her with her mobster dad. She left Chicago and moved to West Virginia.
Herbert Hoover Boy 1944-1972 Worked in the coal mines of West Virginia as a child of 12, not of financial need, but because he liked caves and the job.

Susan Boy 1954-? Herbert Sr.'s daughter. She achieved regional success as a country singer with a persona that has been likened to that of mountain songbird Dolly Parton. Susan's liaisons with an unnamed country legend produced two children: Ruth Carter Cash Boy and "the one they call Bat".
Ruth Carter Cash Boy 1972-? "a quick learner who was able to quit school after the sixth grade." She now lives in Wayne, West Virginia, Wayne Middle School.
Bat Boy 1982-? The brother of Ruth Carter Cash Boy. He is a decorated U.S. Marine who has confounded the authorities by stealing cars and biting children after serving his country as a "super patriot" on the front lines in Afghanistan and Iraq. He now wanders the wastelands of Jamaica searching for Hippopotamus droppings to sell on the white market.

Adventures of Batboy[edit]
Cartoonist Peter Bagge originally penned the "Misadventures of Flapjack" for the Weekly World News. According to the cartoon, Bat Boy is currently hitchhiking with a typical American family after resigning from being the President of the United States (and King), has placed Weekly World News columnist Ed Anger under arrest and saying goodbyes to Beyoncé Knowles, a half sasquatch (with whom he was romantically involved), and Dr. Ron.

According to past issues of WWN, Bat Boy has joined a death metal/thrash metal band as their lead singer. On a side note if ever spotted offer him eggs and he won't suck your blood through a crazy straw.
On 2006-01-16, artist Danielle Corsetto of Girls with Slingshots took over for Peter Bagge on the weekly strip.

A musical based on the Bat Boy character premiered at Tim Robbins' Actors Gang Theatre on Halloween, 1997 and has since been produced Off Broadway, in London's West End, and in scores of productions throughout the world. Music and lyrics are by Laurence O'Keefe, with a book by Brian Flemming and Keythe Farley.
Since I have sources for my information, I insist that you cite sources if you have any counter arguments for the validity of this content.

*(PPGAF of course stands for Please Please Give a **** Magazine.)
Journal BIO-Complexity: Embryo development cannot arise by neo-Darwinism mechanisms Quote
06-06-2014 , 10:39 AM
Meh. I doubt any university journal is rushing out there to publish creationist literature, no matter how groundbreaking or thorough. I don't blame them for erecting their own little thing.

Just because they can't join your club, doesn't mean they have nothing to say.
Journal BIO-Complexity: Embryo development cannot arise by neo-Darwinism mechanisms Quote
06-06-2014 , 10:46 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Doggg
Meh. I doubt any university journal is rushing out there to publish creationist literature, no matter how groundbreaking or thorough. I don't blame them for erecting their own little thing.

Just because they can't join your club, doesn't mean they have nothing to say.
If you need to say "peer reviewed" twice in the first two lines to have credibility, but that process seems fraudulent, you would do better to not mention the peer review process at all and stick with the straight content.

There are hundreds of journals where you can publish papers. They may not all be prestigious, top notch journals, but they're out there. If your work cannot get published in any of those and you need to create your own journal to publish, that's a strong sign of poor scholarship.
Journal BIO-Complexity: Embryo development cannot arise by neo-Darwinism mechanisms Quote
06-06-2014 , 10:59 AM
Written by the author of the "Journal" article.

http://www.tparents.org/library/unif...lls/DARWIN.htm

Quote:
At the end of the Washington Monument rally in September, 1976, I was admitted to the second entering class at Unification Theological Seminary. During the next two years, I took a long prayer walk every evening. I asked God what He wanted me to do with my life, and the answer came not only through my prayers, but also through Father's many talks to us, and through my studies. Father encouraged us to set our sights high and accomplish great things.

He also spoke out against the evils in the world; among them, he frequently criticized Darwin's theory that living things originated without God's purposeful, creative activity. My studies included modern theologians who took Darwinism for granted and thus saw no room for God's involvement in nature or history; in the process, they re- interpreted the fall, the incarnation, and even God as products of human imagination.

Father's words, my studies, and my prayers convinced me that I should devote my life to destroying Darwinism, just as many of my fellow Unificationists had already devoted their lives to destroying Marxism. When Father chose me (along with about a dozen other seminary graduates) to enter a Ph.D. program in 1978, I welcomed the opportunity to prepare myself for battle.
One would say that this is not a particularly open-minded approach to a subject, and that such a predisposition can cast doubts to the quality of the scholarship.

For more about the author:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jonatha...esign_advocate)
Journal BIO-Complexity: Embryo development cannot arise by neo-Darwinism mechanisms Quote
06-06-2014 , 11:17 AM
But if you want to be a stickler about it, you can't claim that this paper isn't "peer-reviewed." Which is why you are calling it fraudulent to begin with.

I submit a paper to my peers. They review, vet and publish.

I would also make the claim that any paper submitted by a creationist is more likely to be carefully and thoughtfully constructed. The journals are just credential mills, anyway. Nobody reads them. A creationist's paper will be heavily scrutinized, and he knows it as he does the work. Meanwhile, the majority of university-level papers will go unread, lost forever and only referenced on the back-end of a C.V. No fanfare. No bloggers are likely to tear it up publicly. No stir.

Maybe I am wrong. I don't claim to be an expert on the subject, and I am just aping the criticism leveled at the system by different bloggers and critics I have read who have mocked the system openly by writing up jibberish and getting it published and who run reproducibility and fact-checking projects on journal research. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peer_re...of_peer_review

I mean, where does a creation scientist find his peers, anyway?
Journal BIO-Complexity: Embryo development cannot arise by neo-Darwinism mechanisms Quote
06-06-2014 , 12:57 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Doggg
But if you want to be a stickler about it, you can't claim that this paper isn't "peer-reviewed." Which is why you are calling it fraudulent to begin with.

I submit a paper to my peers. They review, vet and publish.

I would also make the claim that any paper submitted by a creationist is more likely to be carefully and thoughtfully constructed. The journals are just credential mills, anyway. Nobody reads them. A creationist's paper will be heavily scrutinized, and he knows it as he does the work. Meanwhile, the majority of university-level papers will go unread, lost forever and only referenced on the back-end of a C.V. No fanfare. No bloggers are likely to tear it up publicly. No stir.

Maybe I am wrong. I don't claim to be an expert on the subject, and I am just aping the criticism leveled at the system by different bloggers and critics I have read who have mocked the system openly by writing up jibberish and getting it published and who run reproducibility and fact-checking projects on journal research. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peer_re...of_peer_review

I mean, where does a creation scientist find his peers, anyway?
Your concept of peer-review is lacking context. A third-grader can write a paper on what he did this summer, and his friend can check it and agree that he did those things this summer. By the broadest interpretation, that's "peer review." But nobody would really call it a peer-reviewed paper.

There are problems with peer review, and I've raised them myself. It can be political sometimes (someone writes a paper that has a perspective counter to the reviewer), there are biases (there was a study that showed that gender bias in peer review), the inability to replicate data (a severe flaw of the system because it allows fraud)... Peer-reviewed doesn't mean that it's somehow flawless or perfect. But it does mean something, and means a specific something. And that specific something is not what you've portrayed above.

My primary objection is to the misuse of the label "peer-reviewed" in the context of this paper. If you have a biology paper and you want to represent it as "peer-reviewed" but in reality it probably was not exposed to people who aren't on the editorial board of the journal and that the author is also on that board... that's a big problem.
Journal BIO-Complexity: Embryo development cannot arise by neo-Darwinism mechanisms Quote
06-06-2014 , 03:10 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Doggg
I mean, where does a creation scientist find his peers, anyway?
Getting something peer reviewed doesn't mean showing the paper to people who agree with your position and then sending it off to print.

I suggest you google "how does peer review work?" or similar.
Journal BIO-Complexity: Embryo development cannot arise by neo-Darwinism mechanisms Quote
06-06-2014 , 03:22 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by starvingwriter82
Getting something peer reviewed doesn't mean showing the paper to people who agree with your position and then sending it off to print.

I suggest you google "how does peer review work?" or similar.
I suggest you do more than skim, looking for something quotable.
Journal BIO-Complexity: Embryo development cannot arise by neo-Darwinism mechanisms Quote

      
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