Quote:
Originally Posted by BeaucoupFish
I expect I would have written a more thoughtful original response if I was responding to someone who was actually engaged, such as yourself.
That’s fair, my responses on here often differ depending on who I’m corresponding with.
Quote:
Originally Posted by BeaucoupFish
It is interesting that prophecies do not often come up in the more intellectual discussions. The last time I can remember there being a thread in RGT, it had little activity. What do you think of my comment that prophecy should have the potential to be an incredibly powerful argument, but it is neglected by almost all, bar the fundamentalists? Even Nostradamus' generic predictions come up more often than anything from the Bible!
Prophecies as proof of God run into the objections I already named, about the dates of the writings, but it’s also that differ with interpretation.
If you’re really interested, there are some
debates online where Jewish scholars argue with Christian ones about the prophecies that point to the Messiah. You’ll get a good sense for the debated viewpoints, one which accepts Christ, and one which rejects him.
Quote:
Originally Posted by BeaucoupFish
If you are up for it, I would be really keen to hear what your thoughts are on the Heaven (or Hell) question I outlined earlier: what have you thought about re: the experience of Heaven (or Hell). Is it a physical place, does it have a location? Just how would you describe it? I appreciate that it is only going to be guesswork. I doubt you think "streets of gold" is literal but if it is physical, are there any kinds of structure? Surely every Christian has spent time thinking about the most important event that can happen to them?
But it's just my curiosity, you don't have to answer if it makes you uncomfortable.
Heaven is a tough topic. Much of Christian theology is divided, and this topic is no different. Although, I haven't spent much time, if any, thinking about it. It may sound strange, but it's against my nature to be so optimistic and to contemplate a world where I'm at peace.
My understanding is that the Bible describes it as both physical and spiritual, whether this is simply to relate ideas which are foreign to us is arguable.
A couple of things that would point to it being physical is that for starters, the theme of the resurrection of our bodies, like that of Christ, is a very dominant theme. Paul refers to our bodies on earth as “tents”, and after the resurrection as “buildings”. It’s shown to be an upgrade, a temporary dwelling to a permanent one. There are many references to this type of transformation, which alludes to a physical change.
The other thing that a few writers speak about of a New Heaven, and New Earth. There are few reason to believe that these are spiritual not physical, especially considering that Revelations goes as far to giving dimensions.
Arguments for heaven being spiritual are also popular, including that God himself is described as a spiritual being. Also, there is nothing to stop someone from interpreting these physical references as mere allegory for us to understand something that is intangible. How else could we describe a place that is not physical if our language is inherently material?
If heaven exists, I think it’s pretty safe to assume that it is beyond our understanding, that “no mind can conceive” of it. What is stated explicitly is that there will no longer be sin and that we will see God as he is.
As for Hell, that’s probably even a more difficult subject than heaven. I spent a little time researching the different views, and have been enlightened by Edward Fudge, and his view on Conditionalism. The view surprisingly does have a lot of biblical support, but is not without problems. The main one being the verse in Revelations which describes torment.
Again, what is explicitly stated is that Hell is a separation from God.
Last edited by Naked_Rectitude; 05-25-2015 at 06:37 PM.