High Content thread. Is belief a choice?

[Splendour]

Originally Posted by checkm8

There is some choice in what you believe but mostly I believe it is dictated by the persons intelligence.

Smart people ask questions and dumb people want answers. Why? Its so much easier to want answers instead of asking questions.

A senseless statement.

Why ask questions if answers aren't important? As is the source of the answers.

[checkm8]

Originally Posted by Arouet

Smart people are often the most easily fooled. See Michael Shermer's Why People Believe Weird things.

Intelligence does not make one immune.

Smart people are not often the most easily fooled.. You think it would be easier to fool someone dumber or smarter than yourself? You need not respond, I know your actual answer if you're a rational human.

Intelligence definitely doesn't make one immune, but it decreases the chances of being fooled, so I disagree.

[Splendour]

I voted no though it might be both yes and no.

But I think the question "Is belief in God or belief in general a choice?" is a misleading question.

[kurto]

Originally Posted by Splendour

I voted no though it might be both yes and no.

But I think the question "Is belief in God or belief in general a choice?" is a misleading question.

its actually two questions but not misleading.

[batair]

I just wanted to allow for the discussion of how belief in general works, along with belief in God.

[Splendour]

Originally Posted by batair

I just wanted to allow for the discussion of how belief in general works, along with belief in God.

But it's misleading because you only asked from one perspective: man's. You didn't ask for God's.

And yes a yes or no is both possible since we have to interpret what God says about it. Just like when you try to think what an opponent is thinking...he could be thinking one of two ways on the question you have in mind.

[Arouet]

Originally Posted by checkm8

Smart people are not often the most easily fooled.. You think it would be easier to fool someone dumber or smarter than yourself? You need not respond, I know your actual answer if you're a rational human.

Intelligence definitely doesn't make one immune, but it decreases the chances of being fooled, so I disagree.

Why Smart People Believe Weird things

[batair]

Originally Posted by Splendour

But it's misleading because you only asked from one perspective: man's. You didn't ask for God's.

No ones stopping him form posting itt, he can put his .02 in if he wants to. Or if others want to speak for him they can.

And yes a yes or no is both possible since we have to interpret what God says about it. Just like when you try to think what an opponent is thinking...he could be thinking one of two ways on the question you have in mind.

Thats why i included kind of in my poll. If you think its both yes and no feel free to add some HC to the thread on why its yes and no.

[Splendour]

Originally Posted by batair

No ones stopping him, he can put his .02 in if he wants to. Or if others want to speak for him they can.


Thats why i included kind of in my poll. If you think its both yes and no feel free to add some HC to the thread on why its yes and no.

Well I'll give you my current take (subject to future modification if I re-think things).

God is the best reader in the world. He reads hearts and minds. On top of that he tries them.

So I believe he gives belief when he thinks you're ready to handle it.

Now you'll say "but that's not fair".

But of course it's fair. He gives you an enormous winning out you can play at any time (That is if you're aware you're holding the out). The out is repentance.

See this verse: "And you, my son Solomon, acknowledge the God of your father, and serve him with wholehearted devotion and with a willing mind, for the LORD searches every heart and understands every motive behind the thoughts."

Doesn't this verse contain advice? You can choose not to take the advice but God tries to precondition the family setting so you won't since it's good advice.

[checkm8]

Originally Posted by Arouet

Why Smart People Believe Weird things

I actually watched the TED video before I posted but didn't read this, I'll give it a go and respond again..

[kurto]

Originally Posted by Splendour

But it's misleading because you only asked from one perspective: man's. You didn't ask for God's.

And yes a yes or no is both possible since we have to interpret what God says about it. Just like when you try to think what an opponent is thinking...he could be thinking one of two ways on the question you have in mind.

I don't see how this is relevent. The question is entirely meant to be from man's perspective because it is about his ability (or not) to choose his beliefs.

Also- to restate your response with another example to demonstrate the silliness-

Question- I just wanted to allow for the discussion of how belief in general works, along with belief in Unicorns.

Splendour- But it's misleading because you only asked from one perspective: man's. You didn't ask for the Unicorn's perspective.

that doesn't make any sense.

[tame_deuces]

Originally Posted by Arouet

Why Smart People Believe Weird things

There is a distinction to be made...I don't think smart people are fooled more often, however...when a smart person IS fooled the consequences are much, much worse.

I recall a debate I had with a childhood friend of mine and undoubtedly also a very intelligent man, and he firmly believed that the Holocaust never happened...he is also I suspect a convinced nazist...but he would never admit this openly (because he is smart), and maybe he doesn't really think of himself as "one of the nazis" anyway - but more an intellectual descendant who sees things in a perspective they never realized.

Now...I should explain at this point that he does have anxiety and light touches of paranoia, and an unhealthy use of alcohol and various other drugs...so I don't think he came about this belief because he is smart...rather because he is isolated and needs the world to be simple.

However...the problem is that is, at heart, he is an extremely smart person. Not only that - he is also well read, he does a lot of research, he is articulate, he is very meticulous...at high school he was always a top grade student due to his diligence and ability to digest enormous amounts of material in a short time. He didn't take any higher education due to his problems, but really he has all the qualities of a skilled academic.

So then comes the problem...he can with extremely skill defend the position that the Holocaust never happened. He knows historians better than most people who debates him, he knows logic better than them, he can name dates, people and whatnot. He never indulges in "cheap" propaganda of the type "jews made it up"...because he knows this would destroy his own argument. In short; he displays all the qualities of a good debater and superficially he seemingly possesses all the traits of a seemingly "neutral" historian.

Now...his case is ofcourse all shambles...because most of us realize that there simply isn't enough competency in the world to conspire up something of the magnitude of the holocaust....but you will never reach him because he is clever enough to destroy all your arguments...and stubborn enough to ignore their combined impact. So...for us the only option is to ignore him...however...in his "clique" of people (internet-wise) he becomes almost prophetic.

Tricky.

[Arouet]

Yeah, my point wasn't really that smart people are MORE likely to believe weird things (perhaps my wording was poor) but simply that being smart in no way assures one of not believing such things.

It's not about just about intelligence - and someone believing something false does not necessarily make them stupid.

[Splendour]

Originally Posted by Arouet

Why Smart People Believe Weird things

Imo Shermer makes the same mistake that a lot of proponents of free will make.

They both assume the human mind is capable of solving the belief problem and don't take into account they may not have all the information or that their may be exceptions.

You can study the bible and it shows both an Arminian bias and a Reformed one. Why is that?

[Arouet]

I'm not sure what your point is. Pretty sure Shermer appreciates that we form beliefs based on incomplete information.